Actual Importance of Haplogroups

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Originally Posted by kessaras

I am waiting for my FTDNA (Family Finder) kit to arrive. Currently it's being inspected at customs.

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You know it takes a month to get your results, right? If you weren’t a Low IQ Turk you would have done AncestryDNA for 50$ on the holidays and get your results within 2 weeks to get the raw data. Shame.

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Originally Posted by Abti

You know it takes a month to get your results, right? If you weren’t a Low IQ Turk you would have done AncestryDNA for 50$ on the holidays and get your results within 2 weeks to get the raw data. Shame.

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There are negative reviews regarding AncestryDNA from Turkey, and I already paid 49$ for this test.

Apparently, if you have an IQ score between 55 and 69 you will be labeled as having "mild mental disability " and according to google, the average Ethiopian has an IQ of 68, so is Ethiopia a nation full of retards and mentally disabled people? Because from my experience with you, it seems so.

R1a is predominant among Russians, Poles, Belorusians, Czechs, Indo-Aryans, Afghan peoples, Turkic peoples (Siberia and Central Asia), partly Germans and Norwegians.

J2a is predominant among Greeks, Italians, Levantines, Nakh peoples, Jewish peoples, Armenians, Persians and partly Georgians.

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Originally Posted by black hole

R1a is predominant among Russians, Poles, Belorusians, Czechs, Indo-Aryans, Afghan peoples, Turkic peoples (Siberia and Central Asia), partly Germans and Norwegians.

J2a is predominant among Greeks, Italians, Levantines, Nakh peoples, Jewish peoples, Armenians, Persians and partly Georgians.

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Italians, Jews (despite what they say), Armenians & Greeks are clearly predominantly R1b not J. Come on now. I have like 30 sources.

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Originally Posted by Katarzyna

So I want to give my bloodline a meaningful haplogroup and I think that R1a, R1b and N can’t really satisfy it.

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Do you like I1?

Haplogroups are men's astrology.

Change my mind.

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Originally Posted by Petalpusher

Haplogroups are men's astrology.

Change my mind.

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Plus it is very real.

At least I know very well somewhere in the history, my direct paternal ancestors were living in region modern Poland-Ukraine and migrated Balkans and mixed with Balkan native women. Then, mixed with Turkic women. Unlike some people claimed Turks mixed with enslaved Balkan women.

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Originally Posted by Ugo

Do you like I1?

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Yes, I do.

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Originally Posted by Katarzyna

Yes, I do.

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The Northern European haplogroup. You have to find a man with an Arabic harlogroup - G, J

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Originally Posted by Ugo

The Northern European haplogroup. You have to find a man with an Arabic harlogroup - G, J

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G is Caucasian.

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Originally Posted by kessaras

G is Caucasian.

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I would call J actual Caucasian haplogroup by origin, and G Anatolian.

E is actual Afrosemitic haplogroup by origin.

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Originally Posted by Scarface F

I would call J actual Caucasian haplogroup by origin, and G Anatolian.

E is actual Afrosemitic haplogroup by origin.

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G is West Asian for sure but J originated in Middle East.

“Haplogroup J originated approximately 42.6 kya (95% CI: 30.0–64.7), with several of its earliest branches being found within the Arabian Peninsula and Northern Africa. J1b was found most frequently in the Near East and Arabian Peninsula, while J1c occurred most frequently in Europe.”

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Originally Posted by Ugo

The Northern European haplogroup. You have to find a man with an Arabic harlogroup - G, J

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I can also go for I2, common in Southern Poland, Ukraine and northern Balkans. My first boyfriend was Western Ukrainian (Carpatho Rusyn) and I2 and they are a real powerhouse.

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Originally Posted by kessaras

G is West Asian for sure but J originated in Middle East.

“Haplogroup J originated approximately 42.6 kya (95% CI: 30.0–64.7), with several of its earliest branches being found within the Arabian Peninsula and Northern Africa. J1b was found most frequently in the Near East and Arabian Peninsula, while J1c occurred most frequently in Europe.”

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Well from what I read both J1 and J2 spread south from Caucasus togheder with CHG admixture. Maybe oldest J is middle eastern/Mesopotamian but as far as I am aware those J1s and J2s came from Caucasus. They are just very common in modern middle east.

Modern Arabs have significant CHG admixture btw.

E on the other hand is less common in modern MENA but should be original Afro-Asiatic marker. It emigrated to Africa from near East.

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Originally Posted by Abti

Italians, Jews (despite what they say), Armenians & Greeks are clearly predominantly R1b not J. Come on now. I have like 30 sources.

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Nonsense. Nowadays Italians, Jews, Armenians and Greeks who carry happlogroup J2 are true Italians, Jews, Armenians and Greeks. R1b together with R1a are steppe invaders. Their percentage maybe not significant compared to R1b, but the truth still remains. Mediterranean and Middle Eastern civilisations Phoenicians, Hattians, Etruscans, Minoans, Hurrians, and ancient Israelites were J2. It really makes sense. So were Romans.

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Originally Posted by Katarzyna

I can also go for I2, common in Southern Poland, Ukraine and northern Balkans. My first boyfriend was Western Ukrainian (Carpatho Rusyn) and I2 and they are a real powerhouse.

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Aren't you paternally I2 too? Than you would stay in your tribe :)

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Originally Posted by black hole

Nonsense. Nowadays Italians, Jews, Armenians and Greeks who carry happlogroup J2 are true Italians, Jews, Armenians and Greeks. R1b are steppe invaders. Their percentage maybe not significant compared to R1b, but the truth still remains. Mediterranean and Middle Eastern civilisations Phoenicians, Hattians, Etruscans, Minoans, Hurrians, and ancient Israelites were J2. It really makes sense. So were Romans.

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Proto-Italics and proto-Armenians or people who carried Greek language were all R1b.

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Originally Posted by kessaras

G is West Asian for sure but J originated in Middle East.

“Haplogroup J originated approximately 42.6 kya (95% CI: 30.0–64.7), with several of its earliest branches being found within the Arabian Peninsula and Northern Africa. J1b was found most frequently in the Near East and Arabian Peninsula, while J1c occurred most frequently in Europe.”

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The date of when this was published?

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Originally Posted by Scarface F

Aren't you paternally I2 too? Than you would stay in your tribe :)

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Yes, I am. So me and my Ukrainian ex were both I2 and both Slavs. Nice match :)

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Originally Posted by Scarface F

Proto-Italics and proto-Armenians or people who carried Greek language were all R1b.

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Etruscans > proto-Italics, Hurrians > proto-Armenians, Minoans > proto-Greeks. J is originally from Mesopotamia, J2 probably formed in Caucasus and J1 formed somewhere in Zagros. These genetic things are still debatable among modern scientists. R1b is originally from Siberia which is very common in the modern western European people

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Originally Posted by black hole

Nonsense. Nowadays Italians, Jews, Armenians and Greeks who carry happlogroup J2 are true Italians, Jews, Armenians and Greeks. R1b together with R1a are steppe invaders. Their percentage maybe not significant compared to R1b, but the truth still remains. Mediterranean and Middle Eastern civilisations Phoenicians, Hattians, Etruscans, Minoans, Hurrians, and ancient Israelites were J2. It really makes sense. So were Romans.

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The most middle eastern Jews today are R1a. Haha.

https://i.imgur.com/5Jsgj9z.jpg

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Originally Posted by black hole

Etruscans > proto-Italics, Hurrians > proto-Armenians, Minoans > proto-Greeks. J is originally from Mesopotamia, J2 probably formed in Caucasus and J1 formed somewhere in Zagros. These genetic things are still debatable among modern scientists. R1b is originally from Siberia which is very common in the modern western European people

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J is from Europe.

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Originally Posted by black hole

Etruscans > proto-Italics, Hurrians > proto-Armenians, Minoans > proto-Greeks. J is originally from Mesopotamia, J2 probably formed in Caucasus and J1 formed somewhere in Zagros. These genetic things are still debatable among modern scientists. R1b is originally from Siberia which is very common in the modern western European people

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The substratum of modern Armenian is indeed part-Hurrian, and for Greeks it's Pelasgian or Minoan if you like, but both the languages are Yamnaya ones (direct not via Corded Ware intermediate), the carriers of the Armenic and Hellenic languages were those R-L584*s for Armenians and R-PF7562/3*s for Greek. Those R1bs mixed with the local substratums and produced the end result of what you call BA Armenian and Greek speakers.

After Southern Arc, it's beyond the shadow of doubt.

Also, haplogroups for men especially are extremely important for geneology tracing, since autosomals get washed out entirely in 10 generations.

You get 50% from your parent, 25% grandparent, 12.5% great-grandparent ... and so on, you have 0% autosomals from your 11th ancestor.

But what connects you to him and proves you are his descendant is your Y-chr.

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Originally Posted by eupator

The substratum of modern Armenian is indeed part-Hurrian, and for Greeks it's Pelasgian or Minoan if you like, but both the languages are Yamnaya ones (direct not via Corded Ware intermediate), the carriers of the Armenic and Hellenic languages were those R-L584*s for Armenians and R-PF7562/3*s for Greek. Those R1bs mixed with the local substratums and produced the end result of what you call BA Armenian and Greek speakers.

After Southern Arc, it's beyond the shadow of doubt.

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By the way, the Armenians practically do not have the Pit component. 0 - 3%.

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Originally Posted by Abti

J is from Europe.

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Can you provide an authentic source?

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Originally Posted by eupator

The substratum of modern Armenian is indeed part-Hurrian, and for Greeks it's Pelasgian or Minoan if you like, but both the languages are Yamnaya ones (direct not via Corded Ware intermediate), the carriers of the Armenic and Hellenic languages were those R-L584*s for Armenians and R-PF7562/3*s for Greek. Those R1bs mixed with the local substratums and produced the end result of what you call BA Armenian and Greek speakers.

After Southern Arc, it's beyond the shadow of doubt.

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You mean R1b were in Greece way before J2a carriers came during migration from west Asia? Greeks have a large diversity of Y-DNA haplogroups, and according to the test results, their predominant haplogroups are E-V13 and J2a equally

I think it is important but autosomal is important too both in combination and with your known ancestry first and foremost

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-PT_7tVw-v...00/Armenia.JPG

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Originally Posted by Petalpusher

Haplogroups are men's astrology.

Change my mind.

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Looking at the fanatic y-dna lovers in this thread, it is worse than astrology.

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Originally Posted by eupator

Also, haplogroups for men especially are extremely important for geneology tracing, since autosomals get washed out entirely in 10 generations.

You get 50% from your parent, 25% grandparent, 12.5% great-grandparent ... and so on, you have 0% autosomals from your 11th ancestor.

But what connects you to him and proves you are his descendant is your Y-chr.

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The reality is that I (as a Hungarian person) share way more DNA with random Hungarian individuals of whatever haplogroup than with an Englishman who shares my haplogroup.

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Originally Posted by Touijer

Spoiler!

It affects looks but around 20% so no distinctive look but to explain my point, it is not accurate to say that there is a distinctive R appearance, but the facts speak for themselves. The Y chromosome constitutes 2% of the entire genome, which implies that you share about 1.9% to 2% of your DNA with members of the same haplogroup, making you almost second cousins. You have thousands of mutations in common with people from your haplogroup, and blue eyes only require 2 mutations .

The Y chromosome has 58 million base pairs that contain no junk DNA. The SRY gene that determines male characteristics and activates testes has only 1000 base pairs, representing 0.01% of the Y chromosome itself. It is a very small gene, and some people assume that the rest is irrelevant. You share a common ancestor with others who belong to your haplogroup.

Ethnic nationalism is a fallacy, and it entails rejecting haplogroup. In the past, there were tribes and R1b was one of them. They originated from Central Asia and migrated to Western Europe. If they were not patriarchal and tribal, you would find many R1b’s in Slavic countries, which is not the case. They moved as a collective. Yamnayas, Bell Beakers were all patriarchal, so R1b reflects that. They intermarried with local women and had offspring, etc. So we can say that R1b is like a sort of “family” .

Those who claim that haplogroup is irrelevant are wrong. You can only make such a claim if you ignore the genetic similarities that you share with other members of your haplogroup, as the Original poster did, who is Jewish and only considers matrilineal descent. However, this does not hold for some haplogroups that were patriarchal. If you are a J1, you have a second cousin level of DNA with most J1’s.

An African American R1b is closer to a French R1b than a Swedish I1. Again they share the same grandfather, they have 2% in common making them close to second cousins and have multiple mutations in common. There’s no denying this. How much could the French share with the Swede? 0.01%? What’s the point of pca charts? People will claim well he’s R1b that doesn’t make him European or white, but of course it doesn’t. Because European and White mean nothing genetically and holds no weight. The African or Mexican R1b is closer to other R1b’s genetically like a type of family. Remove ethnic nationalism from the equation because it’s useless.

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Originally Posted by Touijer

Spoiler!

Denying facts? What are your arguments? You have none.

Most haplogroup deniers are either clueless, women or hate their haplogroup for some reason

The fact is you are close to second cousins and share close to 2% with everyone in your haplogroup, share the same grandfathers.

The African and French R1b's I mentioned come from the same tribe or family which was patriarchal. I don’t know about your haplogroup but that’s the case here and even if it wasn’t patriarchal genetically they are very close to each other like cousins. You can’t deny that. Which brings me back to my main point:

A French R1b is closer to an African-American R1b than to a Swedish I1. Your country has like 9 haplogroups so of course you’re denying since you don’t want to break the fragile Turkish nationalistic identity which is recent and has no weight .

https://i.postimg.cc/gc8Xk1zg/IMG-0485.jpg

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Propaganda and lies. A swedish R is genetically far closer to a Swedish I than an African-American R. People who have your haplogroup aren't your second cousins. You are talking about that "magical 2%", but you are ignoring the 98%. In we are comparing a Swedish R to a Swedish I, that 2% may be different but the remaining 98% is very similar. I share way more DNA with my second cousins (whatever their HG is) than with random people from the other side of the world matching my HG.

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Originally Posted by Universe

The reality is that I (as a Hungarian person) share way more DNA with random Hungarian individuals of whatever haplogroup than with an Englishman who shares my haplogroup.

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Does not matter because there are subclades too and typically your subclades would be hungarian if your ancestor is not actually an english man also it is different type of importance but both carries informations about you and you can easier interpret it if you know your ancestry and you are not adopted

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Originally Posted by Abti

The date of when this was published?

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https://www.bionity.com/en/encyclope...oogle_vignette

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Originally Posted by Katarzyna

Just because something is less spread doesn’t mean it’s good. Quality over quantity. When I talk about which haplogroup is best I talk about who subjectively fits for me as a partner to breed with.
Of course Y-haplogroups only carry an insignificant amount of DNA but they are still very special because the Y-chromosome is very special. Unlike the other chromosomes it doesn’t recombine much during the meiosis and therefore haplogroups can be traced back many generations. I think reproduction is one of the ultimative goals of life and keeping your bloodline alive. So as a woman you have to choose your partner’s haplogroup wisely. While the autosomal dna can be washed out after just a couple of generations, the Y-DNA can linger for very long. That’s how Finnish people share their haplogroup N with northern Asians while their autosomal DNA is almost fully European. Because those N-males married white women for generations but yet.. their Y chromosome remains

So I want to give my bloodline a meaningful haplogroup and I think that R1a, R1b and N can’t really satisfy it.

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What characteristics do I carriers have that R and N carriers lack?

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Originally Posted by Universe

Propaganda and lies. A swedish R is genetically far closer to a Swedish I than an African-American R. People who have your haplogroup aren't second cousins. You are talking about that "magical 2%", but you are missing the 98%. In we are comparing a Swedish R to a Swedish I, that 2% may be different but the remaining 98% is very similar. I share way more DNA with my second cousins (whatever their HG is) than with random people from the other side of the world matching my HG.

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Don’t waste your time with him. He believes earth is flat and dinasours didn’t exist. He’s either a troll or extremely retarded.

we're having fun, dude.

https://media.tenor.com/8zETKsmcDDwA...so-serious.gif

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Originally Posted by Mortimer

Does not matter because there are subclades too and typically your subclades would be hungarian if your ancestor is not actually an english man also it is different type of importance but both carries informations about you and you can easier interpret it if you know your ancestry and you are not adopted

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If the Englishman has my subclade but is autosomally English then I'm still genetically more similar to random Hungarian, Slovak, Slovenian, Croatian etc people than to that English man matching my HG.

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Originally Posted by Universe

Propaganda and lies. A swedish R is genetically far closer to a Swedish I than an African-American R. People who have your haplogroup aren't your second cousins. You are talking about that "magical 2%", but you are ignoring the 98%. In we are comparing a Swedish R to a Swedish I, that 2% may be different but the remaining 98% is very similar. I share way more DNA with my second cousins (whatever their HG is) than with random people from the other side of the world matching my HG.

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Also a little reminder that we are also made of many men (and women) of possibly very different haplogoups than what we display. For example anyone knows his maternal grandfather's Y? Could be anything... or his paternal grandmother mt? Yet they are as important in our lineage both autosomally and genealogically.
Even on some emotionnal level i find it wrong. I had a much better relationship with my maternal grandfather than paternal who i have seen maybe 5 times in my life. Both of their lineages leaded equally to me, there s no reason for, at least, one to be minimized over the other, or our female lineages too for that matter. Even as a toxic male i find it outrageous and silly.

Haplos are fun and useful for population history, but many have an hemiplegic view of them.

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Originally Posted by black hole

Can you provide an authentic source?









You mean R1b were in Greece way before J2a carriers came during migration from west Asia? Greeks have a large diversity of Y-DNA haplogroups, and according to the test results, their predominant haplogroups are E-V13 and J2a equally

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R1bs came to Greece in the BA, Myceneans carry R-PF7562/3. Anatolian-related peoples were already there and consist of the aforementioned substratum.