Russianness index

[Marena]

What means say "Estonian" in these maps? Is it the supposed average of all Estonian citizens or of all ethnic Estonians in Estonia or what?

Good and important question. We must be clear about what exactly we are comparing here and measuring genetic distances to.

To be crystal clear, Russians and other minorities are not included in the Estonian average. Even mixed Estonians with a recent Russian ancestry (2-3 generations) are not included. To include them would be fraudulent and misleading.

On the other hand, when it comes to Belarus and Ukraine, many people in those averages likely do have recent Russian ancestry, as it is much harder to draw distinctions there due to lack of significant cultural barriers (very similar East Slavic languages, Orthodox Christianity, pan-Rus' nostalgia).

[Rumata]

Good and important question. We must be clear about what exactly we are comparing here and measuring genetic distances to.

To be crystal clear, Russians and other minorities are not included in the Estonian average. Even mixed Estonians with a recent Russian ancestry (2-3 generations) are not included. To include them would be fraudulent and misleading.

On the other hand, when it comes to Belarus and Ukraine, many people in those averages likely do have recent Russian ancestry, as it is much harder to draw distinctions there due to lack of significant cultural barriers (very similar East Slavic languages, Orthodox Christianity, pan-Rus' nostalgia).

In this case, these maps say that the average Yaroslavl Russian is genetically closer to the average non-mixed Finn or Estonian or Latvian or Lithuanian or Pole than to the average possible Russian admixtured Ukrainian. Imo, it's totally incredible. Basically this map says Yaroslavl Russians genetically are more Finnic than Slavic.

[Mr. M]

Zero


Target: m_wgs
Distance: 1.0606% / 0.01060588 | R3P
67.2 Slovenian
25.8 Albanian_Kosovo
7.0 British


Target: m_wgs
Distance: 1.0572% / 0.01057174 | R3P
52.6 Albanian_Kosovo
25.8 Latvian
21.6 British


0.013 95% Croat + 5% Georgian
0.013 85% Bosniak + 15% British
0.013 78% Serb + 22% Icelander
0.013 62% Montenegrin + 38% German

Distance to:	m_wgs
0.01432350	Bosniak
0.01473641	Croat
0.01852028	Serb
0.02028448	Slovenian
0.02082032	Montenegrin
0.02101832	Hungarian
0.02260014	Moldovan
0.02422371	Austrian
0.02588931	North_Macedonian
0.02594277	Romanian
0.02953761	German
0.03191574	Czech
0.03406906	Bulgarian
0.03411209	Slovakian
0.03808525	French
0.03823768	Dutch
0.04202564	British
0.04328661	Ukrainian
0.04632930	Danish
0.04757855	Norwegian
0.04808701	Irish
0.04824286	Polish
0.04920698	Icelander
0.05073139	Swedish
0.05086356	Albanian_Kosovo
0.05580757	Albanian
0.05955078	Spanish
0.06187062	Belarusian
0.06195869	Russian_Ryazan
0.06416470	Russian_Kaluga
0.06503634	Portuguese
0.06645328	Italian
0.06902258	Russian_Tver
0.07407979	Greek
0.07553476	Russian_Yaroslavl
0.07860651	Lithuanian
0.07992793	Estonian
0.08886616	Finnish
0.08959887	Latvian
0.13224820	Turkish
0.13829615	Georgian
0.14276362	Azerbaijani
0.14630374	Armenian
0.37854503	Kazakh

[Defcon2]

Target: OP
Distance: 16.9010% / 0.16900998
72.6 Kazakh
27.4 Azerbaijani

Distance to: OP
0.19120737 Kazakh
0.29008623 Azerbaijani
0.29028269 Turkish
0.33877266 Georgian
0.34090497 Finnish
0.34161723 Armenian
0.34566727 Romanian
0.34586861 Moldovan
0.34823018 Russian_Ryazan
0.34844076 Bulgarian
0.34910769 Russian_Tver
0.34962916 Portuguese
0.35013266 Greek
0.35128853 Russian_Yaroslavl
0.35262034 Italian
0.35272423 North_Macedonian
0.35328470 Hungarian
0.35333597 Montenegrin
0.35359171 Serb
0.35394812 Albanian_Kosovo
0.35431167 Albanian
0.35600153 Bosniak
0.35602153 Spanish
0.35715192 Slovakian
0.35726627 Croat


Terrible distances.

Target: Defcon2_scaled
Distance: 19.6408% / 0.19640800
79.6 Kazakh
20.4 Portuguese

I have the same problem, I've tried with all the user coordinates I have and they also don't work.

[Marena]

In this case, these maps say that the average Yaroslavl Russian is genetically closer to the average non-mixed Finn or Estonian or Latvian or Lithuanian or Pole than to the average possible Russian admixtured Ukrainian. Imo, it's totally incredible. Basically this map says Yaroslavl Russians genetically are more Finnic than Slavic.

What do you think about these results from Ukraine? There's a stunning correlation between genetic similarity to Russians and oblasts which Russia currently claims as parts of Russia.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...eir-neighbours

SK = Slovakia
PL = Poland
HU = Hungary
MD = Moldova
BY = Belarus
RUS = Russia

[Opie]

Target: Defcon2_scaled
Distance: 19.6408% / 0.19640800
79.6 Kazakh
20.4 Portuguese

I have the same problem, I've tried with all the user coordinates I have and they also don't work.

We are doing something wrong, but I don’t know which part.

[Fistora]

We are doing something wrong, but I don’t know which part.

You need new IllustrativeDNA coordinates, not the Davidsky G25 ones

[Opie]

You need new IllustrativeDNA coordinates, not the Davidsky G25 ones

Thanks

[Rumata]

What do you think about these results from Ukraine? There's a stunning correlation between genetic similarity to Russians and oblasts which Russia currently claims as parts of Russia.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...eir-neighbours

SK = Slovakia
PL = Poland
HU = Hungary
MD = Moldova
BY = Belarus
RUS = Russia

Genetics is a mystery to me. It's even more a mystery now that Yaroslavl is said to be genetically more Finnic than Slavic.

I find this post about ethnic Russians interesting:
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...=1#post8327315

[Marena]

Genetics is a mystery to me. It's even more a mystery now that Yaroslavl is said to be genetically more Finnic than Slavic.

I find this post about ethnic Russians interesting:
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...=1#post8327315

Estonia at the first place doesn't imply that Yaroslavl or Tver or any other Russian oblast is "more Finnic than Slavic". While it's difficult to precisely quantify how much Slavic and Baltic ancestry modern Estonians have, they're definitely not some kind of 100% pure Finnic people.

Yaroslavl, Tver, Ryazan, Kaluga are all genetically very close Central Russians, and slight perturbations in admixture lead to a flipping/rotation between Estonia and Belarus as their closest pop. But for all of them Belarus is consistently closer than Finland (Finns also have a complex ancestry — a mix of Finnic, Saamic and pre-Germanic Battle Axe Scandinavian ancestries — which means that distance to Finns is not a reliable indicator of "Finnicness" either).

tl;dr this thread is about genetic similarity (or dissimilarity) of Central Russians to modern European countries, not to Iron Age.