N2 in ethnic Serbs

[Shubotai]

N2-Y6503> subclade N-P189.2
Different than N1 found in Asia and Finno-Ugrics

Found in Europe, mostly ethnic Serbs from Montenegro, Republika Srpska, Vojvodina and Croatia
A basal sample of N* from the Botai culture might belong to N2
Ancestral branches found in Russia

100160
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[Terminator98]

Definitely most interesting Haplo in Europe. I'm imagining how one Siberian came to Balkan and made offsprings with Balkan woman/women during early Neolithic. :1127:

[Ülev]

Laag-ids

[Dušan]

Thats how cca 1-2% of Siberian component in our autosomal genetics came here.

[Ford]

It's a very cool and mysterious haplogroup.

https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/000/615/323/027.jpg

[CommonSense]

There's a few lone carriers of that haplo in western Europe. I wonder how and when it got there.

[Shubotai]

It is now present in all Balkan peoples also with a low frequency 4% in Serbians from Republika Srpska, 3-4% in Bosnians and Croatians, 2-3% in Serbians, 2% in Albanians, 1% in North Macedonians, 1% Greeks and <0.5% in Bulgarians and Romanians but there is also N1 in Eastern Balkans. The ancestral subclades of N2-Y6516>7310 are from Romania and Rostov Oblast in Russia. And the western European samples are from a subclade parallel to it. And what haplogroup could Milan Stanković be? It would be nice if the Serbian Poreklo DNA project could test him.

[vbnetkhio]

It is now present in all Balkan peoples also with a low frequency 4% in Serbians from Republika Srpska, 3-4% in Bosnians and Croatians, 2-3% in Serbians, 2% in Albanians, 1% in North Macedonians, 1% Greeks and <0.5% in Bulgarians and Romanians

what's the source for this?

[Shubotai]

This map (https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=100162&d=1593277127) is from a topic (https://forum.poreklo.rs/index.php?topic=216.0) in the poreklo forum, the discussion is in Serbian.

This is about its distribution, but when searching for its origins we have to rule out Balkan areas that it was spread later like Greece where it probably came with Serbians in the 13th century and try to connect it with an asiatic tribe during the Middle Ages, maybe Avars, some other tribe that went unrecorded or even some persons that came as part of another group in the northern Balkans. The most basal sample of N2* was found in Altai and I think there is a new one from Kazakhstan.

[Aren]

There's an Assyrian from Kirkuk, Iraq that is N-P189.2*, he's on Y-Full. Never thought it would show up among us. His autosomal scores are typical with no recent European.

[vbnetkhio]

This map (https://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=100162&d=1593277127) is from a topic (https://forum.poreklo.rs/index.php?topic=216.0) in the poreklo forum, the discussion is in Serbian.

This is about its distribution, but when searching for its origins we have to rule out Balkan areas that it was spread later and try to connect it with an asiatic tribe during the Middle Ages, maybe Avars, some other tribe that went unrecorded or even some persons that came as part of another group in the northern Balkans.

this is an "interpolation map"

each of those black dots represent a dna study, and the purple areas and the percentages are predicted by an algorithm based on those few studies.
as you can see there are no dots in Albania and Macedonia so that's just the algorithms guessing.
also you can see for Croatia the percentage for the whole country is predicted based just on the Serb-populated areas.

In actual studies on Croats it was found only in the West (Rijeka region) with 1-2%, and virtually absent in the rest of the country.

[Shubotai]

Yes, it mostly shows in Chakavian area but even there I think it's from ethnic Serbs from Republika Srpska. Within this community though, I believe its ultimate origin is attributed in North Montenegro (https://www.poreklo.rs/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Crna_Gora_-_Genetsko_poreklo_stanovnistva_1913_1.png). Vojvodina might also be a key region in how it came to Serbs initially.

[vbnetkhio]

Yes, it mostly shows in Chakavian area but even there I think it's from ethnic Serbs from Republika Srpska. Within this community though, I believe its ultimate origin is attributed in North Montenegro (https://www.poreklo.rs/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Crna_Gora_-_Genetsko_poreklo_stanovnistva_1913_1.png).

Yes, in Serbs and their neighbours it's all from the Banjani tribe, which was founded in the late medieval times, and expanded and migrated around since.
It ultimately comes down to just one mediaval man who lived in that area (the founder of the tribe).

The question is how he got there.

[vbnetkhio]

btw, there was a N2 sample in Iron age Hungary , but it's too low quality to predict if it's also Y6503.

[vbnetkhio]

https://i.imgur.com/0Iub2PM.png

^this is the most up to date map.
the green points are single samples.

[CommonSense]

Judging by the origin of the present-day carriers, this branch was probably spread by early Indo-Europeans.

[Dick]

Judging by the origin of the present-day carriers, this branch was probably spread by early Indo-Europeans.

Or perhaps illyrianz. There was a supposed female Illyrian kit with low snps that was deleted from gedmatch that came out as Finnish arctic or something. Maybe vbnetkio knows

[CommonSense]

Or perhaps illyrianz. There was a supposed female Illyrian kit with low snps that was deleted from gedmatch that came out as Finnish arctic or something. Maybe vbnetkio knows

I meant in general. I'd assume they branched off in three groups from the Black Sea area - one went to western Europe, the other to the Balkans and the third to the Middle East. Illyrians were the only Indo-European group that we know in this part of the Balkans, meaning they may as well have been the ones to bring it here.

[Dick]

I meant in general. I'd assume they branched off in three groups from the Black Sea area - one went to western Europe, the other to the Balkans and the third to the Middle East. Illyrians were the only Indo-European group that we know in this part of the Balkans, meaning they may as well have been the ones to bring it here.

Anything is possible to find In the Dinaric mountains even pyramids. This dude was obviously a unicorn and a pro fucker.

[Shubotai]

The best linguistic match seems to be the East Herzegovinian (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Shtokavian_dialects.svg) dialect.

And there is a word for horse in some slavic and ugric languages, losh, that can not be traced back to any known language family and could have come from the Botai culture.