Moldovan/Romanian GEDmatch Results v2

[Ion Basescul]

2 Ukrainians

N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
28.25	43.03	7.98	5.78	8.40	0.24	1.02	0.37	1.67	1.90	0.21	1.10	0
27.62	40.08	14.74	7.58	4.17	1.22	0.56	0.34	1.46	0.07	1.37	0.65	0.14

Distance to: 1
4.72213935 Ukrainian
4.96352697 Moldova_Ukrainian
5.07059168 Polish_Kielce
5.16204417 South_Polish
5.27139450 Polish_Greater_Poland
5.57658498 Russian_Southwest
5.61569230 Polish_Mazovia
6.12570812 Ukrainian_Galicia
6.19555486 Polish_Podlaskie
6.56680288 Sorb_Lusatia
6.56687902 Polish
7.13028050 Polish_Silesia
7.56847409 Russian_Smolensk
7.78630850 Polish_Masuria
7.87068612 Ukrainian_Carpathian
7.92106054 Belorussian
7.96988708 Polish_Lower_Silesia
8.00203099 Belarusian_Minsk
8.12384146 Russian_average
8.37739220 Polish_Kuyavia
8.41368528 Slovak
9.40512626 Czech
9.42225026 Russian_Kostroma
9.89950504 Hungarian_North
10.23769994 Mordovian

Distance to: 2
4.23556372 Ukrainian_Galicia
4.49363995 Polish_Lower_Silesia
5.86898628 South_Polish
6.36859482 Slovak
6.39417704 Moldova_Ukrainian
6.44617716 Ukrainian_Carpathian
6.73780380 Polish_Silesia
7.47457022 Polish_Kielce
7.68176412 Polish_Greater_Poland
7.68664426 Ukrainian
7.90489089 Czech
8.00502342 Polish
8.19056775 Sorb_Lusatia
8.41078474 Polish_Masuria
8.43456579 Hungarian_North
8.47844915 Polish_Mazovia
8.75809911 Croat_North
9.05856501 Slovenian
9.56924239 Polish_Kuyavia
9.81955192 Hungarian_Alföld
9.86251489 Bosniak_Bosnia
10.00144490 Croat_East
10.17977406 Russian_Southwest
10.25698299 Hungarian_Transdanubia+Budapest
10.26424376 Hungarian

[Ion Basescul]

From Orhei county

N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
25.31	29.49	16.36	6.67	17.62	2.66	0.21	0	0.56	0.88	0.24	0	0

Distance to: 1
2.48917657 Serb_Serbia_Central
3.46037570 Serb_Serbia_Vojvodina
3.46821280 Serb_Croatia
3.48155138 Serb_Herzegovina
3.70991914 Serb
3.81785280 Romania_Maramures
3.92549360 Serb_Serbia_South
4.27056202 Serb_Serbia_West
4.57238450 Romania_Moldavia_North
4.74261531 Serb_Bosnia
4.91381725 Montenegrin
4.92630693 Romania_Crisana
5.15518186 Romania_Moldavia_South
5.25797490 Croat_South
5.33062848 Romania_Transylvania
5.33560681 Moldova_average
5.50734963 Moldova_Centre
5.52074270 Bosniak
5.74175931 Romania_average
5.74357902 Moldova_South
5.97237809 Serb_Southern_Montenegro
6.14937395 Croat_West
6.15180461 Bulgaria_Northwestern
6.43206810 Romania_Banat
6.57550758 Hungarian_Transylvania+Székely

[Ion Basescul]

From Edinet county

N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
23.69	33.47	11.44	13.93	11.77	0	1.97	0.71	2.19	0	0.84	0	0

Distance to: 1
5.90083045 Moldova_North
6.98055872 Moldova_Centre
6.99065805 Bosniak_Bosnia
7.28567087 Moldova_average
7.45275117 Bosniak
7.63660920 Croat_East
8.00026250 Romania_Moldavia_North
8.31012034 Serb_Bosnia
8.46594354 Croat_South
8.77335170 Csángó-Ceangău
8.82819914 Croat
9.34254248 Ukrainian_Carpathian
9.37588396 Serb_Croatia
9.55238714 Croat_West
9.61702657 Serb
9.64997927 Hungarian_Alföld
9.67216625 Serb_Serbia_West
9.82907931 Hungarian_Transylvania+Székely
10.02826505 Romania_Maramures
10.24884872 Serb_Serbia_Central
10.29405168 Serb_Serbia_Vojvodina
10.29918443 Hungarian
10.37923889 Croat_North
10.38515286 Serb_Serbia_South
10.81030064 Hungarian_North

[Ion Basescul]

From Ungheni county

N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
21.63	34.19	15.77	7.25	16.92	0.23	1.25	0	0.26	1.36	1.09	0	0

Distance to: 1
5.35604332 Moldova_average
5.47893238 Bosniak
5.54952250 Moldova_Centre
5.78535219 Serb_Bosnia
6.33757840 Serb_Serbia_Central
6.34452520 Serb_Croatia
6.37932598 Moldova_North
6.60056058 Serb
6.62342812 Croat_South
6.71178069 Romania_Moldavia_North
6.84694823 Bosniak_Bosnia
7.03095299 Serb_Serbia_Vojvodina
7.07919487 Serb_Serbia_South
7.27907274 Serb_Herzegovina
7.28415403 Romania_Maramures
7.33707026 Serb_Serbia_West
7.51986702 Croat_East
8.39729718 Moldova_South
8.41526589 Croat
8.43240772 Croat_West
9.15044808 Montenegrin
9.24910807 Romania_Moldavia_South
9.33507365 Bulgaria_Northwestern
9.38199872 Romania_average
9.44958200 Romania_Crisana

[Vega7]

I found this thread and others on this forum while searching for information about the region my family is from.

My entire ancestry traces back to the former territory of Bukovina, Austria. 5/8 were Ukrainian and 3/8 were Romanian. 23andme tests of my family (including siblings) have been incredibly consistent with this as well as documentation of the ethnic makeup of the region in the late 1800s and early 1900s when my family came to Canada.

Ukrainian ancestry traces back to, in order of highest concentration - 1. Ivano-Frankivsk 2. Ternopil 3. Lviv 4. Chernivtsi
Romanian ancestry traces back to, in order of highest concentration - 1. Suceava 2. Botosani 3. Cluj 4. Bistrita-Nasaud

I've read a number of threads on this forum of people discussing this region. People tend to include the Romanian population as 'Moldadivan' when the actual history is more complicated than that. There was a massive migration from Transylvania to there in the 1700s and 1800s and most Romanians there were eventually of northern Transylvanian origin. Although my own Romanian relatives were from older villages from the eastern periphery that got fewer (if any) Transylvanian migrants. The Ukrainians likewise were almost exclusively migrants from the Ukrainian region of Halych (Galicia).

Anyway, I made an account since I'm curious to run my own family's DNA the way you guys have in this thread. I've never learned as much about my Romanian side since very few came to Canada at the time and most Romanians in Canada are recent migrants, mostly from the south.

I have a couple questions though. On 23andme, there is an option to download the raw data. Which confidence interval should I use? I can set it from 50% to 90%. Secondly, where do I upload the data? Thanks.

[Ion Basescul]

I found this thread and others on this forum while searching for information about the region my family is from.

My entire ancestry traces back to the former territory of Bukovina, Austria. 5/8 were Ukrainian and 3/8 were Romanian. 23andme tests of my family (including siblings) have been incredibly consistent with this as well as documentation of the ethnic makeup of the region in the late 1800s and early 1900s when my family came to Canada.

Ukrainian ancestry traces back to, in order of highest concentration - 1. Ivano-Frankivsk 2. Ternopil 3. Lviv 4. Chernivtsi
Romanian ancestry traces back to, in order of highest concentration - 1. Suceava 2. Botosani 3. Cluj 4. Bistrita-Nasaud

I've read a number of threads on this forum of people discussing this region. People tend to include the Romanian population as 'Moldadivan' when the actual history is more complicated than that. There was a massive migration from Transylvania to there in the 1700s and 1800s and most Romanians there were eventually of northern Transylvanian origin. Although my own Romanian relatives were from older villages from the eastern periphery that got fewer (if any) Transylvanian migrants. The Ukrainians likewise were almost exclusively migrants from the Ukrainian region of Halych (Galicia).

Anyway, I made an account since I'm curious to run my own family's DNA the way you guys have in this thread. I've never learned as much about my Romanian side since very few came to Canada at the time and most Romanians in Canada are recent migrants, mostly from the south.

I have a couple questions though. On 23andme, there is an option to download the raw data. Which confidence interval should I use? I can set it from 50% to 90%. Secondly, where do I upload the data? Thanks.

I have someone from Cernauti who is 5/8 Romanian and 3/8 Ukrainian.
The history is more complicated than that for even neighbouring villages everywhere in Moldova, Romania and Ukraine, but we simplify for simplicity's sake.

The confidence interval doesn't matter, since the data that you will download is static.
Translate this to English and follow the 23andme instructions to get your data in a format that we use here.
You can write to me in PM if you want.

[Nurzat]

it amazes me how Prut is no border, genetically speaking, in spite of Prut being a political border for two centuries now, and there is no border, but only a south to north gradient across Moldova, Prut river having no impact on that. and despite now being culturally a bit different, Moldovan genetics are very consistent across the territory and Moldovans of both sides can have their own cluster

[Ion Basescul]

it amazes me how Prut is no border, genetically speaking, in spite of Prut being a political border for two centuries now, and there is no border, but only a south to north gradient across Moldova, Prut river having no impact on that. and despite now being culturally a bit different, Moldovan genetics are very consistent across the territory and Moldovans of both sides can have their own cluster

That's not surprising as there's been constant geneflow from all regions of Romania prior to 1812. For people who have done autosomal tests, this is evident when looking at the origins of the matches from Romania.
But even without that, this is obvious from surnames, because apart from the shared ones related to occupations, forenames, etc. there are others that point to the geographic origin in Romania and former Romanian territories.
Apart from the popular ones like Mocan(u), Muntean(u), Ungurean(u), Railean(u), which are probably very old and shared with Moldavia, there are also:

Eșanu / Eșan
Brașoveanu (2nd most popular surname in Maia Sandu's village) / Brașovean / Brașovanu / Brașovan
Moroșan / Moroșanu
Pașcan / Pașcănean / Pașcăneanu
Vrînceanu / Vrîncean
Braila / Brailean / Braileanu
Bîrlădeanu / Bîrlădean / Bîrlad
Vasluian / Vasluianu
Tecuci / Tecuceanu
Dornea / Dornean
Hușanu
Focșa
Rădăuță
Suceveanu
Dobrojan / Dobrogeanu
Herța
Cernăuțanu / Cernăuțeanu / Cernăuțan
Botoșanu / Botoșan / Botoșneanu
Matcaș
Sirețanu / Sirețeanu
Oltu / Olteanu / Oltean
Fălceanu / Fălcianu
Tutovan / Tutovanu
Covurluianu
Chilianu / Chilian
Reniță
Daraban
Sălăjan

So if you find something like that in a village, then it likely indicates that some people from that village and likely neighbouring village(s), because of them intermarrying, had at some point in the past ancestors from that place. We have records from the 19th century from Causeni and Cantemir, where several villages are founded by people from Iasi, Cernauti and Vaslui regions. If our record keeping were better, then we would probably find that many places were founded or settled by migrants. And that movement isn't limited only to the side in Republic of Moldova.
Prior to the Soviet occupation in 1940, about 5% of the population of Moldova fled to the side in Romania.
"Dintr-o populație de 3.776.000 de locuitori, (în conformitate cu rezultatele recensământul din 1930), în teritoriile ocupate de URSS, 2.078.000 (55%) erau etnici români. Peste 200.000 de locuitori de toate etniile s-au refugiat în România în cele câteva zile care au urmat după 28 iunie."

But there will be differences in families of people who received geneflow due to the policy of colonisation undertaken by the Russian Empire and then Soviet Union (Ukrainian, Russian, Bulgarian and Gagauz ancestry). In some villages in the North especially, even without colonisation there were historic East Slavic communities who migrated earlier from Western Ukraine and Poland, which over time assimilated and this process is far from being complete. But then again, the same happened in Suceava, Cernauti, Botosani and Bacau regions, so even these mixed people will find genetic equivalents there.

[Nurzat]

also Bejenariu / Bejinariu, alternatively ending in -ru, points to settlers, and in the monography of my mom's village there are mentioned settlers from Sibiu region in the village in the 19th century, arrived as craftsmen, together with several Greek (Phanariote) landowners and a few Lipovans whose last names are kept to this day. so imagine the mix in a few hundred people village

[Ion Basescul]

also Bejenariu / Bejinariu, alternatively ending in -ru, points to settlers, and in the monography of my mom's village there are mentioned settlers from Sibiu region in the village in the 19th century, arrived as craftsmen, together with several Greek (Phanariote) landowners and a few Lipovans whose last names are kept to this day. so imagine the mix in a few hundred people village

Yes, here it's Bejenaru / Bejenari / Bejenar, but those are not always Moldovans or Romanians, at least originally. The same is for Volontir / Volintiri / Volontir and Arnaut / Arnautu. For Cazacu / Cazac variations it's also complicated, since it doesn't always mean Russian or Ukrainian ancestry. People from here expanded historically also into Ukrainian hatmans, and it was popular for those who returned to adopt this surname that points to Cossack origins.