So Celts were North Europeans after all?

[SharpFork]

The one from St. Gallen (Eastern Switzerland Germanic Canton) caught my attention as it is quite close to a modern Basque\Iberian.

Target: St_Gallen:SX20
Distance: 2.4222% / 0.02422226
76.0	Basque
12.2	Balto_Slavic_North
8.4	Greek_Albanian
3.4	Northwest_European

Distance to:	St_Gallen:SX20
0.03170147	Basque
0.03749692	Belgian_French
0.04818528	Iberian
0.06029530	Northwest_European
0.06161228	North_Sea_Germanic
0.06551486	Balkan
0.06631236	Central_European
0.07260614	Scando_Germanic
0.07360623	Greek_Albanian
0.08978597	Polish_Ukrainian
0.10511355	Sicilian_Maltese
0.11101468	Balto_Slavic_South
0.11142811	Balto_Slavic_North
0.13360026	Finnic
0.13925607	European_Jewish
0.15240539	West_Turkish
0.16469766	Circassian
0.17427253	Levant
0.17453272	Azeri
0.17547694	Armenian_Assyrian
0.18694591	Abkhasian_Georgian
0.19241452	Iranian
0.19742813	Tajik
0.21328751	Udmurt
0.21576389	Northeast_African

Can we stop talking about this Basque stuff without a reason? It looks like a North-East Spaniard or a South-West French and it's an outlier compared to the average, plus among the historical samples from Spain it's close to only 2 of them, for both of which we have good reason to believe they have Celtic admixture themselves.

[SharpFork]

anyway, you, as everyone here make the mistake to see Celts as a racial group instead of linguo-cultural which they really were, and as a linguocultural group they were originated from the same subclade with Italics, just like Germanics came from the same subclade with Balto-slavs

Most historical "linguo-cultural" groups correlated with genetic similarities to some extent, so expecting genetic similarities or expecting genetic shifts towards the origin population when the socio-linguistic situation changes isn't unwarranted.

[SharpFork]

How likely is it that North Europeans migrated out of modern Central Europe to populate scandinavia?I think it's a possible scenario.

I mean isn't that already confirmed considering the origins of Battle-Axe culture?

[SharpFork]

i mean, the ones you cited and the ones posted by brás garcias de mascarenhas are bronze age samples. there were no celts during the bronze age. clearly these iron age samples aren't descended from these basque-like bronze age people.

Again, how can't they be "basque"-like when the average Steppe admixture is 45%? Only 2 samples are under 35% and approach the kind of admixture Basques have.

[J. Ketch]

Bronze Age British/Irish averages, modern Insular Celtic averages, and potential Celts / Proto-Celts / Proto-Italo-Celts from Central Europe.

[Raizen]

Bronze Age British/Irish averages, modern Insular Celtic averages, and potential Celts / Proto-Celts / Proto-Italo-Celts from Central Europe.

again, these samples are not potential proto-celts, they still spoke some form of PIE. proto-celts are the ones posted by op

[J. Ketch]

again, these samples are not potential proto-celts, they still spoke some form of PIE. proto-celts are the ones posted by op

No they did not speak PIE in Bronze Age Western Europe. They'd have spoken some form of Proto-Italo-Celtic at least, if they spoke an IE language. The ones Token posted are supposed to be Iron Age, so not really Proto-Celts but actual Celts.

Here are the Aargau samples from the OP on the right, by comparison.

[Raizen]

No they did not speak PIE in Bronze Age Western Europe. They'd have spoken some form of Proto-Italo-Celtic at least, if they spoke an IE language. The ones Token posted are supposed to be Iron Age, so not really Proto-Celts but actual Celts.

Here are the Aargau samples from the OP on the right, by comparison.

i doubt they even spoke IE. i bet they spoke something related to Rhaetian. most of western europe didn't spoke ie at this time (prob. even britain, with pictish). if they are early Iron Age they could very well be hallstatt culture and thus proto-celtic. i believe proto-italo-celtic can be explained by a later wave of steppe ancestry coming from corded ware proto-unetice (unetice is predecessor of urnfield, which is predecessor of hallstatt). there is a unetice sample in G25, take a look at it

[Raizen]

i was expecting some roman admixture in britain and collateral roman admixture into ireland, culture doesn't change out of nowhere. that would explain this southern shift.

[firemonkey]

Target: MX195_scaled
Distance: 4.1907% / 0.04190749 | ADC: 2x
100.0 Norwegian

Target: MX192_scaled
Distance: 4.0441% / 0.04044076 | ADC: 2x
100.0 Norwegian

Target: MX190_scaled
Distance: 4.2110% / 0.04211028 | ADC: 2x
65.8 Icelandic
34.2 Swedish

Target: MX188_scaled
Distance: 4.2699% / 0.04269943 | ADC: 2x
80.8 Norwegian
19.2 Afrikaner