Ethnologue lists France as a country where Portuguese, Spanish and Italian are spoken

[Visage pâle]

More like Revolution killed the national languages of France, some of them much more beautiful and high cultured than French (e.g. Occitan and Provençal).

France was the most centralized state long before the revolution. Sure jacobins did excess but they didn't began processus. As nation state France began in XVth century and finished its unification in 1790 with suppression of provinces.

Kings were always respectful toward local differences because they hadn't the idea of ''national unity'' as something important, dinastic loyalty was the core value of monarchic societies.

Look what Bourbons did in Spain. Under Habsburg it was just a reunion of independant states, under Bourbons it became a "centralized" state (under Castile laws).

In pre-1789 monarchies and empires no one in central government usually gave 0 fucks to what language, ethnic group or culture their subjects belonged to, as long as they were loyal. The world of ancient empires and monarchies was much more culturally respectful than the SJW bullshit that came later.

You have idylic vision imo. Monarchies tended to be cosmopolits too and (sometimes) disrespectfuls against peoples.

[Cristiano viejo]

Because Spain haven't finish yet his processus of national unification like France did in 1789.

Spain finished its processus of national unification in 1492, dear. In 1512 behind the conquest of Navarra by Castilla, if you prefer.
Ie 250 years before than France.

Look what Bourbons did in Spain. Under Habsburg it was just a reunion of independant states, under Bourbons it became a "centralized" state (under Castile laws).

Not true at all.

Borbones have been the ruin of Spain.

[JMack]

France was the most centralized state long before the revolution. Sure jacobins did excess but they didn't began processus. As nation state France began in XVth century and finished its unification in 1790 with suppression of provinces.

It was politically centralized, not culturally. Not surprisingly professional historians like B. Anderson and Hobsbawn (I know he was marxist, but he presented the data anyway) estimate that only around 10% of France's population could speak French in 1789.

Look what Bourbons did in Spain. Under Habsburg it was just a reunion of independant states, under Bourbons it became a "centralized" state (under Castile laws.

So what?

You have idylic vision imo. Monarchies tended to be cosmopolits too and disrespectfuls against peoples.

Monarchies were ''cosmopolitan'' in the sense they didn't care who were their suubjects, but they didn't even came close to do what ''democracies'' and national republics did after them. Changing completely the landscape of languages and cultures of the world. It's not a positive thing imo.

And it happened not only in France but also in Italy and other multilingual countries.

[Sebastianus Rex]

Because Spain haven't finish yet his processus of national unification like France did in 1789.

How was there anything remotely close to a "unification" in 1789 when the Jacobins spent the next 5 years arresting and guillotining people en masse ? It was a civil war if you ask me.

It was the Republican revolutionaires that established state policies to impose the French in all territory under the pretext of "spreading the spirit of the Revolution" = brainwash them with propaganda.

[Visage pâle]

It was politically centralized, not culturally. Not surprisingly professional historians like B. Anderson and Hobsbawn (I know he was marxist, but he presented the data anyway) estimate that only around 10% of France's population could speak French in 1789.

10% could speak french well, much more spoke partially or a little, and 6 millions at least (20%) didn't speak it at all. Theses estimations are from Abbé Gregoire. Anyway, culturally unity was limited because of little means of transports. Most peoples stayed in their provinces.

So what?

Proof that french monarchs tended to centralize much more than others.

Monarchies were ''cosmopolitan'' in the sense they didn't care who were their suubjects, but they didn't even came close to do what ''democracies'' and national republics did after them. Changing completely the landscape of languages and cultures of the world. It's not a positive thing imo.
And it happened not only in France but also in Italy and other multilingual countries.

I think one of the reasons of the collapse of french monarchy, it's because she had became too much cosmopolitan after Louis XIV.

[Visage pâle]

Spain finished its processus of national unification in 1492, dear. In 1512 behind the conquest of Navarra by Castilla, if you prefer.
Ie 250 years before than France.

States of crown of Aragon and Catilla were separated until Bourbons. It was independants states ruled by a same Monarch.
Spain didn't finished his processus of unity, that's why there is so much regional power, and problems with catalans.

[Visage pâle]

How was there anything remotely close to a "unification" in 1789 when the Jacobins spent the next 5 years arresting and guillotining people en masse ? It was a civil war if you ask me.
It was the Republican revolutionaires that established state policies to impose the French in all territory under the pretext of "spreading the spirit of the Revolution" = brainwash them with propaganda.

Most french accepted revolution and end of privileges.

[Cristiano viejo]

States of crown of Aragon and Catilla were separated until Bourbons. It was independants states ruled by a same Monarch.
Spain didn't finished his processus of unity, that's why there is so much regional power, and problems with catalans.

No, sorry. Saying Aragón and Castilla were separated until Bourbons just because both remained its own laws it could be extrapoled even until today 2019, where every Spanish region is ruled by its own laws
That does not mean Spain is not unified. The same could be said about USA, where every state has its own laws, UK, etc etc

[Tooting Carmen]

Most french accepted revolution and end of privileges.

The French Revolution did bring some good ideas to Europe and the world about democracy and liberty, but the mass terror and later on brutal imperialism cannot be denied.

[Visage pâle]

The French Revolution did bring some good ideas to Europe and the world about democracy and liberty, but the mass terror and later on brutal imperialism cannot be denied.

Yes but terror was probably inevitable because France was in danger of death. I don't like Robespierre but he saved France, Girondins would have failed.