Serbian Autosomal DNA

**vbnetkhio** · 01-29-2020, 02:24 PM

Originally Posted by Bosniensis

A lot of Slavic population has died, and they were city dwellers.

i think there wasn't that much dying, they either convered to Islam, or fled to Croatia, Hungary or the Montenegrin mountains.

**vbnetkhio** · 01-29-2020, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by Pribislav

Hungry Lion on few other Banija Serbs whose results I have seen shifted significant more northern than Serbian average, and mixing between Serbs and Croatians on Banija was extremely rare.
On the other hand guy from Vrlika in Dalmatia who is half Serb half Croatian is pretty more southern shifted than these Banija Serbs. He is more southern even than Aye's dad (full Dalmatian Serb) and one Serb from Šibenik.

did you see these results? these 2 Dalmatian Serbs pass as South Montenegrins.

Code:

Admix Results (sorted):

#	Population	Percent
1	Baltic	26.59
2	North_Atlantic	25.26
3	West_Med	16.22
4	East_Med	15.21
5	West_Asian	12.45
6	Red_Sea	1.22
7	East_Asian	1.17
8	Siberian	1.13
9	Amerindian	0.77

Single Population Sharing:

#	Population (source)	Distance
1	Serbian	3.64
2	Romanian	3.68
3	Bulgarian	6.02
4	Moldavian	8.04
5	Hungarian	10.35
6	Croatian	10.87
7	Austrian	13.31
8	Greek_Thessaly	14.58
9	East_German	15.05
10	Ukrainian_Lviv	17.22
11	West_German	17.74
12	North_Italian	17.76
13	South_Polish	17.83
14	Ukrainian	18.52
15	Tuscan	18.73
16	French	19.08
17	South_Dutch	19.34
18	Italian_Abruzzo	20.04
19	Central_Greek	21.17
20	Polish	21.52

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

#	 	Primary Population (source)	Secondary Population (source)	Distance
1	 	92%	Serbian	+	8%	Balkar	@	1.85
2	 	91.9%	Serbian	+	8.1%	Kabardin	@	1.91
3	 	92.6%	Serbian	+	7.4%	North_Ossetian	@	1.92
4	 	92.8%	Serbian	+	7.2%	Ossetian	@	1.98
5	 	92.4%	Serbian	+	7.6%	Adygei	@	2
6	 	94%	Serbian	+	6%	Abhkasian	@	2.09
7	 	92.2%	Serbian	+	7.8%	Chechen	@	2.09
8	 	91.8%	Serbian	+	8.2%	Kumyk	@	2.1
9	 	93.7%	Serbian	+	6.3%	Georgian	@	2.14
10	 	72.5%	Romanian	+	27.5%	Moldavian	@	2.23
11	 	92.6%	Serbian	+	7.4%	Lezgin	@	2.23
12	 	92.6%	Serbian	+	7.4%	Tabassaran	@	2.28
13	 	86%	Romanian	+	14%	South_Polish	@	2.31
14	 	91.7%	Serbian	+	8.3%	Nogay	@	2.31
15	 	85.6%	Romanian	+	14.4%	Ukrainian_Lviv	@	2.31
16	 	88.3%	Romanian	+	11.7%	Ukrainian_Belgorod	@	2.32
17	 	86.6%	Romanian	+	13.4%	Ukrainian	@	2.33
18	 	79%	Romanian	+	21%	Croatian	@	2.37
19	 	88.4%	Romanian	+	11.6%	Polish	@	2.38
20	 	90.1%	Romanian	+	9.9%	Kargopol_Russian	@	2.4

Code:

Admix Results (sorted):

#	Population	Percent
1	North_Atlantic	27.24
2	Baltic	25.78
3	West_Med	17.76
4	East_Med	15.03
5	West_Asian	10.65
6	Siberian	1.68
7	Oceanian	0.78
8	Red_Sea	0.72
9	Northeast_African	0.25
10	Amerindian	0.11

Single Population Sharing:

#	Population (source)	Distance
1	Serbian	3.28
2	Romanian	4.31
3	Bulgarian	6.99
4	Moldavian	8.88
5	Hungarian	9.76
6	Croatian	11.15
7	Austrian	11.95
8	East_German	13.83
9	Greek_Thessaly	14.79
10	North_Italian	15.82
11	West_German	15.83
12	French	16.77
13	South_Dutch	17.36
14	Tuscan	17.53
15	Ukrainian_Lviv	17.65
16	South_Polish	17.98
17	Ukrainian	18.9
18	Portuguese	19.15
19	Spanish_Galicia	19.56
20	Spanish_Cataluna	19.97

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

#	 	Primary Population (source)	Secondary Population (source)	Distance
1	 	78.9%	Romanian	+	21.1%	East_German	@	2.3
2	 	64%	Bulgarian	+	36%	Austrian	@	2.31
3	 	76.4%	Romanian	+	23.6%	Austrian	@	2.33
4	 	67.5%	Bulgarian	+	32.5%	East_German	@	2.38
5	 	87.3%	Romanian	+	12.7%	Swedish	@	2.5
6	 	78.6%	Bulgarian	+	21.4%	Swedish	@	2.51
7	 	87.4%	Romanian	+	12.6%	North_Swedish	@	2.58
8	 	88%	Romanian	+	12%	Norwegian	@	2.59
9	 	87.7%	Romanian	+	12.3%	Orcadian	@	2.61
10	 	79.5%	Bulgarian	+	20.5%	Norwegian	@	2.65
11	 	87.4%	Romanian	+	12.6%	North_Dutch	@	2.66
12	 	88.3%	Romanian	+	11.7%	Irish	@	2.69
13	 	88%	Romanian	+	12%	Southwest_English	@	2.69
14	 	86.2%	Romanian	+	13.8%	North_German	@	2.7
15	 	87.5%	Romanian	+	12.5%	Danish	@	2.7
16	 	95.5%	Serbian	+	4.5%	Sardinian	@	2.7
17	 	87.3%	Romanian	+	12.7%	Southeast_English	@	2.73
18	 	88.7%	Romanian	+	11.3%	West_Scottish	@	2.73
19	 	73.8%	Romanian	+	26.2%	Hungarian	@	2.73
20	 	79.1%	Bulgarian	+	20.9%	Orcadian	@	2.76

**~~ixulescu~~** · 01-29-2020, 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by Leto

I've never been a Nordicist but that's beside the point. Sometimes you have to choose the lesser evil. Unless you support a Gypsy holocaust, there are two options available - either you allow them to breed further or you dilute them ethnoracially losing some of your whiteness as a result. At least they are Serbian Orthodox over there in Serbia, not Mudslime.Russian Gypsies are virtually the same as Balkan since all European Roma have Balkan origin.

This makes no sense.
It's like saying: all Blacks in Europe have Greek or Italian origin because they've migrated through these countries.

But I agree with you that fast and complete assimilation of gypsies is the only solution. The more this process is delayed the larger the gypsification of the country will be.

**Leto** · 01-29-2020, 05:49 PM

Originally Posted by ixulescu

This makes no sense.
It's like saying: all Blacks in Europe have Greek or Italian origin because they've migrated through these countries.

But I agree with you that fast and complete assimilation of gypsies is the only solution. The more this process is delayed the larger the gypsification of the country will be.

It does make sense though. Gypsies in Northeastern Europe came there from the South at some point. The Roma ethnicity seems to have formed in the Ottoman domain which is basically the Balkans.

**~~ixulescu~~** · 01-29-2020, 06:06 PM

Originally Posted by Leto

It does make sense though. Gypsies in Northeastern Europe came there from the South at some point. The Roma ethnicity seems to have formed in the Ottoman domain which is basically the Balkans.

Nope, gypsy migration was well known before the Ottomans. For instance, the Romanian principalities took the laws related to gypsies from the Byzantines. These laws were established around 1000 AD. The Balkans was just a stepping stone in this migration route towards Europe.

**vbnetkhio** · 01-30-2020, 05:55 PM

all the samples divided into clusters

**Pribislav** · 01-30-2020, 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by vbnetkhio

did you see these results? these 2 Dalmatian Serbs pass as South Montenegrins.

Code:

Admix Results (sorted):

#	Population	Percent
1	Baltic	26.59
2	North_Atlantic	25.26
3	West_Med	16.22
4	East_Med	15.21
5	West_Asian	12.45
6	Red_Sea	1.22
7	East_Asian	1.17
8	Siberian	1.13
9	Amerindian	0.77

Single Population Sharing:

#	Population (source)	Distance
1	Serbian	3.64
2	Romanian	3.68
3	Bulgarian	6.02
4	Moldavian	8.04
5	Hungarian	10.35
6	Croatian	10.87
7	Austrian	13.31
8	Greek_Thessaly	14.58
9	East_German	15.05
10	Ukrainian_Lviv	17.22
11	West_German	17.74
12	North_Italian	17.76
13	South_Polish	17.83
14	Ukrainian	18.52
15	Tuscan	18.73
16	French	19.08
17	South_Dutch	19.34
18	Italian_Abruzzo	20.04
19	Central_Greek	21.17
20	Polish	21.52

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

#	 	Primary Population (source)	Secondary Population (source)	Distance
1	 	92%	Serbian	+	8%	Balkar	@	1.85
2	 	91.9%	Serbian	+	8.1%	Kabardin	@	1.91
3	 	92.6%	Serbian	+	7.4%	North_Ossetian	@	1.92
4	 	92.8%	Serbian	+	7.2%	Ossetian	@	1.98
5	 	92.4%	Serbian	+	7.6%	Adygei	@	2
6	 	94%	Serbian	+	6%	Abhkasian	@	2.09
7	 	92.2%	Serbian	+	7.8%	Chechen	@	2.09
8	 	91.8%	Serbian	+	8.2%	Kumyk	@	2.1
9	 	93.7%	Serbian	+	6.3%	Georgian	@	2.14
10	 	72.5%	Romanian	+	27.5%	Moldavian	@	2.23
11	 	92.6%	Serbian	+	7.4%	Lezgin	@	2.23
12	 	92.6%	Serbian	+	7.4%	Tabassaran	@	2.28
13	 	86%	Romanian	+	14%	South_Polish	@	2.31
14	 	91.7%	Serbian	+	8.3%	Nogay	@	2.31
15	 	85.6%	Romanian	+	14.4%	Ukrainian_Lviv	@	2.31
16	 	88.3%	Romanian	+	11.7%	Ukrainian_Belgorod	@	2.32
17	 	86.6%	Romanian	+	13.4%	Ukrainian	@	2.33
18	 	79%	Romanian	+	21%	Croatian	@	2.37
19	 	88.4%	Romanian	+	11.6%	Polish	@	2.38
20	 	90.1%	Romanian	+	9.9%	Kargopol_Russian	@	2.4

Code:

Admix Results (sorted):

#	Population	Percent
1	North_Atlantic	27.24
2	Baltic	25.78
3	West_Med	17.76
4	East_Med	15.03
5	West_Asian	10.65
6	Siberian	1.68
7	Oceanian	0.78
8	Red_Sea	0.72
9	Northeast_African	0.25
10	Amerindian	0.11

Single Population Sharing:

#	Population (source)	Distance
1	Serbian	3.28
2	Romanian	4.31
3	Bulgarian	6.99
4	Moldavian	8.88
5	Hungarian	9.76
6	Croatian	11.15
7	Austrian	11.95
8	East_German	13.83
9	Greek_Thessaly	14.79
10	North_Italian	15.82
11	West_German	15.83
12	French	16.77
13	South_Dutch	17.36
14	Tuscan	17.53
15	Ukrainian_Lviv	17.65
16	South_Polish	17.98
17	Ukrainian	18.9
18	Portuguese	19.15
19	Spanish_Galicia	19.56
20	Spanish_Cataluna	19.97

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

#	 	Primary Population (source)	Secondary Population (source)	Distance
1	 	78.9%	Romanian	+	21.1%	East_German	@	2.3
2	 	64%	Bulgarian	+	36%	Austrian	@	2.31
3	 	76.4%	Romanian	+	23.6%	Austrian	@	2.33
4	 	67.5%	Bulgarian	+	32.5%	East_German	@	2.38
5	 	87.3%	Romanian	+	12.7%	Swedish	@	2.5
6	 	78.6%	Bulgarian	+	21.4%	Swedish	@	2.51
7	 	87.4%	Romanian	+	12.6%	North_Swedish	@	2.58
8	 	88%	Romanian	+	12%	Norwegian	@	2.59
9	 	87.7%	Romanian	+	12.3%	Orcadian	@	2.61
10	 	79.5%	Bulgarian	+	20.5%	Norwegian	@	2.65
11	 	87.4%	Romanian	+	12.6%	North_Dutch	@	2.66
12	 	88.3%	Romanian	+	11.7%	Irish	@	2.69
13	 	88%	Romanian	+	12%	Southwest_English	@	2.69
14	 	86.2%	Romanian	+	13.8%	North_German	@	2.7
15	 	87.5%	Romanian	+	12.5%	Danish	@	2.7
16	 	95.5%	Serbian	+	4.5%	Sardinian	@	2.7
17	 	87.3%	Romanian	+	12.7%	Southeast_English	@	2.73
18	 	88.7%	Romanian	+	11.3%	West_Scottish	@	2.73
19	 	73.8%	Romanian	+	26.2%	Hungarian	@	2.73
20	 	79.1%	Bulgarian	+	20.9%	Orcadian	@	2.76

Look like Zadar Croatians.

Montenegrins are rare 52-53% Baltic+NA like this ones.

**vbnetkhio** · 01-30-2020, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by Pribislav

Look like Zadar Croatians.

Montenegrins are rare 52-53% Baltic+NA like this ones.

they are around 50% usually, but Serbs are even higher.
remember this one from Plav and Cetinje posted by CommonSense, she is 27 and 25, just like the second one:

Code:

Admix Results (sorted):

#	Population	Percent
1	North_Atlantic	27.17
2	Baltic	25.94
3	East_Med	20.36
4	West_Med	19.07
5	West_Asian	5.13
6	Siberian	1.57
7	Red_Sea	0.39
8	Oceanian	0.37

Single Population Sharing:

#	Population (source)	Distance
1	Serbian	6.68
2	Romanian	6.84
3	Bulgarian	8.01
4	Moldavian	12.51
5	Hungarian	12.65
6	Greek_Thessaly	13.77
7	Croatian	13.97
8	North_Italian	14.7
9	Austrian	14.8
10	Tuscan	15.98
11	East_German	16.49
12	French	17.8
13	West_German	18
14	Portuguese	18.56
15	Spanish_Galicia	19.2
16	South_Dutch	19.35
17	Italian_Abruzzo	19.58
18	Spanish_Cataluna	19.61
19	West_Sicilian	20.01
20	Spanish_Extremadura	20.11

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

#	 	Primary Population (source)	Secondary Population (source)	Distance
1	 	62.9%	Tuscan	+	37.1%	Estonian_Polish	@	4.54
2	 	63.3%	Tuscan	+	36.7%	Belorussian	@	4.56
3	 	61.1%	Tuscan	+	38.9%	Southwest_Russian	@	4.66
4	 	67.1%	Tuscan	+	32.9%	Lithuanian	@	4.72
5	 	57.4%	Tuscan	+	42.6%	Ukrainian	@	4.8
6	 	63%	Tuscan	+	37%	Russian_Smolensk	@	5.08
7	 	66.4%	Tuscan	+	33.6%	Estonian	@	5.14
8	 	56.5%	Tuscan	+	43.5%	South_Polish	@	5.17
9	 	89.7%	Serbian	+	10.3%	Sardinian	@	5.19
10	 	60.8%	West_Sicilian	+	39.2%	Estonian	@	5.21
11	 	62%	Tuscan	+	38%	Ukrainian_Belgorod	@	5.27
12	 	60.8%	Tuscan	+	39.2%	Polish	@	5.37
13	 	53.9%	Croatian	+	46.1%	Tuscan	@	5.39
14	 	50.4%	West_Sicilian	+	49.6%	South_Polish	@	5.39
15	 	64.9%	Tuscan	+	35.1%	Kargopol_Russian	@	5.41
16	 	57.7%	West_Sicilian	+	42.3%	Belorussian	@	5.52
17	 	51.4%	West_Sicilian	+	48.6%	Ukrainian	@	5.52
18	 	56.6%	Tuscan	+	43.4%	Ukrainian_Lviv	@	5.56
19	 	80.2%	Serbian	+	19.8%	Tuscan	@	5.57
20	 	67.3%	Tuscan	+	32.7%	East_Finnish	@	5.58

btw, the surnames are Jaric and Djujic.

**Vožd** · 01-30-2020, 06:27 PM

Originally Posted by Bosniensis

A lot of Slavic population has died, and they were city dwellers.

I even suspect that most of muslims (Bosniaks) in Serbia in 1700-1800 were more slavic admixed, and they mostly moved to Turkey.

Mountain people (serbian villagers) were predominantly ex-romance villagers (vlachs) who had significantly less Baltic admixture.

It is true that Western Balkans has shifted more southwards due to influence of Ottoman Empire, Wars and Migrations.

Herzegovina was considered as Vlach center in western Balkan, but this region is core of Slavic I2a-Din hg.

**Pribislav** · 01-30-2020, 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by vbnetkhio

they are around 50% usually, but Serbs are even higher.
remember this one from Plav and Cetinje posted by CommonSense, she is 27 and 25, just like the second one:

Code:

Admix Results (sorted):

#	Population	Percent
1	North_Atlantic	27.17
2	Baltic	25.94
3	East_Med	20.36
4	West_Med	19.07
5	West_Asian	5.13
6	Siberian	1.57
7	Red_Sea	0.39
8	Oceanian	0.37

Single Population Sharing:

#	Population (source)	Distance
1	Serbian	6.68
2	Romanian	6.84
3	Bulgarian	8.01
4	Moldavian	12.51
5	Hungarian	12.65
6	Greek_Thessaly	13.77
7	Croatian	13.97
8	North_Italian	14.7
9	Austrian	14.8
10	Tuscan	15.98
11	East_German	16.49
12	French	17.8
13	West_German	18
14	Portuguese	18.56
15	Spanish_Galicia	19.2
16	South_Dutch	19.35
17	Italian_Abruzzo	19.58
18	Spanish_Cataluna	19.61
19	West_Sicilian	20.01
20	Spanish_Extremadura	20.11

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

#	 	Primary Population (source)	Secondary Population (source)	Distance
1	 	62.9%	Tuscan	+	37.1%	Estonian_Polish	@	4.54
2	 	63.3%	Tuscan	+	36.7%	Belorussian	@	4.56
3	 	61.1%	Tuscan	+	38.9%	Southwest_Russian	@	4.66
4	 	67.1%	Tuscan	+	32.9%	Lithuanian	@	4.72
5	 	57.4%	Tuscan	+	42.6%	Ukrainian	@	4.8
6	 	63%	Tuscan	+	37%	Russian_Smolensk	@	5.08
7	 	66.4%	Tuscan	+	33.6%	Estonian	@	5.14
8	 	56.5%	Tuscan	+	43.5%	South_Polish	@	5.17
9	 	89.7%	Serbian	+	10.3%	Sardinian	@	5.19
10	 	60.8%	West_Sicilian	+	39.2%	Estonian	@	5.21
11	 	62%	Tuscan	+	38%	Ukrainian_Belgorod	@	5.27
12	 	60.8%	Tuscan	+	39.2%	Polish	@	5.37
13	 	53.9%	Croatian	+	46.1%	Tuscan	@	5.39
14	 	50.4%	West_Sicilian	+	49.6%	South_Polish	@	5.39
15	 	64.9%	Tuscan	+	35.1%	Kargopol_Russian	@	5.41
16	 	57.7%	West_Sicilian	+	42.3%	Belorussian	@	5.52
17	 	51.4%	West_Sicilian	+	48.6%	Ukrainian	@	5.52
18	 	56.6%	Tuscan	+	43.4%	Ukrainian_Lviv	@	5.56
19	 	80.2%	Serbian	+	19.8%	Tuscan	@	5.57
20	 	67.3%	Tuscan	+	32.7%	East_Finnish	@	5.58

btw, the surnames are Jaric and Djujic.

Can you post K13 of Dalmatian Serb who is most norhwestern of D. Serbs on your K13 map. He is close to one Serb from W. Serbia.