Ashkenazi Jews are only 1/4 Israelite

[Peterski]

(...) Dude was just Scots-Irish and Slavic for all intents and purposes.

Most Jews are just white people.

Well if that dude was Scots-Irish and Slavic then obviously he was not ethnically Jewish, contrary to what you claim.

Most Jews are a mixture of Middle Eastern and Southern European with minor Slavic admixture as this study shows:

https://journals.plos.org/plosgeneti...l.pgen.1006644

[Gallop]

There is the Eurogenes Jtest


Father (FTDNA)

SOUTH_BALTIC 8.66 Pct
EAST_EURO 5.82 Pct
NORTH-CENTRAL_EURO 15.42 Pct
ATLANTIC 24.83 Pct
WEST_MED 23.57 Pct
ASHKENAZI 7.84 Pct (23andMe ASHKENAZI 7 Pct)
EAST_MED 8.34 Pct
WEST_ASIAN -
MIDDLE_EASTERN 2.84 Pct
SOUTH_ASIAN -
EAST_AFRICAN 0.38 Pct
EAST_ASIAN -
SIBERIAN -
WEST_AFRICAN 2.29 Pct


Mine (FTDNA)
SOUTH_BALTIC 6.35 Pct
EAST_EURO 3.89 Pct
NORTH-CENTRAL_EURO 18.06 Pct
ATLANTIC 26.85 Pct
WEST_MED 24.85 Pct
ASHKENAZI 5.05 Pct
EAST_MED 5.82 Pct
WEST_ASIAN 3.61 Pct
MIDDLE_EASTERN 3.4 Pct
SOUTH_ASIAN -
EAST_AFRICAN 1.54 Pct
EAST_ASIAN -
SIBERIAN 0.26 Pct
WEST_AFRICAN 0.33 Pct


Jtest Average Spreadsheet

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1391421490

ASHKENAZI For Spain is 5.27

As my father according to company gets 7 or 7.84 his result in the table of values by countries that also have 7 or approx. are Morocco, Mozabite, Southern Italy and Tuscan with so 7, but it turns out that my father 23 and I give him a full Italian ancestor from several centuries ago in Y full downstream I have askenazis, upstream have appeared two Calabrian and there right where we do not see more Spanish flags that are the 2 ours that is as if it were one.





https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-BY7452/

[Johnson Reed]

The Calabrians are Southern as a mofo, so there's a good chunk of East Med embedded in that component.

Yes, but so were Imperial Romans, and that's where Ashkenazi Jews got their Southern European component from.

How about this model:

cca 35% Samaritan, almost 60% central Italian and few percentage Slavic.

And no Slavic admixture among those in France and Germany, what is logical.
Later they moved from FR and DE to Slavic lands.

They picked up the European DNA in Imperial Rome. Imperial Roman DNA is essentially South Italian, not Central Italian.

They have some Slavic admixture but it's about 10% and only present in Eastern European Jews

5% in Western Ashkenazim, 15% in Eastern Ashkenazim.

For unveiling the origin you should only use Ashkenazi_Germany, because they are the most pure Ashkenazis. Historical records tell that they mostly came from Italy but also somewhat from France to the Rhineland where they ultimately formed.

I wonder where Eastern Ashkenazim get their extra Slavic. Erfurt DNA makes me doubt it's from Cossack rapists, which is the traditional Jewish story about it.

[rothaer]

I wonder where Eastern Ashkenazim get their extra Slavic. Erfurt DNA makes me doubt it's from Cossack rapists, which is the traditional Jewish story about it.

As for the Erfurt Jews it was for sure mostly Slavic from inside the HRE. As for Bohemia I read somewhere that there was recorded more than once that early Jews took indigenous Slavic wifes. The same could be true for Silesia and other parts of Germany at that time. In the Middle Ages the German society was partly pretty "racist" and in the Ostsiedlung territories you for quite a while could just become member of the guild of various crafts if you proved that all your four grandparents were German. Interestingly, that was performed also in HRE states that were ruled by indigenous Slavic dynasties like in Mecklenburg and Pomerania. It was connected to the self-governance of cities that regularly were political entities of ethnic Germans.

Even in deepest Poland, in the (ethnic German) city of Krakau/Kraków the first decades Poles were not allowed to become citizens and the Polish king had agreed to that city constitution. The official language of the city of Krakau was German for centuries. At about the end of the Middle Ages all bekame Polonised.

Now, what I want to say is that in such an environment where Slave were blocked off, for a Slav a connection to a Jew could appear advantagous, however, no disadvantage. The nowadays often pitied position of Jews in Germany in the Middle Ages, that meant to be dealt with as an exterritorial, had not just disadvantages but also advantages. Jews were exempted from common state measures on a lower level and enjoyed some kind of immunity. On the other hand they were "owned" by the German Emperor that had the right to take money for their right to at all reside in the HRE (letter of protection). This right was later sold abd ceeded to the state entities directly below the Emperor. Those Jews that did not meet the high requirements had to leave the HRE and did since centuries end up in Poland-Lithuania, Germany's Jew dump. However, the Jews that were established and made it in the HRE were whealthy, far whealthier than the average German. So marrying a Jew could improve the position of an indigenous Slavic woman in the HRE, not just factually but even legally.

The Erfurt Jews have provided new insights.

Btw. Davidski (= David Wesolowski = Eurogenes = an ethnic Pole in Australia) commented of the Erfurt Jew paper and asked why the authors used Russian as a proxy for modelling the Slavic proportion when it was obvious that the Slavic did not hail from Russians. He stated that they did it as it fitted better due to some very small "Eastern" or East Asian contributions in these Jews. Some trace contributions by Khazars to Ashkenazi Jews are thus plausible.

Precautionary: This doesn't question the Central European source of the Slavic contribution in Erfurt Jews as their Slavic proportions were very heterogeneous and thus recent.

[Scandal]

Yes, but so were Imperial Romans, and that's where Ashkenazi Jews got their Southern European component from.



They picked up the European DNA in Imperial Rome. Imperial Roman DNA is essentially South Italian, not Central Italian.



5% in Western Ashkenazim, 15% in Eastern Ashkenazim.



I wonder where Eastern Ashkenazim get their extra Slavic. Erfurt DNA makes me doubt it's from Cossack rapists, which is the traditional Jewish story about it.

What do you mean by Imperial Romans? People on Italian peninsula? Why and how did Italians become more Northern European since the fall of Roman Empire?

[celticdragongod]

What do you mean by Imperial Romans? People on Italian peninsula? Why and how did Italians become more Northern European since the fall of Roman Empire?

Wasn't northern Italy invaded and conquered by northern barbarians?
'

[Peterski]

Even in deepest Poland, in the (ethnic German) city of Krakau/Kraków the first decades Poles were not allowed to become citizens and the Polish king had agreed to that city constitution.

I thought that we already explained this in 2022 but you keep repeating false information. The relevant fragment from the city constitution says this:

https://www.radiokrakow.pl/aktualnos...kowa-z-1257-r/

"These voyts also promised to us [to our Royal Majesty] that they will not turn into their co-burghers [of Cracow] any of our serfs, any of Church's serfs, or anybody's serfs, and also any free Poles who have up to this point lived in a village - thanks to which our farms will not become depopulated, and farms owned by bishops, canons, or other persons will also not become depopulated."

So this is not true that Poles were not allowed to settle in Krakow. Only peasants (villagers) were not allowed to do so, and of course not all Poles were villagers. Also as you can see the motive for this law was not "anti-Slavic racism", but the concern that farms would become depopulated if peasants were allowed to move to the nearby city.

And as for when did Cracow become Polonised - already in 1312 every citizen who could not pronounce "soczewica, koło, miele, młyn" was killed.

Another thing is that the city of Cracow expanded and absorbed some villages into its suburbs, so some Polish villagers were absorbed anyway.

In the Middle Ages the German society was partly pretty "racist" and in the Ostsiedlung territories you for quite a while could just become member of the guild of various crafts if you proved that all your four grandparents were German.

Can you provide sources for this claim and also can you prove that this law was universally applied in all cities rather than just in some cities? We discussed the "Wendish paragraph" (anti-Slaviic laws) on Polish history forum but I don't remember it being universally applied everywhere:

https://www-historycy-org.translate....en&_x_tr_hl=pl

I have read about the "Wendish paragraph" in several sources, but I don't remember any of these sources claiming what you claim.

And of course the "Wendish paragraph" is just a colloquial term for all kinds of anti-Slavic laws, not a name of some specific law. As far as I know there was no one, universally applied everywhere, anti-Slavic law. There were just various discriminatory laws in various cities (but not in all cities).

[Jingle Bell]

Depends of your Model

Both Rome_Imperial + Levant IA + N/NE Euro and Italy_IA + Levant IA + N/NE Euro seens work, but in the first one Aj are abt 30%-20% Levantine, while in second they can be up to 50%, the right is probably around 30 - 40%, when the first Jews started migrating to Italy and Greece, the Greco-Romans werent that cosmopolite/MENA-admixed, unlike during Roman Empire Era.
And bcs Jews are a very endogamic people, they could conservate a big part of their Levantine DNA even much time later.

Model 1: Using Roman_Imperial

Target: Ashkenazi_Jewish:Ashkenazi
Distance: 1.0366% / 0.01036603
56.0 Roman*Italy*(20*BC–AD*600)
26.2 Roman*Levant*(BC*50–AD*700)
8.6 Slavic*(AD*540–1100)
7.0 Germanic*(AD*100–630)
2.2 Rouran*Khaganate*(AD*330–550)

Model 2: Using Pre-Roman Italy

Target: Ashkenazi_Jewish:Ashkenazi
Distance: 0.8896% / 0.00889646
57.2 Roman*Levant*(BC*50–AD*700)
22.2 Italic*and*Etruscan*(900–200*BC)
9.6 Slavic*(AD*540–1100)
9.0 Germanic*(AD*100–630)
2.0 Rouran*Khaganate*(AD*330–550)

*Using samples from IllustrativeDNA-Like Ancient calculator (Ivorix TheCelt), credits to him.

[Peterski]

Rome_Imperial is too heterogenous population to use it as one average. This population includes individuals who are 100% MENA.

[Slavic Italian]

Distance: 2.5940% / 0.02594017
41.8 Celtic
24.8 Balto-Slavic
19.0 Canaanite
14.2 Germanic
0.2 Anatolian