Fatyanovo-Balanovo autosomal results?

[Arhat]

Nice to see you back, man! I don't know the OP and his problem with me but he seems to have misunderstood me. First of all, I was being half serious. Secondly the FB lived in modern Russia exclusively. And thirdly they were undoubtedly Indo-European, so kinda of 'Aryan-ish'. I agree that Mordovians are supposed to have some of their ancestry when it comes to Russia.

We have Global25 coordinates for one Fatyanovo sample and this are modern East Europeans in terms of Fatyanovo-like affinity. Obviously these is indirect Fatyanovo-like ancestry from other CWC groups but Fatyanovo and the ancestors of other North Europeans were genetic clones with only slightly different Y-DNA, so Fatyanovo-Sintashta can be used to model the steppe ancestry of Russians, Germanics and Balts.

[Leto]

We have Global25 coordinates for one Fatyanovo sample and this are modern East Europeans in terms of Fatyanovo-like affinity. Obviously these is indirect Fatyanovo-like ancestry from other CWC groups but Fatyanovo and the ancestors of other North Europeans were genetic clones with only slightly different Y-DNA, so Fatyanovo-Sintashta can be used to model the steppe ancestry of Russians, Germanics and Balts.

Cool, I wonder what I would score with that run. I have coordinates. However the distances are rather big.

[Arhat]

Cool, I wonder what I would score with that run. I have coordinates. However the distances are rather big.

In the case of Balto-Slavs the distances will be always big with all ancient references predating the emerging of Balto-Slavs because of Balto-Slavic drift (basically Balto-Slavs were long inbred and kept to themselves so that they have mutations/admixture looking as if it is from a new population even when it emerged without outer admixture). But based on qpAdm and uniparental markers northern Balto-Slavs are basically a mix of Steppe_MLBA, Globular_Amphora, Baltic_HG and something Nganasan-like so Global25 models should stick to these components. There is no direct EHG ancestry in East Europe even when it often shows up in Global25 vahaduo. Uniparental markers and qpAdm very much speak against that. But becasue of overfit in Global25 nmonte/vahaduo many think there is EHG ancestry among Russians what is not the case. EHG was replaced by Fatyanovo who was replaced by Finno-Ugrians and Baltic_BA which later were mostly replaced by Slavic settlers from the southwest.

[Leto]

In the case of Balto-Slavs the distances will be always big with all ancient references predating the emerging of Balto-Slavs because of Balto-Slavic drift (basically Balto-Slavs were long inbred and kept to themselves so that they have mutations/admixture looking as if it is from a new population even when it emerged without outer admixture). But based on qpAdm and uniparental markers northern Balto-Slavs are basically a mix of Steppe_MLBA, Globular_Amphora, Baltic_HG and something Nganasan-like so Global25 models should stick to these components. There is no direct EHG ancestry in East Europe even when it often shows up in Global25 vahaduo. Uniparental markers and qpAdm very much speak against that. But becasue of overfit in Global25 nmonte/vahaduo many think there is EHG ancestry among Russians what is not the case. EHG was replaced by Fatyanovo who was replaced by Finno-Ugrians and Baltic_BA which later were mostly replaced by Slavic settlers from the southwest.

Interesting, didn't know that. But they weren't totally replaced as far as I know. Because Finno-Ugric is largely a language thing, not genetic.

By the way you were (mis)quoted here by one user, I don't think you are unaware of widespread recent ancestry from Ukraine in Southern Russia (Krasnodar, Rostov, Voronezh, etc.)
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...=1#post7028612

[Arhat]

Interesting, didn't know that. But they weren't totally replaced as far as I know. Because Finno-Ugric is largely a language thing, not genetic.

By the way you were (mis)quoted here by one user, I don't think you are unaware of widespread recent ancestry from Ukraine in Southern Russia (Krasnodar, Rostov, Voronezh, etc.)
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...=1#post7028612

The later the replacement was the more ancestry survived of course. So you have a big Finno-Ugrian substrate in most northern and eastern regions of European Russia but for example close to zero Volosovo ancestry in Russia. Direct Fatyanovo ancestry which arrived in the early Bronze Age from Ukraine/Belarus survived probably around 10-30% among Pre-Slavic Volga-Ural populations but even they seem to have much if not most of their Indo-European ancestry from Balto-Slavs. Mordovians for example seem to be 40-50% Proto-Slavic admixed. Udmurts, Tatars and Mari much less but many of them have some Slavic ancestry too.

Outside of Russia direct autosomal Fatyanovo ancestry is highest among Pamiri and some Indian Ror/Jatts with around 40% in some cases. Probably even higher than among most modern day Volga-Ural populations.

[Aren]

In the case of Balto-Slavs the distances will be always big with all ancient references predating the emerging of Balto-Slavs because of Balto-Slavic drift (basically Balto-Slavs were long inbred and kept to themselves so that they have mutations/admixture looking as if it is from a new population even when it emerged without outer admixture). But based on qpAdm and uniparental markers northern Balto-Slavs are basically a mix of Steppe_MLBA, Globular_Amphora, Baltic_HG and something Nganasan-like so Global25 models should stick to these components. There is no direct EHG ancestry in East Europe even when it often shows up in Global25 vahaduo. Uniparental markers and qpAdm very much speak against that. But becasue of overfit in Global25 nmonte/vahaduo many think there is EHG ancestry among Russians what is not the case. EHG was replaced by Fatyanovo who was replaced by Finno-Ugrians and Baltic_BA which later were mostly replaced by Slavic settlers from the southwest.

That's not really the case. Comb Ceramic Culture was largely EHG and existed even after the Corded Ware period.

[Arhat]

That's not really the case. Comb Ceramic Culture was largely EHG and existed even after the Corded Ware period.

Where? Comb Ceramic was replaced by Baltic CWC who got most of their HG ancestry from South Baltic HGs. Volosovo in Russia was already replaced by Fatyanovo which seemingly not mixed with them. Even Saami don't have direct EHG ancestry their HG ancestry is SHG-like

[Aren]

Where? Comb Ceramic was replaced by Baltic CWC who got most of their HG ancestry from South Baltic HGs. Volosovo in Russia was already replaced by Fatyanovo which seemingly not mixed with them. Even Saami don't have direct EHG ancestry their HG ancestry is SHG-like

The HG in Latvia and Estonia became more EHG-like with time. They co-existed with the CW in the Eastern Baltic until they were absorbed.
Not sure how the Saami can have SHG-like input when they emerged in southern Finland and we know the HG there were EHG(HG from Karelia), when they reached Scandinavia in the Middle Ages the SHG were long gone.

[Tanais]

We have Global25 coordinates for one Fatyanovo sample and this are modern East Europeans in terms of Fatyanovo-like affinity. Obviously these is indirect Fatyanovo-like ancestry from other CWC groups but Fatyanovo and the ancestors of other North Europeans were genetic clones with only slightly different Y-DNA, so Fatyanovo-Sintashta can be used to model the steppe ancestry of Russians, Germanics and Balts.

Where can I find this Fatyanovo sample? I couldn’t find him in the G25 list.

[Proto-Shaman]

We have Global25 coordinates for one Fatyanovo sample and this are modern East Europeans in terms of Fatyanovo-like affinity. Obviously these is indirect Fatyanovo-like ancestry from other CWC groups but Fatyanovo and the ancestors of other North Europeans were genetic clones with only slightly different Y-DNA, so Fatyanovo-Sintashta can be used to model the steppe ancestry of Russians, Germanics and Balts.

I waited for this, but I knew you are either a blatantly bad skilled liar or just foolish enough not to handle G25 calculations. Your self-declared method to change Target and Source and skip all other Baltic Meso and BA samples actually made no sense at all, but it's ok coz you can still draw something from it. This happens if you add the Turkic peoples into the whole story It looks like Johannes Krause's IE Hybrid Theory was right. All Hail TurkoGERMANS Kura-Araxes ala post-sÜmer

Where can I find this Fatyanovo sample? I couldn’t find him in the G25 list.

This sample doesn't exist, he just relabled Sintashta into Fatyanovo.