Indigenous Balkan I2a1 in southern Albania

[Scholarios]

...

[Scholarios]

Influence is certainly there but it's mostly borrowings through interaction, not imposition which one would expect to see in such scenario. Your statement was baseless, simple as that, no evidence whatsoever. Once we get a descent database on our project from Tosks we will be able to tell exactly when their specific subclades expanded and how diverse they are, and I will be able to demonstrate it to you exactly how in unfolded - and I again I am quite confident that I am right, that they entered early on, perhaps during first Bulgarian empire if not in their initial invasion, and expanded during early middle ages when Tosk tribes could be found far and wide in today's Greece.

Yes, I am aware that founder effects and bottle-necks are unimportant when discussing their recent effects in Kosovo, Northern Albania- but extremely pertinent when analyzing effects of Slavic migrations in South Albania.


Successful males are successful males, right?

and expanded during early middle ages when Tosk tribes could be found far and wide in today's Greece.

*late middle ages

[Skerdilaid]

Yes, I am aware that founder effects and bottle-necks are unimportant when discussing their recent effects in Kosovo, Northern Albania- but extremely pertinent when analyzing effects of Slavic migrations in South Albania.


Successful males are successful males, right?



*late middle ages

Who said they are? Our discussion in the past regarding founder effect and bottleneck in the population of Kosova was centred around our V13 and its variance, which so far, especially in Kosova, has proven to be the most diverse halpogroup. The only clusters that seem to have experience such phenomenon among us seem to be J2b-PH1751 along with R1b-BY611 to an extent, not V13.

Their initial tribal expansion started in early Middle ages, perhaps only within Albania at first, which in turn allowed them to 'export' manpower in abundance during the 14th century - by this time they were a force to recon with in Thessaly.

[Scholarios]

Who said they are? Our discussion in the past regarding founder effect and bottleneck in the population of Kosova was centred around our V13 and its variance, which so far, especially in Kosova, has proven to be the most diverse halpogroup. The only clusters that seem to have experience such phenomenon among us seem to be J2b-PH1751 along with R1b-BY611 to an extent, not V13.

So just those 2 haplogroup clades. But it's not important I guess, I didn't say specifically E-V13.(and I'll just take your word for it)

Their initial tribal expansion started in early Middle ages, perhaps only within Albania at first, which in turn allowed them to 'import' manpower in abundance during the 14th century - by this time they were a force to recon with in Thessaly.

Yep, but Tosks in Greece in late middle ages, not early. Even at the end of 13th Century, they probably didn't expand beyond Berat. Sure, they started expanding in Albania since the early Middle ages tho.

[catgeorge]

Here is evidence:

Spoiler!

Look at that- a clade that formed 2200 years ago in Poland and still exists in Poland and Greece both.

Here it is again:

Spoiler!

And where the hell is it in South Italy if it was in Neolithic Greeks? Only in Gargano, where Medieval Croats settled.

You keep bringing up the same map - yet you have no idea what it is.

This is exactly what I am talking about - if you also plot EV 13, G2a and J2a you will get more or less the same results - that's what the Thessalian Neolithic Expansion did in those exact same areas.

[Laberia]

You keep bringing up the same map - yet you have no idea what it is.

This is the smartest thing I've ever read by you. It's normal, he is an idiot who pretends and even believes that he is an intelligent person.
Thanks gataki, i have laugh so much, you made my day. Hahahahahaha.

[Scholarios]

You keep bringing up the same map - yet you have no idea what it is.

This is exactly what I am talking about - if you also plot EV 13, G2a and J2a you will get more or less the same results - that's what the Thessalian Neolithic Expansion did in those exact same areag]

Dude- you are the one who has absolutely no clue. Did you see that the person in Greece matches perfectly someone from Poland in a clade that is 2200 years old??? Can you understand that the Neolithic is thousands of years older than that???? Yes, I know Neolithic expansion happened in Greece - but this clade is NOT related to it, and the evidence is that first appeared around the time of the Roman Empire expansion. Geezus- you're dense as fuck. Your little MS paint map is irrelevant.


I can only conclude that you are a. I2a1b2 and b. Completely delusional as far as the genetic impact of Slavic peoples in Balkans ( for some bogus nationalist reasons).

This is the smartest thing I've ever read by you. It's normal, he is an idiot who pretends and even believes that he is an intelligent person.
Thanks gataki, i have laugh so much, you made my day. Hahahahahaha.
[IMG]http://www]

I'm an idiot who pretends to be intelligent ? What are you? A degenerate who knows he's an imbecile???
Sure, laugh it up. It's natural for you to share such alliances - you and dear cat George almost certainly share a Slavic -speaking ancestor in the past 1200 years. Bros for life.

[catgeorge]

Dude- you are the one who has absolutely no clue. Did you see that the person in Greece matches perfectly someone from Poland in a clade that is 2200 years old??? Can you understand that the Neolithic is thousands of years older than that???? Yes, I know Neolithic expansion happened in Greece - but this clade is NOT related to it, and the evidence is that first appeared around the time of the Roman Empire expansion. Geezus- you're dense as fuck. Your little MS paint map is irrelevant.


I can only conclude that you are a. I2a1b2 and b. Completely delusional as far as the genetic impact of Slavic peoples in Balkans ( for some bogus nationalist reasons).





I'm an idiot who pretends to be intelligent ? What are you? A degenerate who knows he's an imbecile???
Sure, laugh it up. It's natural for you to share such alliances - you and dear cat George almost certainly share a Slavic -speaking ancestor in the past 1200 years. Bros for life.

You do not want to listen because you have limited thinking capacity. I2a1 has been in Europe forever. Its one of the proto splits from cro magnons in Europe. The map is not mine it is direct from the sciencemag if you cared to look at the link.

I would not care if I shared slavic nor albanian ancestery, you are the only one that wants and needs it in typical marxist fashion - then twist it in a nationalistic ideology without looking at the facts. Enough tired of your limited brain capacity.

[Scholarios]

You do not want to listen because you have limited thinking capacity. I2a1 has been in Europe forever. Its one of the proto splits from cro magnons in Europe. The map is not mine it is direct from the sciencemag if you cared to look at the link.

I would not care if I shared slavic nor albanian ancestery, you are the only one that wants and needs it in typical marxist fashion - then twist it in a nationalistic ideology without looking at the facts. Enough tired of your limited brain capacity.

DO YOU COMPREHEND? I understand that I2a has been in Europe forever. HOWEVER the clade that is in Greece including the samples on the map I posted are Balto-Slavic in origin. NOT Neolithic Greek. ENGLISH MOTHERFUCKER- DO YOU SPEAK IT? This is not a " maybe" but absolutely that i2a1b2 is in Greece and Albania* and* originates in Poland within historical times. 2200 years ago. There's no doubt it's origin if you aren't delusional like Laberia, a troll, or functionally illiterate.


How fucking hard is that to understand ? Even a golden dawn malakas like yourself must know that there were 15 Slavic-speaking villages within walking-distance of Thessaloniki within living memory.

[Herr Abubu]

Influence is certainly there but it's mostly borrowings through interaction, not imposition which one would expect to see in such scenario. Your statement was baseless, simple as that, no evidence whatsoever. Once we get a descent database on our project from Tosks we will be able to tell exactly when their specific subclades expanded and how diverse they are, and I will be able to demonstrate it to you exactly how it unfolded - and I again am quite confident that I am right, that they entered early on, perhaps during first Bulgarian empire if not in their initial invasion, and expanded during early middle ages when Tosk tribes could be found far and wide in today's Greece (though going by few studies majority will most likely end up being under Z17855 with few Y4460 'Din S' and S17250 'Din N').

Haha, right, baseless. You're delusional like the rest of the Albanians here. Just about everything goes against you. Keep coping.