Albanian MyHeritage results

[Dukagjini]

I am not sure. I can definitely see your point though. I think intermarriage with Montenegrin Clans is the case. For instance, my mother looks like her father, who in turn looks like his mother, whom was 50/50 Albanian and Slavic Montenegrin. My moms clan is from Puka with origins in the south. They have been in Puka long enough for the genetic impact. She typically comes up with a big chunk of South Slavic like admixture. I think this is the case. Her mothers side were also from Shkoder not too far from the Montenegrin border.

I haven't even done an autosomal test yet but I just know just by the look of people in my family, and region there is definitely some Slav in there somewhere. It sucks bro lol. I want to be pure Albo lol. Mind you I always thought that us Monte Albs had some sort of unique look from other Albanians, and I thought this uniqueness mean't we were more pure turns out it's just East Euro admix. But we aren't that heavily Slav admixed right? We still look like Albanians just a tad different. It sucks that 23andme grouped South Slavs and Albo's in one group because if it was separate we could tell how much Balkan...Monte Albs would get.

[Dibran]

I haven't even done an autosomal test yet but I just know just by the look of people in my family, and region there is definitely some Slav in there somewhere. It sucks bro lol. I want to be pure Albo lol. Mind you I always thought that us Monte Albs had some sort of unique look from other Albanians, and I thought this uniqueness mean't we were more pure turns out it's just East Euro admix. But we aren't that heavily Slav admixed right? We still look like Albanians just a tad different. It sucks that 23andme grouped South Slavs and Albo's in one group because if it was separate we could tell how much Balkan...Monte Albs would get.

It doesn't make you less Albanian. For instance, autosomally I come out very Albanian. Alot more than some. But, my Y-DNA is L1029* which most likely arrived with the early Sklavenoi tribes into Byzantium in the early middle ages. So my earliest Paternal ancestor was most likely a Slavic tribesman and/or Ostrogoths. My Hotjan friend for instance is E-V13 which is a typical Albanian Y-DNA. He autosomally comes up very close to Bulgarians and Romanian with 25 Albanian like admixture. We are an ethno-linguistic group after all. So we won;t all have the same. I remember when Albanians started converting en masse to Islam in the 1800s that some Albanian muslim clans were bothering some Christian Albanians whom fled to the Macedonian side of the border. Many of which are probably assimilated now since they werent persecuted over religion. Many factors led to a shift of people over borders etc.

My closest pop is usually Northern Albania or Epirus. Interestingly there is a Arvanite clan with my surname from Epirus, mentioned in the middle ages, that migrated to west Macedonia and south Albania. This would explain my YDNA as R1a L1029 is more common in the Southern Albanians and Northern Greeks. So far its low in Ghegs. Seems highest in central Albania. The most common South Slavic YDNA is I2a1b-Din though. Then again I am L1029* negative downstream. My only close match is an Albanian from Gostivar with our most recent ancestor suspected to live 1000 years ago. All my matches are mostly between 1800-2300 years ago. So, too far back to really tell. They are scattered between north west south east and central europe. May test my father to form our own cluster between us, since I am by myself on the Yfull tree.

With Montenegrin Albanians, its hard to say. Some of the East Euro admixture is being read as Slavic when it could be Steppe admixture from pre-slavic NE European derived groups. Like Thracians, Illyrians etc. I suppose when more ancient DNA samples pop up we will learn more. Where in Montenegro are you from?

Albanians have around the same if not less than Greeks when it comes to Slavic admixture. Bulgarians and Macedonians tend to overlap with Albanians and Greeks. Suggesting they are closer to Albanians and Greeks than Slavs. Croatians Bosnians and Serbs seem to cluster the furthest from other Balkanites.

[Dukagjini]

It doesn't make you less Albanian. For instance, autosomally I come out very Albanian. Alot more than some. But, my Y-DNA is L1029* which most likely arrived with the early Sklavenoi tribes into Byzantium in the early middle ages. So my earliest Paternal ancestor was most likely a Slavic tribesman and/or Ostrogoths. My Hotjan friend for instance is E-V13 which is a typical Albanian Y-DNA. He autosomally comes up very close to Bulgarians and Romanian with 25 Albanian like admixture. We are an ethno-linguistic group after all. So we won;t all have the same. I remember when Albanians started converting en masse to Islam in the 1800s that some Albanian muslim clans were bothering some Christian Albanians whom fled to the Macedonian side of the border. Many of which are probably assimilated now since they werent persecuted over religion. Many factors led to a shift of people over borders etc.

My closest pop is usually Northern Albania or Epirus. Interestingly there is a Arvanite clan with my surname from Epirus, mentioned in the middle ages, that migrated to west Macedonia and south Albania. This would explain my YDNA as R1a L1029 is more common in the Southern Albanians and Northern Greeks. So far its low in Ghegs. Seems highest in central Albania. The most common South Slavic YDNA is I2a1b-Din though. Then again I am L1029* negative downstream. My only close match is an Albanian from Gostivar with our most recent ancestor suspected to live 1000 years ago. All my matches are mostly between 1800-2300 years ago. So, too far back to really tell. They are scattered between north west south east and central europe. May test my father to form our own cluster between us, since I am by myself on the Yfull tree.

With Montenegrin Albanians, its hard to say. Some of the East Euro admixture is being read as Slavic when it could be Steppe admixture from pre-slavic NE European derived groups. Like Thracians, Illyrians etc. I suppose when more ancient DNA samples pop up we will learn more. Where in Montenegro are you from?

Albanians have around the same if not less than Greeks when it comes to Slavic admixture. Bulgarians and Macedonians tend to overlap with Albanians and Greeks. Suggesting they are closer to Albanians and Greeks than Slavs. Croatians Bosnians and Serbs seem to cluster the furthest from other Balkanites.

I am from a place called Shestani-Kraja,(Skadarska Krajina srb) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skadarska_Krajina Many of these Shestani have been slavicized to Montenegrins but they still know they are Albanian. I am not related to those. Originally my fathers side come from Gruda, but they traveled to Godinje and then settled in Shestani. It's hard to tell though because there are people from my village that have the same last name as me but people tell me are not related. Although it is documented by a guy Andrija Jovicevic that we came from Gruda so I believe it to be true.

Mind you my father never even knew we came from Gruda. All this stuff has been forgotten. Crazy shit.

[Dibran]

I am from a place called Shestani-Kraja,(Skadarska Krajina srb) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skadarska_Krajina Many of these Shestani have been slavicized to Montenegrins but they still know they are Albanian. I am not related to those. Originally my fathers side come from Gruda, but they traveled to Godinje and then settled in Shestani. It's hard to tell though because there are people from my village that have the same last name as me but people tell me are not related. Although it is documented by a guy Andrija Jovicevic that we came from Gruda so I believe it to be true.

Mind you my father never even knew we came from Gruda. All this stuff has been forgotten. Crazy shit.

From my knowledge, the Grudjan and Hotjan groups are the least Slavic admixed in Montenegro from what I have seen, and typically have Albanian Y-DNA like V13 and J2b. My Hotjan friend is the exception, his father was originally(Albanian according to my him) from Greek Macedonia. Greek Macedonia has alot of Slavic admixture, which could explain my friends shift towards Bulgarians and Romanians on autosomal.

My paternal origin story actually wen't to shit(well not for certain yet). We originally believed per oral history that we descended from the Perhspalaj of Mirdita. However, a user on this forum mentioned per accepted Albanian oral histories(which may be wrong) that Pershpalaj are from fis Kalaj, whom according to testing were R1b. If the oral history is wrong, then perhaps we did come from Mirdita. However if it is correct, then it had to be a woman who married into the line, and the story got lost in translation.

I tried testing Perhspalaj I got in touch with, even offering to pay, but they all refused. Whereby another Albanian claimed they refuse because they are originally from Italy, from the Appenines and arrived as a Condottieri during Skanderbegs time, as mercenary against Ottomans(per supposed church records that were burned by the Serbs). So now there are 2 conflicting Pershpalaj origins. One stating nativity to Albania, the other that they migrated as mercenaries from Italy.

So, until an actual surnamed Pershpalaj tests, we won;t know which narrative is true. The most probable is that a woman married in and we are actually descended from Epirote Arvanite that migrated to West Macedonia. From there could have spilled over the border into Diber Vogel, where we have been in Okshtun for at least 350 years(before which we assume longer). My Gostivar match I think strengthens this scenario.

[Ujku]

What is this ''Greek'' DNA?

[Dibran]

What is this ''Greek'' DNA?

From my understanding, it includes Greek, Albanian, Bulgarian reference groups.

[Dukagjini]

From my knowledge, the Grudjan and Hotjan groups are the least Slavic admixed in Montenegro from what I have seen, and typically have Albanian Y-DNA like V13 and J2b. My Hotjan friend is the exception, his father was originally(Albanian according to my him) from Greek Macedonia. Greek Macedonia has alot of Slavic admixture, which could explain my friends shift towards Bulgarians and Romanians on autosomal.

My paternal origin story actually wen't to shit(well not for certain yet). We originally believed per oral history that we descended from the Perhspalaj of Mirdita. However, a user on this forum mentioned per accepted Albanian oral histories(which may be wrong) that Pershpalaj are from fis Kalaj, whom according to testing were R1b. If the oral history is wrong, then perhaps we did come from Mirdita. However if it is correct, then it had to be a woman who married into the line, and the story got lost in translation.

I tried testing Perhspalaj I got in touch with, even offering to pay, but they all refused. Whereby another Albanian claimed they refuse because they are originally from Italy, from the Appenines and arrived as a Condottieri during Skanderbegs time, as mercenary against Ottomans(per supposed church records that were burned by the Serbs). So now there are 2 conflicting Pershpalaj origins. One stating nativity to Albania, the other that they migrated as mercenaries from Italy.

So, until an actual surnamed Pershpalaj tests, we won;t know which narrative is true. The most probable is that a woman married in and we are actually descended from Epirote Arvanite that migrated to West Macedonia. From there could have spilled over the border into Diber Vogel, where we have been in Okshtun for at least 350 years(before which we assume longer). My Gostivar match I think strengthens this scenario.

It's a legit clusterfuck lol. Albanians have always been a traditional people who always married there own throughout history so I think it's one of the only places where oral stories could turn out to be true, but then I see that we have we have mixed and its a surprise because our pride is unmatched. The only way you will know is if you test the Pershpalaj. It's interesting though, I can see some slav somewhere in my family like I said, but man....many of my relatives look Albanian it's nuts. My first cousin in particular looks literally like King Bardhys or some Illyrian king came back to life.

[Dibran]

It's a legit clusterfuck lol. Albanians have always been a traditional people who always married there own throughout history so I think it's one of the only places where oral stories could turn out to be true, but then I see that we have we have mixed and its a surprise because our pride is unmatched. The only way you will know is if you test the Pershpalaj. It's interesting though, I can see some slav somewhere in my family like I said, but man....many of my relatives look Albanian it's nuts. My first cousin in particular looks literally like King Bardhys or some Illyrian king came back to life.

Lmao it really is. Well, a certain subset of Albanian clans were very radical with pride. Not all though. Also, from my reading, many of the Albanian tribal practices did not evolve until the mid-late 1300s. This would mean, much of the backbone of Albanian tribalism would not yet come into fruition. The tribes of Albania mentions as much. This would suggest earlier tribes were more open. Albanians on the lowlands were more open to assimilation and intermixing, as opposed to highly isolated mountain clans. This affect however is purely for paternal and maternal lineage purposes. Which explains why R1a and I2a are more common in lowland Albania. Autosomal genetics is a different matter. You may marry an Albanian girl for instance whose earliest ancestor was from Bosnia and over a few generations perhaps lost his native tongue, eventually taking an Albanian name. With time, and integration, the children of such offspring wouldn't be distinguishable.Then, with time you forget and things get jumbled in the process.

This much I know, my fathers line have been in Okshtun i Vogel for 350-400 years minimum. My region is very averse to Slavs. So it would had to have already arrived as Albanian speaking. the earliest ancestor could have been from the Baiounitai, one of the Skalavenoi tribes in the first wave. Most of which were assimilated in Greece and Albania. Also the Berzites are possible too. Being that I am negative downstream, my line could have taken a different migration. Ostrogoths sweapt through L1029 hotspots. They could have brought it earlier which would explain why I lack all the shared SNPs with other L1029 downstream.

Me and my father have a mutual autosomal match who has a Koci in their family tree(what are the odds) from Berat/Korce. They are Orthodox. So they have to be from a branch that diverged much earlier(since we are Muslims). Its scary, the communist Bako Koci from Korce looks exactly like my uncle lmao. My guess is we came from a southern clan that settled in West Macedonia, a branch of which went to Diber in Albania.

Yea I dodged the Albanian nose lmao. But, the nose is a key feature of alot of the Roman and Balkan rulers. The Dinaric type that is. I was classified as a Dinaricized Paleo-Atlantid. Paleo Atlantid is a Cromagnid type. The purest of which is supposedly in a region of Denmark. It is more a western type. The dinarcization providing that South-East shift. My grandfather is Dinaricized Pontid. My maternal grandfather Dinarid with CM. Autosomal genetics can be random. Some Albanians are very blonde and blue eyed with little slavic admixture. I am not sure how genes for complexion and what not work. Perhaps you can autosomally be Albanian, but express genes associated with Slavic admixture in dominance.

My next step is to define my own cluster by testing my father with BigY.

[Popeye]

What is this ''Greek'' DNA?

According to their map, Greek is mostly Greece, Southern/Central Albania and Macedonia while the Balkan covers those same areas + Northern Albania / Kosova and West Balkans where its supposed to peak, So I figure the Greek and Balkan is interchangeable but at the same time their Balkan component is unstable as it is found high in non Balkanites which according to their map isnt supposed to. It only peaks in actual Balkans. Basically, its a bullshit autosomal test and not to waste your money. Same as ancestrydna, East Europe is unstable. Its probably a Northern shift.

Basically, there shouldnt be a Greek cluster in the first place since it also touches some of the same areas as the Balkan. There should of just been a Balkan. Same for ancestrydna, there shouldnt be a lumping of italy/greece. This is what makes these tests inaccurate compared to others. Basically, the greek-Balkan is just 100% Balkan.

Their Balkan :



Their Greek :



Thei Greek is basically a more Southern shift on average. Most Greeks wont score 100 Greek. Like most Albanians wont.

Greek probably peaks in Epirus or Peloponnese or somewhere.

[Popeye]

I haven't even done an autosomal test yet but I just know just by the look of people in my family, and region there is definitely some Slav in there somewhere. It sucks bro lol. I want to be pure Albo lol. Mind you I always thought that us Monte Albs had some sort of unique look from other Albanians, and I thought this uniqueness mean't we were more pure turns out it's just East Euro admix. But we aren't that heavily Slav admixed right? We still look like Albanians just a tad different. It sucks that 23andme grouped South Slavs and Albo's in one group because if it was separate we could tell how much Balkan...Monte Albs would get.

23andme has an own East Europe category so does myorigins, it will detect any East European ancestry it can. Its Balkan doesnt include East Europe, only South Slavs that share some South East Euro genes with Albanians etc are included, its been like that for years.., East European genes , West Europe etc shared with other European populations etc are seperated as best they can, thats why you see South Slavs score on average more East Europe than Albanians on myorigins and 23andme because they have more of such ancestry on average. This is also what it says on the 23andme page and average scores.

So it will detect such ancestry to some extent. But if you have only one slavic ancestor it might not detect it unless you test older generations and thats not much neither is it enough to change the racial make up of a population or make you shift more north.

23andme goes 300-500 years back, myorigins 2000 years back... scoring 20% east euro on myorigins doesnt neccessarily make you shift more north , on 23andme such a person might score few % and its not enough to make someone shift north. Such genes get dilluted unless they are really large. Like say you score 10% East Euro on 23andme, that should shift you more North. But most Albanians barely score any East Europe on 23andme.

I dont think Albs of Montenegro have any more Slavic neccessarily, ive seen Kosovars and other Albs score quite high East Europe and some of them still plotted south.

Montenegro Albs are just naturally Northern shifted, same way as some other Northern Albanian areas , as they do overlap with some other North Albanians.. its just depends on samples.

Gruda etc used to just be Malsia or part of North Albania like the rest.


So the different plotting among Albanian areas is just natural. Like any other country, North to South being the biggest difference.