African admixture in Southern Europeans

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Originally Posted by AR89

You are making a poor show, Southern Euro are not less intelligent or lazy than other Europeans (especially the first).

Even if it was true, it would still to be proven that there is a correspondence between admixture and intelligence.

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Negroids are much less intelligent then Caucasoids and East Asians (averege IQ in Africa is around 65), southern europeans (except Italians) have much lower IQ than Northens, read Richard Lynn, Germans and Dutch have 108 while Greeks only 92...
Northen Europeans are more hard-working people have a more civilzed beahviour etc...
Why do you think it happen so? negroids are the most uncivilized,stupid and lazy people in the world, so according to logic southern europeans are so backwards also because of this slight SSA admixture...

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Originally Posted by Zarathustra

Negroids are much less intelligent then Caucasoids and East Asians (averege IQ in Africa is around 65), southern europeans (except Italians) have much lower IQ than Northens, read Richard Lynn, Germans and Dutch have 108 while Greeks only 92...
Northen Europeans are more hard-working people have a more civilzed beahviour etc...

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IQ is only about 70% genetic. I doubt 1-2% African ancestry will affect the allelic frequencies of IQ determining genes at significant numbers. Chances are that IQ in these Southern European countries are lower because of socioeconomic status. Pre-natal and child development vastly affect IQ.

Sub-Saharan African ancestry in Southern Europe is likely so ancient and in such small amount that it has virtually NO effect on anyone's self-identification, lives, etc. so why even mention it really?

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Originally Posted by Zarathustra

Negroids are much less intelligent then Caucasoids and East Asians (averege IQ in Africa is around 65), southern europeans (except Italians) have much lower IQ than Northens, read Richard Lynn, Germans and Dutch have 108 while Greeks only 92...
Northen Europeans are more hard-working people have a more civilzed beahviour etc...
Why do you think it happen so? negroids are the most uncivilized,stupid and lazy people in the world, so according to logic southern europeans are so backwards also because of this slight SSA admixture...

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Do not put logic, Rychard Lynn and your fantasy theories in the same post.

Richard Lynn is a fine clown, the science community regards is studies as pure bullshits.

The "fact" that SE has less IQ than NE doesn't mean that it's because of their admixture, it has to be proven, you're only supposing.
You even contradict yourself, Spanish people have less admixture than Italians and yet we have an higher IQ (according to that bullshits studies of Lynn).

The only thing that count is science, and here there are only nordicist theories and hypothesis, we are very far from the truth.

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Originally Posted by AR89

Do not put logic, Rychard Lynn and your fantasy theories in the same post.

Richard Lynn is a fine clown, the science community regards is studies as pure bullshits.

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You have to consider Northen and Central Italians that lacks completely of any african admixture, in fact higher IQ in Italy is found in Friuli and Veneto and lower in Sicily (86)

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Originally Posted by Zarathustra

You have to consider Northen and Central Italians that lacks completely of any african admixture, in fact higher IQ in Italy is found in Friuli and Veneto and lower in Sicily (86)

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Again, isn't there a socioeconomic divide between Northern and Southern Italy?

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Originally Posted by Zarathustra

You have to consider Northen and Central Italians that lacks completely of any african admixture, in fact higher IQ in Italy is found in Friuli and Veneto and lower in Sicily (86)

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Your first sentence is false, they have admixture, and even more than spaniards.

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Originally Posted by Stefan

Again, isn't there a socioeconomic divide between Northern and Southern Italy?

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Of course there is.

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Originally Posted by Lábaru

what are you talking about? of course we have the tools, are you relying on the imagination to say that crap?

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Autosomal admix results that Dodecad presents tells only very recent admixture not ancient ones.Even Finns have a linkage toward Red Sea do not mention the Iberians who will shift both toward North Africa and WestAfrica at lesser extent.

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Obviously you are an American, probably mixed with a lot of bloods and you are projecting your personal insecurity in us. :picard1::picard1::picard1: Typical behavior of mestizos.

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The Bass is not mestizo and he didn't made those tags.Let the admins check who made them.

I don't know if Bulgaria is included in that, since we are a South-Eastern country, but here we didn't have any contacts with Africans in the past, so such admixture is most likely non-existant.

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Originally Posted by Lithium

I don't know if Bulgaria is included in that, since we are a South-Eastern country, but here we didn't have any contacts with Africans in the past, so such admixture is most likely non-existant.

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Here you got your connection.

http://wanclik.free.fr/eupedia_fichiers/image012.gif

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Originally Posted by Lithium

Should I feel bad now? There is no such thing in my country :D

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Bulgaria=30% E1b1b1a2.

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Originally Posted by Mordid

That's funny you say that because Southern Europe have higher percent of Semitic/J Haplogroup than Poland:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...28Y-DNA%29.svg

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J haplogroup spread out from Levant/Mesopotamia long before the semitic peoples aroused out from somewhere in the arabian peninsula. Moreover J and other near-eastern haplogroups has not remained unchanged and have geographically derivated into local sub-haplogroups which enable to know which haplos come with Neolithic farmers and which ones come in i.e. Southern Spain with moors.

J haplogroups in South Europe and elsewhere in Europe has nothing to do with semitics.

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Originally Posted by Charlie Bass

Here you got your connection.

http://wanclik.free.fr/eupedia_fichiers/image012.gif

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This Map departs from North Africa, No SSA Africa area shown. And for cause; E1b1 sub-haplo begin spliting into E1b1a and E1b1b branches by 45-40 kya ago; long time before human populations begun differenciating into modern physical types from the generalized Homo Sapiens (which metrically gathered morphological traits of all the living human types of today).
Hg E1b1b is not considered as an indicator of Africana dmixture; If you have a careful red to papers dealing with male Sub-Saharian admixture, the Hg from the E1b1b family are never taken as indicators of Black African admixture.
Not to tell that since at least 3 years ago most eminent genetitians like Cavalli-Sforza are working the hypothesis that haplogroup E migrated back from West-Eurasia to Africa:

It is also interesting to
sum the distributions of different haplogroups descending from the
same mutation, as for example D and E, which both descend from
DE-YAP, the first mutation that split into the E branch that
perhaps returned to Africa (or arose there), whereas the other
branch, D, is found today mainly in the Himalayas and Japan.

(from: Y chromosome diversity, human expansion, drift,
and cultural evolution; Jacques Chiaronia, Peter A. Underhillb, and Luca L. Cavalli-Sforzac, September 26, 2009.)

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Originally Posted by AR89

Your first sentence is false, they have admixture, and even more than spaniards.

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Moorjani's study is clear.
North Italians have less SS African mixture than Iberians or Southern Italians though they do have some.

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Originally Posted by Charlie Bass

Bulgaria=30% E1b1b1a2.

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European clade.
Split 16.000 years ago.

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Originally Posted by Libertas

Moorjani's study is clear.
North Italians have less SS African mixture than Iberians or Southern Italians though they do have some.

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Now someone should prove the correlation between admixture and lower IQ (pure idiocy).

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Originally Posted by Incal

If this is true... Then why are Southern Europeans superior to Slavs (who are supposed to be über pure) in any possible way?

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i exagerated a bit but i actually was trolling Bass (so don't take my words seriously)...
I don't know what's he is trying to proof anyway, if he thinks that glory of ancient Greece and Rome, the reinaissance ecc belongs to SSA then he is very wrong.
Anyway even Slavs aren't an homogeneus group, and maybe some slavs groups are less advanced than some southern euro groups (you can't compare Tuscanians and Lombards with Bulgarians and Macedonians for example but either you can't compare Czech and Campanians...)

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Originally Posted by Sigur

Mordid is part black, :eek:

My blackk brothaaaa welcome home nigga :cool::thumbs up

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Yeaaaaa Mordid my homie, we're more brothers than we think dawg, come hug me bro!

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Originally Posted by Zarathustra

Negro blood makes civilizations death even if the percentage is very small, WASPS were right to apply the one drope rule...

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I think that they cannot unfortunately understand the foundation of the Western civilisation and culture, for example there is no way that they can understand properly or accept on the whole what have said European philosophers as Nietzsche (;)), that's simply genetic. And for the half-breeds, they have not so many choices it seems, or they blend into the ignorant and idealistic mass of the World, or they isolate themselves from everything and end up dying in dementia.

It's impossible to judge whether "Slavs" or "Mediterraneans" are objectively superior, because both of those groups are so racially heterogeneous (and culturally even more so) that they cannot be counted as single units.

That being said, I mostly concur with the poster who said that the Lombards and Tuscans are clearly superior to Bulgarians and Ukrainians, whereas the Czechs are superior to Southern Italy's racial dregs. It is too complex to be an "either or" issue.

The first one that attempts to derail this thread again will see a very ugly side of me. That's not a threat but a promise.

Carry on, gentlemen.

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Originally Posted by Tuan Belanda

The first one that attempts to derail this thread again will see a very ugly side of me. That's not a threat but a promise.

Carry on, gentlemen.

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Why this post was not deleted too ?

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Originally Posted by ~Nik~

Why this post was not deleted too ?

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Thanks :)

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Originally Posted by Zarathustra

Why do you think it happen so? negroids are the most uncivilized,stupid and lazy people in the world, so according to logic southern europeans are so backwards also because of this slight SSA admixture...

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I understand the point you're making. The notion that Southern Italians have significant Sub-Saharan African ancestry was created to imply that the reason for Southern Italy's lack of recent prosperity, rising poverty and organized crime was due to this admixture. Therefore the notion is more racist towards black people than it is towards Italians.

Charlie Bass failing to realize that, as he is more concerned with trying to get back at the Southern Europeans that hold bigoted views themselves. So this is his attempt at "trolling". But ironically he is perpetuating a myth/notion that is more racist towards his people.

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Originally Posted by Charlie Bass

The Bass is not mestizo and he didn't made those tags.Let the admins check who made them.

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You're not Charlie bass, are you? :) I don't remember Bass referring to himself in the third person so much, from the posts I've read of his elsewhere. Also, he knows how to put a space in between full stops and commas.

But Bass is more or less a "Mestizo", like all African Americans he has significant and recent European admixture. He is probably no more than 70% African on 23andme. I wouldn't be surprised if he is a more European derived African American. It could explain a few things.

:p

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Originally Posted by Lábaru

We are all mixed with Asian and African DNA but a 1-2% not is a nightmare, is acceptable.

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And the admixture is extremely old (Mesolithic / Neolithic). What's the deal with Afrocentrics taking a grain of sand and attempting to make a mountain out of it? Sick!

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Originally Posted by CircassianWine

Southern Europeans, do have some SSA influence, they also have higher affinity to North Africa and SSA Africa, which reflects ancient and recent admixture. Denying this is foolish.

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It's been shown time and time again that the huge majority of SSA admixture in ALL Euos is very ancient.

The ssa admixture is insifnigicant, about 0.02% in southern-Europe (see the study of Gonzalez-Perez et al. 2010)

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Originally Posted by Sunphq

I

Charlie Bass failing to realize that, as he is more concerned with trying to get back at the Southern Europeans that hold bigoted views themselves. So this is his attempt at "trolling". But ironically he is perpetuating a myth/notion that is more racist towards his people.


:p

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That was exactly my point, he even didn't answer to my challenging post...

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Originally Posted by Sigur

People can't just be banned for posting something you don't agree with, unless he/she has offended a member or staff.

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Professional forums like DNA-Forums ban people for being intellectually dishonest. This character Bass is posting decontextualized, exaggerated data for the most part. That's intellectual dishonesty.

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Originally Posted by Charlie Bass

It's not just that.It is showed only 1-2% because we don't have tools to measure deep ancestry admixture.When we will have.African will be even greater in Southern Europeans.



The Bass is not a provocateur.If EastAfricans are admixed and all the time Euros point about that then why Southern Europeans are so touchy about their admixture?

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Rubbish.

Get out the bongo drums and celebrate your admixture:D

Being ancient it has little/no phenotypical impact though.

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Originally Posted by Triton

Being ancient it has little/no phenotypical impact though.

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This admxture is supposed to came from North Africans during the middle ages (Saracens in Italy and Moor in Spain) but i don't think it could be possible for some reasons:

From a phenotypical point of view North Africans don't look too much west african influenced, they sometimes can resembling depigmentated aethiopids (but more like due to southwest asian admixture in the last ones than non-caucasoid admixture in the first ones) thought, anyway their SSA admixture is lower than 10% (in the case of Algerians,Tunisians and Northen Moroccans especially) in the middle ages
their SSA admix was more likely to be lower (remember that SSA admixture was brought in the Magreb due to arab slave trade) so if Southern Europeans should have 1-3% SSA admix they should have heavy moor/saracen ancestry that they don't have.
Moors didn't colonized their lands they just imposed their culture over the locals, and saracens did some sporadical rape, but that's not enough to change genetic composition of southern euro countries, so cosnidering that Saracens and Moors were even less SSA admixed than modern North Africans there's no way they could left 1-3% of SSA ancestry in Southern Europeans.
In fact in dodecad all Europeans had 0% of SSA ancestry, only Iberians have a little bit more than 0% (like 0,002% or something along that line) from the paleolithic (and this admixture has nothing to do with modern SSA that have traces of admixture from other ''archaic humans'' like herectus, somewhat like 2%).
For example Scottish or Orcadians don't have any siberian admix even thought they are partly Norse (Norwegians) that score a bit of this admixture and the Norse admixture in Scottish/Orcadians is infinitely higher than the moors/saracen admixture in Southern Europeans...

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Originally Posted by Charlie Bass

Source



Pure Southern Europeans=RIP

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I don't understand how the administration of this forum can ban DALTON FURY and keep you around.. :picard1:
I see this forum being flooded by black Africans in a near future.
I guess it is ok to say you are black and proud a put lies out there to make it seem true.

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Originally Posted by Thunor

The forum should really have drawn the line after Turks. Admitting in pavement-apes from the ghetto onto an European forum is really absurd.

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This is just a reflection of what is going to happen to Europe. I guess this forum administration doesn't want to be called racist. Yet there are African forums that wouldn't let one European join.

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Originally Posted by Gloriana Jacinto

This is just a reflection of what is going to happen to Europe. I guess this forum administration doesn't want to be called racist. Yet there are African forums that wouldn't let one European join.

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This forum's administration isn't racist.

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Originally Posted by Thunor

The forum should really have drawn the line after Turks. Admitting in pavement-apes from the ghetto onto an European forum is really absurd.

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Excuse me? Calling other people apes doesn't exactly make you sound civilized.

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Originally Posted by Charlie Bass

It's not just that.It is showed only 1-2% because we don't have tools to measure deep ancestry admixture.When we will have.African will be even greater in Southern Europeans.



The Bass is not a provocateur.If EastAfricans are admixed and all the time Euros point about that then why Southern Europeans are so touchy about their admixture?

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There are southern Euros that are are not admixed. Stop saying something that is not true.
The Spanish would kill Africans before they step foot in Spain.

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Originally Posted by Gloriana Jacinto

I don't understand how the administration of this forum can ban DALTON FURY and keep you around.. :picard1:

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He was a known troll in disguise as someone else.

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I see this forum being flooded by black Africans in a near future.

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Fear not, little damsel ... I'll protect you darlings. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Loki

This forum's administration isn't racist.

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Of course it isn't. In fact it is letting an African come in and say they are going to take over southern Europeans.