Where did haplogroup E1b1b in Europeans come from?

[VikLevaPatel]

Natufians

Yes, I'm seeing that in my latest Y-DNA report from the Origene lab in Mauritius. (https://www.origene.mu/)

The laboratory is fully accredited, and they gave me the best Y-DNA report I've ever had in my life. Hallelujah! Hallelujah! :fpope::angel:

It should pointed out, however, that as we go down through the branches of the genetic tree, , or, more precisely, as we follow the line of descent of the E haplogroup, we will see that it is "actually Proto-Semitic". The Origene report identifies it as such.

:salam::jewish:

I'll post more details later, and I'll post a full report here.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?363927-GENETIC-REPORTS-AND-ANALYSES-AND-LOVING-LINEAGE-AND-HERITAGE-WITH-ALL-YOUR-HEART-AND-SOUL&p=7541179#post7541179

Within haplogroup E (https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0016073#:~:text=Within%20haplogroup%2 0E%2C%20which%20represents%20the%20majority%20of%2 0the%20Y%20chromosomes%20found%20in%20Africa%2C%20 E1b1%20is%20the%20haplogroup%20which%20has%20the%2 0greatest%20geographic%20distribution.%20), which represents the majority of the Y chromosomes found in Africa, E1b1 (https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0016073#:~:text=Within%20haplogroup%2 0E%2C%20which%20represents%20the%20majority%20of%2 0the%20Y%20chromosomes%20found%20in%20Africa%2C%20 E1b1%20is%20the%20haplogroup%20which%20has%20the%2 0greatest%20geographic%20distribution.%20) is the haplogroup which has the greatest geographic distribution.

And, as expected, and I realize this is simplifying things (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3583733/#:~:text=As%20expected%20according%20to%20%5B%202% 5D%2C%20the%20Africans%20belongs%20to%20haplogroup s%20A%2C%20B%20or%20E%2C%20the%20Europeans%20mainl y%20to%20haplogroups%20R%20and%20I%2C%20and%20the% 20Asians%20mainly%20to%20haplogroups%20O%2C%20D%20 and%20C.%20), the Africans belongs to haplogroups A, B or E, the Europeans mainly to haplogroups R and I, and the Asians mainly to haplogroups O, D and C.

That's over simplifying, of course. And, for the most part, this involves simplifying things.

Belonging is important and I belong to three Y-haplogroups, viz. C, E1b1b, and R1b.

See these posts (https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?358151-Y-SNP-SUPPLEMENT-TO%97NOT-A-REPLACEMENT-FOR%97Y-STR&p=7530192#post7530192) to get a better understanding of this.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?358151-Y-SNP-SUPPLEMENT-TO%97NOT-A-REPLACEMENT-FOR%97Y-STR&p=7530192#post7530192

It is hard to overemphasize the impact of this point on discussions of haplogroups and sub-haplogroups and their relation to STR and SNP genotypes and haplotypes:

STR markers mutate rapidly, at a rate of once every 20 generations. Fast mutating STR markers can be used to trace recent ancestry, within the past hundreds of years. SNP markers mutate very slowly, once every few thousand years. Slow mutating SNP markers can only trace deep ancestry from thousands of years ago, and do not provide any information on recent ancestral events.

https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?358151-Y-SNP-SUPPLEMENT-TO%97NOT-A-REPLACEMENT-FOR%97Y-STR&p=7530192#post7530192


Although most of the data sets in our study define the deep ancestry of the phylogeny, they still shed some information to our interpretations of recent phenomena such as the current genetic diversity of the E haplogroup in an implication to the origin and spread of Afro-Asiatic languages and to the history of pastoralism.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4231410/#:~:text=Although%20most%20of%20the%20data%20sets% 20in%20our%20study%20define%20the%20deep%20ancestr y%20of%20the%20phylogeny%2C%20they%20still%20shed% 20some%20information%20to%20our%20interpretations% 20of%20recent%20phenomena%20such%20as%20the%20curr ent%20genetic%20diversity%20of%20the%20E%20haplogr oup%20in%20an%20implication%20to%20the%20origin%20 and%20spread%20of%20Afro-Asiatic%20languages%20and%20to%20the%20history%20o f%20pastoralism.%20


Intuitively, the high correlation between geographical distribution of some of the major E haplogroups and distribution of Afro-Asiatic languages, exemplary of established correlation between languages and genes as proposed by Cavalli-Sforza prompted us to revisit such correlation in a multidisciplinary platform better suited to unravel hitherto untold chapters of human history.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4231410/#:~:text=Intuitively%2C%20the%20high%20correlation %20between%20geographical%20distribution%20of%20so me%20of%20the%20major%20E%20haplogroups%20and%20di stribution%20of%20Afro-Asiatic%20languages%2C%20exemplary%20of%20establis hed%20correlation%20between%20languages%20and%20ge nes%20as%20proposed%20by%20Cavalli-Sforza%20prompted%20us%20to%20revisit%20such%20cor relation%20in%20a%20multidisciplinary%20platform%2 0better%20suited%20to%20unravel%20hitherto%20untol d%20chapters%20of%20human%20history.%20


This paragroup, although very rare, being reported so far in two Saudi Arabian samples (Abu-Amero et al. 2009) and one southern African Bantu (Karafet et al. 2008), is of crucial relevance for phylogeographic inferences about the origin of haplogroup E and linked hypotheses about movements out of and back to Africa (Hammer et al.1998; Underhill and Kivisild 2007; Scozzari et al. 2014).
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4524485/#:~:text=This%20paragroup%2C%20although%20very%20r are%2C%20being%20reported%20so%20far%20in%20two%20 Saudi%20Arabian%20samples%20(Abu-Amero%20et%20al.%202009)%20and%20one%20southern%20 African%20Bantu%20(Karafet%20et%20al.%202008)%2C%2 0is%20of%20crucial%20relevance%20for%20phylogeogra phic%20inferences%20about%20the%20origin%20of%20ha plogroup%20E%20and%20linked%20hypotheses%20about%2 0movements%20out%20of%20and%20back%20to%20Africa%2 0(Hammer%20et%20al.1998%3B%20Underhill%20and%20Kiv isild%202007%3B%20Scozzari%20et%20al.%202014).%20

[Dimitri159]

What we know for certainty is that E1b1b carriers are very prone to criminal activities and Islam: Somalis, Albanians, Kosovars, North-Africans, etc. They are usually very ectomorph too for some reason.

Some of those countries listed are ectomorph because they’re malnourished, not much to do with their haplogroup. Most countries in Europe with the E1b1b type are medium to tall and range from all body types; Greece, Albania, etc.

FYI slender builds are more common in Southern Europe because they have the healthiest diets. Robust dad-body’s are a sign of working-class people with unhealthy diets and beer drinking habits (Americans and Northern Europe). Gracile>Robust.

[Dimitri159]

Not in the same amounts.

I can’t speak for the rest, but depending on which region Greeks have even more amount of E-V13 than Albanians, reaching 31% in Thessaly and Epirus. For the Peloponnese and Sterea it is 25%. Greece is a bigger country than Albania in terms of both landmass and especially population, so overall Albanians have a little bit more E1b1 per-capita when all regions of Greece are put together on a scale. But the numbers are still close enough to say the there is no significant difference.

[Dimitri159]

EV13 can found mostly in Balkans and have 0% African genes ,
Eupedia write that is came with indoeuropeans

No. Eupedia noted that the Indo-Europeans eventually carried some EV13 along the way. But it did not originate from them nor was it brought to the Balkans by them. It’s more likely that it originated somewhere in the Levant and was brought to the Balkans with the spread Anatolian Farmers prior to or during the arrival of Indo-Europeans entering the Balkan area & being introduced to the haplogroup.

The Indo-Europeans are known for introducing the R1 haplogroup to the Balkan area, and of course the rest of Europe.

[Roy]

I am EV-13 myself which is apparently really rare among ethnic Poles and I have not come across another Polish forum member with it (also including a few other message boards).

[Voskos]

West Asia, except for E-M81 which is Northwest African.

[Defcon2]

From Africa.

[Bart0s]

I am EV-13 myself which is apparently really rare among ethnic Poles and I have not come across another Polish forum member with it (also including a few other message boards).

According to these nutcases every E-V13 is Thracian :lol:

[Florin Radu]

I am EV-13 myself which is apparently really rare among ethnic Poles and I have not come across another Polish forum member with it (also including a few other message boards).

Are you from Southern Poland or in anyway connected to the Goral community? Carpathian Vlach migration seems like good guess.

[Gallop]

From different historical periods starting from early times onwards.

For example in my case that I am E-V22 I get delta 0 by order of closeness to:


Y-DNA Matches

Males inherit a Y-chromosome haplogroup from their father which represents the all male lineage.

If you have had your Y-haplogroup tested, you can enter the result here to find matches with the same haplogroup.
Females who have had a direct male relative (e.g. father, brother, uncle) tested can also use those results.


DELTA 0

Sample Match #285
Migration Period Sipar Croatia - R3664

Belgae + Boii (9.98)
1. Southwest_French (13.56)

Sample Match #508
Late-Roman Era Montefrio Granada - I3579

Visigoth + Volcae (13.77)
1. Spanish_Aragon (11.79)

Sample Match #831
Late-Roman Era Montefrio Granada - I3583

Latin + Phoenician (5.101)
1. Spanish_Cantabria (18.65)
2. Spanish_Aragon (18.66)
3. Spanish_Andalucia (18.94)

Sample Match #559
Medieval Tyrolian - SZ18

Visigoth + Frank (4.203)
Frank + Pannonian (4.415)
Visigoth + Pannonian (4.64)
Frank + Scordisci (4.672)
1. French (5.382)


DELTA 1


Thracian Kapitan Andreevo Bulgaria - I19494
Imperial Roman Era Zadar Ulica Croatia - R3745
Iron Age Vekerzug Komarno Slovakia - I14465
Iron Age Celtic Hungary Gyor-Moson-Sopron - I18527
Early Medieval Venosa Italy - VEN008
Girona Sant Julia de Ramis - I10853
Early Medieval Iberia Granada - I3981
Viking Age Bogovej Langeland Denmark - VK362

And a long e.t.c. besides increasing the delta 2,3, e.t.c.

With this Delta 4 for example, I also have Deep Dive:

Iron Age Hillfort Croatia Kriz Brdovecki Sava Valley - I5724

Gallo-Roman + Illyrian (1.795)
1. Spanish_Cataluña (5.736)


For example this sample that appears in bold and comes out if I click on the button to show all the samples I get Delta 0 but by haplogroup, it does not appear as a match in more than 1000 old matches because we should no longer share anything by autosomal DNA and for that reason I do not get this sample in match; even if we have the same haplogroup.


Ptolemaic Egypt - JK2888
E1b1b1a1b2-V22 - delta:0


When all this started, if I remember correctly, it was more than 10 years talking about haplogroups, many were affected and marked in those years and came to think that haplogroups were everything or that everything was already done, which is obviously not the case, as we have seen later.

My entry by haplogroup in Europe would be in early times, I have been given for Spain the entry in Roman times but I do not agree since I consider that it is in modern times.

[Roy]

Are you from Southern Poland or in anyway connected to the Goral community? Carpathian Vlach migration seems like good guess.

I am not.

[Marshall Theodore]

Africa

[Jingle Bell]

From EEF, later from N. Africans, Levantines and Arabs

[Florin Radu]

I am not.


https://youtu.be/DujzIQ-ZcWE