The most ultimate Hungarian K13 database thus far

[Lucas]

@Dunai

if you want to add it to K13 Vahaduo please post it as text, not image. Only averages.

[Dunai]

You're not looking at a map with sufficient Romanian samples. Check this one posted by ph2ter from samples gathered I think by Ion Basescu:


Serbs plus Montenegrins span roughly the same area as Romanians. Csángós are firmly in the Romanian cluster. Transylvanian Hungarians are somewhere in between Hungarians and Serbs while Székelys are somewhere in between Hungarians and Romanians. Many Alfoldis are in the Romanian cluster as well.

I wish the map had more Bulgarians.

When I added only Hungarian and Romanian-Moldovan groups the distance calculator shows them being closer to Hungarians rather than to Romanians.

Almost all Hungarian groups are under and around 5 distance, while from Romanians only Moldovans come somewhat close, who happen to not even be purely Vlachs, around 7-8 distance, while Transylvanian Romanians who are closer to Vlachs and more mixed with Transylvanian Hungarians are even more distant to them than Moldovans are.
Distance to: Hungarian_Transylvania
1.62642874 Hungarian_Szekely
2.83985087 Hungarian_Csango
4.80736374 Hungarian
4.87007479 Hungarian_Alfold
4.96068780 Moldova_North
5.36565175 Hungarian_Budapest
5.62296280 Hungarian_Transdanubia
6.71000281 Romania_Moldavia_North
6.83811758 Romania_Moldavia_average
7.29750510 Romania_Moldavia_South
7.84065198 Moldova_average
7.90980372 Moldova_Centre
7.92018186 Romanian_Transylvania
8.53991091 Hungarian_Northern
9.09253591 Romanian_Oltenia
10.21301526 Romanian_Wallachia_average
11.44642966 Romanian_Muntenia
11.56665382 Moldova_South

Target: Hungarian_Transylvania
Distance: 0.9626% / 0.96260866
62.6 Hungarian_Szekely
18.4 Hungarian_Budapest
12.0 Moldova_North
6.0 Moldova_South
1.0 Hungarian_Csango

Similar story is when it comes to Székelys.
Distance to: Hungarian_Szekely
1.62642874 Hungarian_Transylvania
2.83197679 Hungarian_Csango
5.60064831 Hungarian
5.83957987 Hungarian_Alfold
6.09002730 Hungarian_Transdanubia
6.09348036 Moldova_North
6.11472417 Hungarian_Budapest
6.45004502 Romania_Moldavia_North
6.47184481 Romania_Moldavia_average
6.85460897 Romania_Moldavia_South
7.38664506 Romanian_Transylvania
7.70424902 Moldova_average
7.97022603 Moldova_Centre
8.51383826 Romanian_Oltenia
9.35793637 Hungarian_Northern
9.65085130 Romanian_Wallachia_average
10.87371667 Romanian_Muntenia
11.09805602 Moldova_South

Target: Hungarian_Szekely
Distance: 1.3704% / 1.37043403
67.4 Hungarian_Transylvania
16.0 Hungarian_Transdanubia
9.4 Romanian_Oltenia
4.6 Romanian_Muntenia
2.6 Hungarian_Csango

The only population you can see a more significant Moldovan input is among Csángó, but Moldovans themselves also have to a certain degree Csángó input, so it's not surprising. But in distance they still are closest to fellow Hungarians in Transylvania and Székelyföld, with under 3, while Moldovans regions start around 5.
Distance to: Hungarian_Csango
2.83197679 Hungarian_Szekely
2.83985087 Hungarian_Transylvania
4.79916464 Romania_Moldavia_North
4.99036133 Romania_Moldavia_average
5.14757528 Moldova_North
5.61545468 Romania_Moldavia_South
5.93063919 Moldova_Centre
6.07181449 Moldova_average
6.16408440 Hungarian_Alfold
6.22379557 Romanian_Transylvania
6.51288066 Hungarian
7.38393141 Hungarian_Budapest
7.57154113 Hungarian_Transdanubia
7.67815937 Romanian_Oltenia
8.56012595 Romanian_Wallachia_average
9.65814844 Romanian_Muntenia
9.82239781 Hungarian_Northern
9.99094621 Moldova_South

Target: Hungarian_Csango
Distance: 1.4563% / 1.45634563
48.6 Hungarian_Szekely
23.2 Moldova_Centre
14.0 Hungarian_Northern
12.8 Romania_Moldavia_South
1.4 Romanian_Muntenia

The real Romanians that Hungarians of Transylvania should be really close to if they would be just assimilated Romanians, are those of Transylvania, however in both cases they are rather distant, with 7 and 8, while only the Csángó are at least close to their Moldovan neighbors, with a distance of 5. However all three are closest with one another, like very close, which just proves the historic process how they all developed from Medieval Transylvanian Hungarians.

[ixulescu]

-double post-

[ixulescu]

Only because of a few Moldovans, the bulk of Romanians plot at the bottom of the picture where no Hungarians are found.
Avarage Serb plots clearly differently than avarage Romanian. Székely and Hu_Transylvania samples here plot with Serbs-Croats rather than Romanians (I am talking about avarages, obviously).

Nope. The reason why half the Romanian cluster comprises mostly of Moldovans is because they were half of the samples. However, if samples were drawn proportionally there should have been half Transylvanian. In that case the northern half of the cluster would have been populated with both Transylvanian and Moldovan. So far the sampling is not correctly stratified.

I saw one alföldi result that plotted with Serbs, the rest didn't. Avarage Alföldis in Dunai's study are far from Serbo-Romanian genetically, they're barely different than avarage Transdanubian, despite some people claiming they were Balkan transplants or something and super different to Hungarians located west of Danube river. Even I started to think avarage alföldi is genetically serb or something and the results here surprised me a bit.

Alföldis in reality could be even closer to Transdanubia, but Dunai included Hungarians from Partium(Romania) and Vojvodina(Serbia) in the alföld category. Or maybe I'm wrong here and they are genetically same as Alföldi people from Hungary, idk really, only Dunai could tell.

It's not the time to draw any conclusions yet, but on a glance at the map I see 3 Alfoldi samples in the Moldovan part (closer to some Serbian samples, true, but still in the overall Moldovan part). However once more samples from Northern Romania are drawn you'll see an even larger overlap. Check out where the Maramures samples are, right in the middle of the Northern Alfoldis group.

[Jana]

There is not much Hungarian Romanian overlap considering they are neighbours.

[Jana]

Is Jewish ancestry uncommon in Budapest? I remember some article claiming it's relatively common. I thought it was exaggerated because of liberal propaganda.

It is common and not propaganda. Budapest has one of largest Jewish populations in Europe and largest synagogue in Europe is located in Pest.

[ixulescu]

There is not much Hungarian Romanian overlap considering they are neighbours.

Not with Hungarians from Hungary proper, true. But there is some overlap with Hungarian groups from Transylvania and some Alfoldis.

But of course it's not similar with the overlap Romanians have with Serbs, and I suspect Bulgarians too. Too bad only a few Bulgarian samples were on that map.

[Aspirin]

Not with Hungarians from Hungary proper, true. But there is some overlap with Hungarian groups from Transylvania and some Alfoldis.

But of course it's not similar with the overlap Romanians have with Serbs, and I suspect Bulgarians too. Too bad only a few Bulgarian samples were on that map.

Hungarians are clearly visible northern than Romanians, more northern than vast majority of Moldavians from Republic. Why a nigga like you don't understand this from the beginning?

[Scandal]

In these PCAs neighboring European ethnicities almost always form a continuum, nothing out of ordinary. In some cases you will even find individuals who don't plot with neighboring ethnicity but even further. For example Czech individuals plotting with Hungarians/Croats/Slovenes or Romanians plotting with Montenegrins etc.

[Scandal]

Who's this EAST_GERMANY_krampetz and what's his ancestry? https://i.imgur.com/CV3v5Dg.jpg