Is Haplogroup I-M170 a white haplogroup

[KidMulat]

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/sho...42#post2279942

Actually it was 9k years ago in greece. That's the oldest continuous farming known except for south china.

Papua New Guinea holds that title at around 10,000 years

[Prisoner Of Ice]

Papua New Guinea holds that title at around 10,000 years

Is this the farming which no one but you recognizes as actual farming?

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...riculture.html

Hmm, looks like they found residue of banana and tubers on tools. I am not sure that counts as solid evidence of farming. If it does, that means neanderthals were farmers.

But it's still interesting I guess. At least it's not the thing with acorns again.

[KidMulat]

Is this the farming which no one but you recognizes as actual farming?

Lol
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...riculture.html

Its been established for some time.

[Prisoner Of Ice]

Lol
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...riculture.html

Its been established for some time.

Like I said, if that's enough evidence, neanderthals invented farming 50k years ago.

[KidMulat]

Like I said, if that's enough evidence, neanderthals invented farming 50k years ago.

Lol okay the equivalent to aboriculture and vegiculture found in Paleolithic Korea and Japan; the oldest example I know of people actually bring plants with them to grow would be 60k Australians who brought the Baobab

http://www.uq.edu.au/nuq/jack/Boab%20Origins.html

[Prisoner Of Ice]

Paleolithic Siberian from Mal'ta [1 R*]
Mesolithic Europeans from Luxembourg and Sweden [2 I2a1b, 1 I2, 2 I]
Neolithic Spain [5 G2a, 1 E-V13]
Neolithic Ötzi from the Alps [G2a4]
Prehistoric South Siberians from Krasnoyarsk and here [10 R1a1, 1 C(xC3)]
Neolithic southwestern France from Treilles [20 G2a, 2 I2a]
Neolithic Megalithic France from la Pierre Fritte [2 I2a1]
Neolithic Bell Beaker from Kromsdorf Germany [2 R1b]
Prehistoric Paleo-Eskimo from Greenland [1 Q1a]
Neolithic Corded Ware Germans [3 related R1a]
Bronze Age Lichtenstein Cave in Germany [estimated presence I1b2*, R1a1, R1b1c]
Ancient Mongolian Xiongnu [1 R1a1]
New Kingdom Egyptian pharaoh Ramesses III [1 E1b1a]
Aboriginals from Canary Islands [E-M78, E-M81, J-M267, E-M33, I-M170, K-M9, P-M45, R-M269]
Late Antique Basques [4 I, 2 R1b3d, 19 R1(xR1a1), 2 R-M173]

It's funny everyone always just parrots that E1b and J are neolithic farmer DNA. They just pull that out of thin air. Well, this is every y-dna study done for neolithic (and some for other areas).

Since there's both I and J in aboriginal canary islanders we can rule out the idea it came from neolithic farmers, especially since they are brother clades.

So where are they, exactly? We have ZERO J neolithic farmers. We have just one E-v13, which is among a bunch of G - since this is no doubt a seafaring med. culture this could easily be a slave.

We have quite a bit of I among neolithic farmers, though. So what does that say about any of this...? They could easily be the ones who invented farming in balkans before the G men started to arrive from the east. Especially since I seems to radiate out of the area where first known bronze tools have been recently found.

It's funny that there's so many giant assumptions based on where things are today and some intense wishful thinking brought on by nationalistic fantasies.

[Artek]

Common in Bosnia & Herzegovina and Scandinavia, it is probably proto-Germanic. They suggest Gravettian (Upper Paleolithic).

How can be proto-Germanic since it predates the existence of this liguistic group by many millenias?

[Prisoner Of Ice]

How can be proto-Germanic since it predates the existence of this liguistic group by many millenias?

They are saying it's what germans were before they learned german, but I don't think that is a very good conclusion. It mainly shows they don't really know history that well, a recurring theme for the people doing the genetic part of archaeology.

[KidMulat]

It's funny everyone always just parrots that E1b and J are neolithic farmer DNA. They just pull that out of thin air. Well, this is every y-dna study done for neolithic (and some for other areas).

Since there's both I and J in aboriginal canary islanders we can rule out the idea it came from neolithic farmers, especially since they are brother clades.

So where are they, exactly? We have ZERO J neolithic farmers. We have just one E-v13, which is among a bunch of G - since this is no doubt a seafaring med. culture this could easily be a slave.

We have quite a bit of I among neolithic farmers, though. So what does that say about any of this...? They could easily be the ones who invented farming in balkans before the G men started to arrive from the east. Especially since I seems to radiate out of the area where first known bronze tools have been recently found.

It's funny that there's so many giant assumptions based on where things are today and some intense wishful thinking brought on by nationalistic fantasies.

Canarians are post Wet Period Saharan; they were farmers who sailed out there.

Gofio is an old meal prepared with cultivated barley and they had domesticated goats.

[Loki]

How can be proto-Germanic since it predates the existence of this liguistic group by many millenias?

Proto because exactly it's before the emergence of Germanic. But the current bearers in the Balkan bear closer resemblance to Scandinavians than to, say, Poles and Russians. There is a close relation between I in the Balkan and Scandinavia. It predates Germanic but is from the same source stock. Upper Paleolithic.