Dodecad k12b West, Central & South Asian results Vol. 2

[Leto]

100% true

There are many Balkan Turk - Anatolian Turk couples, one of them was from Manisa. I've watched a travel program and the presenter went to a Balkan(Bulgarian) Turk village in Manisa and there was a young(at least 20-25 years old) Yörük woman in the village who married to a Balkan Turk from that village. Also a member of Stardust(a Turkish girl group which will debut at 23rd August) called "Havana"(of course it's her stage name) has Balkan(Thessaloniki, Greece) Turk mother & Anatolian(Samsun) Turk father. There are more examples like that due to there is no religious or ethnical differences. There are Balkan Turks even in Tokat

Crimean Tatars and North Caucasians in Turkey are also largely diluted/Turkified among younger generations (under 30), aren't they?

[Leto]

Chechen
Y-DNA: L3

Gedrosia 22.03 Pct
Siberian 1.69 Pct
Northwest_African -
Southeast_Asian 0.86 Pct
Atlantic_Med 6.38 Pct
North_European 21.81 Pct
South_Asian -
East_African -
Southwest_Asian 3.76 Pct
East_Asian 0.81 Pct
Caucasus 42.66 Pct
Sub_Saharan -

Distance to: Isa
2.23217383 Chechen
4.36339318 Ingush
6.43271327 Balkar
6.80940526 Qumuq
7.13627354 Kumyks
7.49038050 Karachay
7.61606197 Azerbaijani_Dagestan
7.70578354 Avar_Dagestan
7.98790335 Lezgin
8.10724367 Circassian

Target: Isa
Distance: 1.3173% / 1.31731301 | ADC: 0.5x
94.4 Chechen
5.6 Crimean_Tatar_Coast

Target: Isa
Distance: 1.0534% / 1.05338664 | ADC: 0.25x
89.0 Chechen
6.2 Crimean_Tatar_Coast
3.2 Lezgin
0.8 Albanian_Kosovo
0.8 Armenian_East

[Sora]

Crimean (Steppe) Tatar


Gedrosia: 10.02
Siberian: 10.54
Northwest_African: 0.0
Southeast_Asian: 2.76
Atlantic_Med: 13.25
North_European: 26.45
South_Asian: 2.47
East_African: 0.0
Southwest_Asian: 4.93
East_Asian: 13.73
Caucasus: 15.84
Sub_Saharan: 0.0

Distance to: Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
16.55240164 Uzbek
17.94976880 Bashkir
18.67721874 Tatar_Kazan
18.82066683 Turkmen_Uzbekistan
19.55362882 Turk_Romania
19.92221373 Turk_Bulgaria
22.35236005 Crimean_Tatar_Mountain
22.75861375 Turk_Greece
22.79071302 Karakalpak
23.99771031 Tajik_Balanovsky2019
24.05381674 R.Moldova_Gagauz
24.15162727 Turk_Northwest
24.43722161 HUN_Szekely
24.63058668 Nogais
24.75904885 R.Moldova_South
24.84720306 Pomak
24.98890154 Gagauz
25.17391308 Yoruk
25.47822404 Turk_Macedonia
25.87521208 Macedonian
26.10880886 R.Moldova_Centre+North
26.27882417 Montenegrin
26.59289379 Serb
26.60565917 Turkmen_Iran
26.63896582 Turk_Southwest

Target: Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
Distance: 0.1197% / 0.11969429
6.2 Azerbaijan_Jews
4.6 Hungarians
4.2 Romanians
3.8 Mixed_Slav
3.4 Estonian
3.2 British
3.2 Kurds
3.2 Turk_Romania
2.6 PL_Mazovia
2.6 Rus_Pinega
2.6 Finnish_West
2.4 Japanese
1.8 Kyrgyz_Bishkek
1.6 Crimean_Tatar_Coast
1.6 Naga
1.6 Qumuq
1.6 Saudis
1.4 Iran_Central_East
1.4 English_Kent
1.4 Tatar_Kazan
1.4 Turkmens
1.2 Buryat
1.2 German
1.2 Han
1.2 Iranian
1.2 Ket
1.2 Mari
1.2 Selkup
1.2 Turk_Central_Black_Sea
1.2 Yukagir
1.2 Karelian
1.2 Mordovian
1.0 AFG_Tajik
1.0 Altai
1.0 Evenk
1.0 Hazara
1.0 Mongol
1.0 Tajiks
1.0 Yizu
0.8 Balochi
0.8 Bashkir
0.8 Daur
0.8 Georgian_Turkey
0.8 Greek
0.8 Hezhen
0.8 Kho
0.8 Komi
0.8 Korean
0.8 Naxi
0.8 Nganassan
0.8 Piramalai_Kallars
0.8 Swedish
0.8 Turkmen_Uzbekistan
0.8 Udmurt
0.8 Lithuanian
0.6 Albanian_Kosovo
0.6 CHB30
0.6 Dolgan
0.6 Nogais
0.6 She
0.6 Tu
0.6 Uygur
0.6 Xibo
0.4 British_Isles
0.4 Chechen
0.4 Chuvash
0.4 Crimean_Tatar_Steppe
0.4 French
0.4 Italy_Trentino
0.4 JPT30
0.4 Karakalpak
0.4 Kumyks

[Sora]

Crimean Tatars and North Caucasians in Turkey are also largely diluted/Turkified among younger generations (under 30), aren't they?

Not fully. There are many people under 30 who know they're Crimean Tatars or Caucasians, even 90% of them are pure Tatars/Caucasians. But unfortunately they don't know their language very well. Our goverment must do something about this.

[Leto]

Not fully. There are many people under 30 who know they're Crimean Tatars or Caucasians, even 90% of them are pure Tatars/Caucasians. But unfortunately they don't know their language very well. Our goverment must do something about this.

Well, they were born in Turkey and speak Turkish, isn't assimilation for the sake of national unity/social cohesion the founding principle of the Turkish republic. Tatar is already a Turkic language closely related to Anatolian Turkish and as for Caucasian languages, I can tell you they are generally in decline in the North Caucasus itself due to them being heterogeneous (sometimes people don't even understand a different dialect of the same language), difficult and not particularly useful in the modern world.

[Kaspias]

100% true

There are many Balkan Turk - Anatolian Turk couples, one of them was from Manisa. I've watched a travel program and the presenter went to a Balkan(Bulgarian) Turk village in Manisa and there was a young(at least 20-25 years old) Yörük woman in the village who married to a Balkan Turk from that village. Also a member of Stardust(a Turkish girl group which will debut at 23rd August) called "Havana"(of course it's her stage name) has Balkan(Thessaloniki, Greece) Turk mother & Anatolian(Samsun) Turk father. There are more examples like that due to there is no religious or ethnical differences. There are Balkan Turks even in Tokat

I guess the Balkan Turk population in Turkey is 4%-8% and 10%-15% among ethnic Turkish population

Balkan Turk population is around 8-9 million when taking into account the villages formed after the Russo-Turkish War by the refugees and consisted of only Balkan Turks(Pomaks are integrated into Balkan Turk society and probably this number includes most of Pomaks too.) With non-Turk Balkan Muslims(Albanians, Bosniaks, Pomaks, Gorani) it is up to 14 million, I believe.

[Sora]

Well, they were born in Turkey and speak Turkish, isn't assimilation for the sake of national unity/social cohesion the founding principle of the Turkish republic. Tatar is already a Turkic language closely related to Anatolian Turkish and as for Caucasian languages, I can tell you they are generally in decline in the North Caucasus itself due to them being heterogeneous (sometimes people don't even understand a different dialect of the same language), difficult and not partiularly useful in the modern world.

No, it's not and musn't be. Even if they're not useful, they must learn and hand down it to the next generations. I'm so against the assimilation. I think assimilation is a humanity crime itself. The diversity and languages musn't die. Also one nation theory may be suitable for Euro & East Asian countries(because they're 99% of same ethnicity) but it is not suitable for Turkey and other Asian countries, especially for West, Central, South & Southeast Asia countries like Iran, Afghanistan, India, Malaysia, Uzbekistan etc. Because they're too diverse

[Leto]

When people were born and live in the same city/town, speak the same language and have the same religion (provided it still remains important), there is basically no reason left for them not to mix, unless there are vast class differences of course as is the case in Latin America for ex.

[Kaspias]

Crimean Tatars and North Caucasians in Turkey are also largely diluted/Turkified among younger generations (under 30), aren't they?

North Caucasians, yes. The younger generation knows who they are, yet identify as Turk just like the others. I wouldn't say assimilation to the situation of Tatars. Their language shift dates to the Crimean Khanate and they accepted as regular Turks in Turkey since the beginning. But they still have a Tatar identification in the community if that's what you are asking.


All of these ethnic groups tend to marry among themselves, but it is hard to sustain it in such a multicultural society. Expectedly Turkification will peak as younger generations come up. What I can say is they all still have an ethnic identification despite they don't use it in the community. In my experience, only Anatolian and Balkan Turks claim they are nothing but Turks.

[Leto]

No, it's not and musn't be. Even if they're not useful, they must learn and hand down it to the next generations. I'm so against the assimilation. I think assimilation is a humanity crime itself. The diversity and languages musn't die. Also one nation theory may be suitable for Euro & East Asian countries(because they're 99% of same ethnicity) but it is not suitable for Turkey and other Asian countries, especially for West, Central, South & Southeast Asia countries like Iran, Afghanistan, India, Malaysia, Uzbekistan etc. Because they're too diverse

I have a somewhat different opinion but let's not start a debate right here. I can only tell you that more diversity means less cohesion and anyway most people will use whatever language that is the most useful where they live. Practicality is more important for them than anything else.