Which religion do you follow?

[Lulletje Rozewater]

Religious faith is oasis in the heart which will never be reached by a caravan of thinking.
Faith is in all cases a choice between pleasures of this world and the peace of the next world.
I chose both the delights of this world and the peace of the next.
For I know in my heart that I am my own Supreme being and wrote one song, and it scans perfectly and it also rhymes perfectly with the seasons following each other year in year out.
My quest to sit on God's left or right hand and say "Hi" to Peter is futile....I stole the pearly gates.
Years and years ago when God threw me a pebble,into its wondrous lake, I disturbed its surface with countless circles in the form of questions and questions.
But when I reached the depths I became very still and thought;"give me Atheism and I will outdare the night."

And here I am exceedingly keen,but dumb in my celestial bed

[SwordoftheVistula]

Great thread Loki!

Well being a French Canadian and being of a certain age as well, one cannot come into this life and not be baptised Roman Catholic and go through a considerable number of the rites of the RC Church (the Sacraments of Confession, Communion, Marriage). French Canadian culture and the Roman Catholic Church have been inextricably bound since dot. This has changed some though, since the Quiet Revolution of the 1960's; the Roman Catholic Church has suffered here in French Canada as elsewhere.

All of this to say that despite my being Heathen, I still carry an emotional attachment to the Roman Catholic Church inasmuch as my ethnic identity is that of French Canadian which always presupposes some relationship with the Roman Catholic Church, imho at any rate.

But despite my love for my culture, spiritually I have always had difficulty giving myself over to the Christian mindset that seemed to be my one and only option in life. For the longest time, before professing Heathenry as my 'religion', I called myself a generic Theist, believing in (a) Power(s) greater than myself/us but not having any name nor face. Little did I know that this was really my belief in the power and magic of Life and Ancestral Spirit. And when I did finally stumble upon an 'organised religion' (said tongue-in-cheek of Heathenry of course ) which could effectively, but more importantly, authentically bring my spiritual beliefs in line with my cultural ones, without one compromising the other, my Being had finally found its true Home.

With respect to my own metaphysical thoughts, I guess mine follow Psy's a bit in that I believe that energy/ies is/are the buzz of life, if you will, yet manifested in countless ways. Where my thoughts differ from Psy's perhaps have more to do with how our own individual minds can interpret these energy patterns. Much like a dog can hear some sounds which to the human ear are impossible to be detected, I also believe that the human body is limited in its ability to experience and/or perceive ALL manifestations (ie., different patternings) of energy. To me this has many implications with respect to views on the concept of the multiverse and the after-life, two concepts which I very much DO believe in.

There's probably more that I could rant on about but I'll close it for now.

Again, great thread Loki. Thanks!

Cheers for now!...Aemma

I chose Heathenism because although Catholicism coloured my life through culture and environment, I never felt truly connected to it. It is hard, though, to escape or not be affected by it to some degree, because if you belong to any of the French Canadian or Gaelic ethnic groups in this country, the Catholic Church is part of your life.

As much as I enjoy and have internalized the Odinist wheel of the year, I still enjoy those foods, activities, and celebrations that are a result of merging either the RC Church or Celtic Christianity with old pagan beliefs. I think many in the heathen community also feel this way but are reluctant to say it for fear of being criticized. Those folks are also my ancestors, and if I am going to revere and respect one, I should do so for all.

up

Why not both Roman Catholic and Heathen? That's how most of Asia and Africa is. Japan, for example, has had Buddhism and Shinto (their version of heathenism) alongside eachother for centuries and many people follow both. In Africa, it is not uncommon to find people with heathen, christian, and muslim charms to 'cover all the bases'

I suppose the coexistence in Japan and other Asian countries may have had to do with the peaceful and monastic nature of Buddhism, and thus it did not pose a threat to the divine status of the Emperor; in contrast to the situation in the west, where it was linked to a struggle for power between various tribes and kings-the Roman empire switched to Christianity as a way to gain control over an increasingly diverse empire, and later on northern kings switched to Christianity to gain support from the Catholic church and the 'civilized' world, later on the Protestant churches became a tool for northerners to achieve independence from the Latin world.

However this situation no longer exists in the west, as there is no longer much connection between religion and political power in most of the west.

However neopaganism is not exactly an uninterrupted base of knowledge. It will have to be built up again, truths rediscovered. What I am unwilling to case aside though, is the knowledge of scientific research which has opened up many secrets of life, previously only understood through religious mysticism. In many ways we are past that stage. Reverting back to a previous state of ignorance is not exactly wise.

That's a big question, if we are going to create a new religion, is it better to craft an entirely new religion (eg Creativity, and some would classify NS as this), or to dig up some old symbols to enhance the 'founding myths' of the new religion?

[Óttar]

I mentioned that in the ancient world it was possible for one to have multiple spiritual allegiances, but alas, one can't choose more than one with this poll.

[Loddfafner]

The poll is asking the wrong question. There may be religions one could follow, but a much more interesting question is which religion does one lead.

[Angantyr]

Many of the same criticisms could be leveled against Christianity as well. Christianity certainly has the advantage of having been juxtaposed within European culture for quite some time, but Hinduism certainly shares more fundamental similarities with the old pre-Christian religions of Europe.

But, I do level many of the same criticisms against Christianity.

[Aemma]

Why not both Roman Catholic and Heathen? That's how most of Asia and Africa is. Japan, for example, has had Buddhism and Shinto (their version of heathenism) alongside eachother for centuries and many people follow both. In Africa, it is not uncommon to find people with heathen, christian, and muslim charms to 'cover all the bases'

I can understand and appreciate what you are proposing here Sword but I don't necessarily agree with it. Furthermore, to use the example of Buddhism and Shinto is slightly misleading in that Buddhism is technically not considered a 'religion' per se, much like atheism or humanism are NOT religions per se.

I suppose the coexistence in Japan and other Asian countries may have had to do with the peaceful and monastic nature of Buddhism, and thus it did not pose a threat to the divine status of the Emperor; in contrast to the situation in the west, where it was linked to a struggle for power between various tribes and kings-the Roman empire switched to Christianity as a way to gain control over an increasingly diverse empire, and later on northern kings switched to Christianity to gain support from the Catholic church and the 'civilized' world, later on the Protestant churches became a tool for northerners to achieve independence from the Latin world.

However this situation no longer exists in the west, as there is no longer much connection between religion and political power in most of the west.

Agreed in terms of the previous connection between political power and the Church in our past history. However, from strictly a personal standpoint, there is the question of how I view my religion in terms of its primary purpose. Though I acknowledge that there is some element of the political in identifying oneself as Heathen (and I am only referring to a Folkish Heathen here), the spiritual dimension is much more important to me. In my opinion, the theologies of Christianity and Heathenry are very much mutually exclusive. I could never be of both spiritual persuasions in tandem and call myself an authentic follower of both traditions by the very fact that they are diametrically opposed spiritual belief systems. An excellent book which deals with the juxtapositions of Christianity and Heathenry is authored by Alain de Benoist entitled On Being Pagan. It is a truly excellent book which sets out the fundamental differences in thought between the desert creed and the folkish heathen one.

In my world, a Heathen worth his/her salt could not ever possibly hold authentic allegiances to both belief systems. I seriously cannot see how this could successfully done while keeping the integrity of either spiritual system intact.

That's a big question, if we are going to create a new religion, is it better to craft an entirely new religion (eg Creativity, and some would classify NS as this), or to dig up some old symbols to enhance the 'founding myths' of the new religion?

I surely hope that you are not referring to Heathenry as a "new" religion for it is very far from being such. Contrary to some New Age spiritual traditions that have popped up in the last while, Heathenry has been a Way of Life since the existence of our Folk. It is NOT a created religion but a reconstructed one. And these concepts are vastly different. The latter presupposes its prior existence in the anthropological history of a People while the former does not. And I think this is where as Heathens we have the most work to do: to educate our own Folk as to what our genuine pre-Christian pagan traditions and customs were/are and how they can be reclaimed without any political ideology associated with it.

Cheers Sword!...Aemma

[Solwyn]

Why not both Roman Catholic and Heathen? That's how most of Asia and Africa is. Japan, for example, has had Buddhism and Shinto (their version of heathenism) alongside eachother for centuries and many people follow both. In Africa, it is not uncommon to find people with heathen, christian, and muslim charms to 'cover all the bases'

I suppose the coexistence in Japan and other Asian countries may have had to do with the peaceful and monastic nature of Buddhism, and thus it did not pose a threat to the divine status of the Emperor; in contrast to the situation in the west, where it was linked to a struggle for power between various tribes and kings-the Roman empire switched to Christianity as a way to gain control over an increasingly diverse empire, and later on northern kings switched to Christianity to gain support from the Catholic church and the 'civilized' world, later on the Protestant churches became a tool for northerners to achieve independence from the Latin world.

However this situation no longer exists in the west, as there is no longer much connection between religion and political power in most of the west.


That's a big question, if we are going to create a new religion, is it better to craft an entirely new religion (eg Creativity, and some would classify NS as this), or to dig up some old symbols to enhance the 'founding myths' of the new religion?

I don't mix and match in the way you are suggesting because whether you want to call it Odinism, Asatru, or garden variety heathenism, it has a completely different world view than Roman Catholicism or Christianity. Were it not for the fact that it makes my family happy, I would quite honestly have nothing to do with any Catholic or Christian tradition, period. As it is, I enjoy them simply because 98% of my family goes to church and these moments bring them together; we live all over the world. These are also the days that I get off because most of Canadian society follows these holidays and celebrations, even though most don't have two sweet clues as to why.

I don't acknowledge Christmas because I believe in Christ, for example, because I believe Jesus Christ to be a fabrication cut and pasted from Egyptian mythology. I attend family dinners and celebrations to see family, not because I'm dying to rejoice about Jesus. Since these also mark culturally acceptable moments of celebration where I live, at 37 years of age I am used to them. Basically, when my parents are gone and I don't have them to make happy, there will be no more acknowledgment of it. As a family we have our Yule celebration and rejoice in the rebirth of the SUN, which makes a lot more sense to me, because I can see THAT reflected in reality. In fact, all of the Odinist holidays make more sense to me, and the more I show them to my parents, they see why.

There is no way I could reconcile two religions, especially when they teach such differing world views. Stand up and be strong vs turn the other cheek and take it? Woman is inherently weak and evil? We are born full of sin? Doesn't work for me. Besides, if we are to believe in the validity of Christianity as a religion, then it is the natural and organic religion of a specific group of people in the Middle East. It is their heathen religion, not mine. I have no Middle Eastern heritage, therefore this is not my way. Their myths and beliefs do not inform or support my language, culture, or ancestral history. We may not see anymore, just how grafting a stranger faith over our people has contributed to the breakdown of our various societies because after several centuries of Christian domination we are used to it.

If the Asians do it, good for them. I've had a few students that were from Vietnam that were Christian. They were quite concerned, fearfully so, that I might not be Christian, too, because I wear a hammer. I don't discuss my beliefs at work because I am a teacher and even though my students are adults, it is still inappropriate. When one student did some homework on my jewelry and discovered it's meaning, I was inundated with demands that I renounce my evil ways and submit to Jesus Christ. I asked them about their ancestral gods and got even more FEAR. "Oh no, that is superstitious and wrong, we could never....blah. blah. blah....." I see.....so you can trade one set of "superstitions", one that at the very least is supported and informed by your language, culture, and worldview, and give them up for a completely different one that leaves you too effing paralyzed to think.

Whatever.

[Lulletje Rozewater]

I flew once with Egypt Air to Cairo and stayed at the Möwen Pick Hotel.
They asked me at the reception whether I was a Christian or Muslim.
Look at my nose,I said--------I am a jewish apostate.
Dead Silence-bar bar bar beep beep-was their blabbering in Egyptian.
The receptionist asked what an apostate was.
It is a jew with a prostate,I replied.
Oh, yes,well we would advise you not to visit the inner city.
What a dump this Cairo is.
10.000.000 people smelling like a Papyrus drenched in goats milk

[Ulf]

I just make it up as I go.

[SwordoftheVistula]

I could never be of both spiritual persuasions in tandem and call myself an authentic follower of both traditions by the very fact that they are diametrically opposed spiritual belief systems.

There is no way I could reconcile two religions, especially when they teach such differing world views.

They're still far closer to eachother than Shinto is to Buddhism. Buddhism is like Christianity without the old testament, and Shinto is a very militant and nationalist religion.