Post your eyes!

[Ugo]

I don't do. I do it towards someone who unrelatedly and without any factuality in a discussion about a particular genetic paper says "Yes, your child's play g25 is where it's at.". That's no respectable person but an individual that behaves like an asshole and has to be recognised and depicted as such.

Simple as that.

Because he's tired of explaining it to all the morons. The Greek is really arrogant, but he is smart. I would also like explanations from smart people, not aggression. But you also screwed everyone up with your Germanic race. I'm joking about the WEF, it's obvious. I've got a shitload of this shit... You're serious...

[Übermensch]

[kingmob]

But maybe you can explain some advantages.

Very quickly, w/o analyzing too much. Why PCAs like g25 suck.

1) No imputation process.

2) No outgroup list of population sources to compare against, PCA overcompensates by creating unrealistic combos.

3) Dimensional weights tweaked to suit the PCA author's biases (eg g25 data overfit Eastern Euro to distinguish them from Western Euro).

4) All points in dimensional space are treated equally, with no method to mitigate lower SNP count VS higher SNP count (see 1).

5) Scaling of data with no penalisation, creating artificial entities.

[rothaer]

Because he's tired of explaining it to all the morons.

This is nothing yet but an insinuation. Someone who has something to explain, will usually be able to do that.

The Greek is really arrogant, but he is smart.

This is what he hopes people will assume. If you observe veryfied smart people they will often be arrogant internally till a certain degree but they will not behave arrogant to the outside. Can you imagine that David Reich behaves arrogant to the outside? People doing that are mostly just wannabes. If he is smart, he hides it well.

I would also like explanations from smart people, not aggression. But you also screwed everyone up with your Germanic race.

I did never use the words "Germanic race" nor did I refer to anything like that. But if you mean that a number of people dislike me much because of my opinion then this might well be true. But I expect from everybody that I communicate with that he can also behave factual because otherwise a communication is not possible and a waste of life time. eupator is - for whatever reason - not able to that and hence quitted as a conversation partner.

I'm joking about the WEF, it's obvious. I've got a shitload of this shit... You're serious...

Exactly.

[kingmob]

You have just quitted your existance as a conversation partner and given another example of an ethnic Greek that will be part of my life experience which I will share with as many people as possible. Bon voyage.

Do you want to speak to the manager?

[Ugo]

This is nothing yet but an insunuation. Someone who has something to explain, will usually be able to do that.



This is what he hopes people will assume. If you observe veryfied smart people they will often be arrogant internally till a certain degree but they will not behave arrogant to the outside. Can you imagine that David Reich behaves arrogant to the outside? People doing that are mostly just wannabes. If he is smart, he hides it well.



I did never use the words "Germanic race" nor did I refer to anything like that. But if you mean that a number of people dislike me much because of my opinion then this might well be true. But I expect from everybody that I communicate with that he can also behave factual because otherwise a communication is not possible and a waste of life time. eupator is - for whatever reason - not able to that and hence quitted as a conversation partner.



Exactly.

This forum is the tsyrk of trolls. I was one of them initially, but in the end I'm a lesser troll than many of you. I am interested in the origin of our language. We have a common language "indo-churka". This is a hot topic and very political. The more information the better.

[Gergő Marosvári]

Wow! I am not a fan of blue eyes but yours are beautiful!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thank you!

[rothaer]

Very quickly, w/o analyzing too much. Why PCAs like g25 suck.

G25 is not a PCA but a summarising of genetics in 25 dimensions and can be used for a number of calculations. A 2D PCA is always an incredible loss of information compared to having information in 25D but this has nothing with G25 to do, of course.

1) No imputation process.

Thanks god. Imputation is guesswork and has not to be mingled in to the hard data. The enormous wrongs of genetic imputations became visible in the desatrous matching results in the database of MyHeritage and others when they tried to fix the problem of a low SNP overlap between the OmniExpress chip and the GSA chip. This is why GEDmatch refrains from imputation.

2) No outgroup list of population sources to compare against, PCA overcompensates by creating unrealistic combos.

A Vahaduo calculator uses all 25 dimensions of G25 coords and as I pointed out, a 2D PCA has nothing to do in particular with G25 and exhibits always the known deficiences. Compared is everything in a calculator to the references that you put in there. Nothing hinders you to add Yoruba (and Chimpanzee?) there if that feels better.

3) Dimensional weights tweaked to suit the PCA author's biases (eg g25 data overfit Eastern Euro to distinguish them from Western Euro).

First, it's not the G25 data but a particular PCA, f. i. the so called North Europe PCA. But indeed also the definition of the 25 values (dimensions) is a wilful decision that has to be made.

Second, every PCA is even more and inevitably a wilful construction. You could have one million differently constructed PCAs that display the same G25 data in another manner. You will have to transfer from 25 dimensions to two dimensions what you intend to display and if Davidski wants to distinguish Eastern Euro from Western Euro he has, of course, to do exactly what you said. It's not an "overfit" then but the display of a particular aspect of the reality while loads of other aspects are not displayed, at least not in the same PCA.

4) All points in dimensional space are treated equally, with no method to mitigate lower SNP count VS higher SNP count (see 1).

Yes, there is then instead refrained from using kits with a too low SNP count. I understand well what is the intention of imputation and that might be meaningful before skipping an otherwise maybe important kit. But scientifically it gives some headache to "pollute" sequenced data with additional guesswork (imputation). However, in fact this is no problem specific to G25 because you can impute a low SNP count kit first (they do it at MyHeritage and they did it at DNA.Land) and then calculate the G25 coords.

5) Scaling of data with no penalisation, creating artificial entities.

I've not yet fully grasped that scaling and also not how the eigenvalues for the various dimensions are determined but actually the scaled coords are only an additional offer. You can also use the unscaled coords. Although I must say that they in my experiments did not yield convincing results.

Just to make it clear: Nothing of what I say means to reject qpAdm runs. I can not assess them and the only thing I know of them are their pretty rough results compared to other findings.

But we did not come from any statement that qpAdm is useless but that G25 is (figuratively) and this I can state that it is for sure not. In a Vahaduo run all 25 dimensions are calculated and the various results of people, Germans f. i. become so specific that I even can predict approximately from where in Germany they hail (if they just hail from one area). These predictions can easily be verfied or falsified due to the known ancestry of testees. I've a lot of testees with genealogically well known ancestry which means that there can be permanently cross-checked for plausibility. I've never heard of any such fine scale performance by qpAdm runs. The mentioned performance of G25 (also by K36 btw.) is a verified experience.

[kingmob]

snip

You are just clueless, you don't even understand what the usage of an outgroup list is for.

g25 is a PCA, you get your co-ordinates on the projection.

The rest of your answers are too dumb and pointless to address.

I posted my explanation not for you but for other people reading the thread.

[Ugo]

You are just clueless, you don't even understand what the usage of an outgroup list is for.

g25 is a PCA, you get your co-ordinates on the projection.

The rest of your answers are too dumb and pointless to address.

I posted my explanation not for you but for other people reading the thread.

My friend, eupator. I don't give a fuck about your Russian comrade ruski. You're behaving unworthily!