So Celts were North Europeans after all?

[Freeroostah]

They are from Canton Aargau in Switzerland but how do you know they are Iron Age (supposedly 100 BC) and not Bronze or Copper Age?

Is there any official confirmation that they are dated to ca. 100 BCE?

As noted, they are much more northern-shifted than modern Swiss.

If those samples originate from around 100BC Switzerland and score as far as Norway then its possible to be Germanic in origins. Maybe they are related to Cimbri migrants....?

[Peterski]

I believe the Empuries 'Gaul' (as some hypothesized) would fit this framework very well.

Yeah, but what if he was not Gaul but for example Armorican or Hibernian or Briton?

Ancient Greeks had contact with Britain: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pytheas

If those samples originate from around 100BC Switzerland then its possible to be Germanic in origins.

Not too early for Germanics in Switzerland?

[SharpFork]

Interesting they no longer look Scandinavian if you use ancient samples. All the closest ancient matches are from Non-Germanic areas.

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Didn't someone claim before that "Scythian_MDA_o" were ethnic Bastarnians ???

Tbh that might be because we lack enough Bronze age samples from Scandinavia or Northern Germany.

[J. Ketch]

If they are correctly dated, i will say 'i told ya' to you and Grace.

What are you talking about, I've always held the opinion that La Tene Celts were more Northern than Scandinavians

[XenophobicPrussian]

It's hard to square those samples with the one in Bohemia, the ones in Lech and Empuries2, I agree that there could be a dating mistake.

Empuires and one of the Bohemian ones actually gives credence to this, but yeah, then you have the French-like Bohemian one and all the southern Lech ones. At most this says northern Euros used to be a lot more racist than they are today.

[SharpFork]

Yeah, but what if he was not Gaul but for example Armorican or Hibernian or Briton?

Ancient Greeks had contact with Britain: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pytheas

That interpretation was based on the idea that Celts in Southern of Centrla France couldn't have changed so much because of Roman rule and that contintental Celts weren't this Northern, but maybe those assumptions weren't correct. We need to create a coherent model with more samples though.

[Freeroostah]

Not too early for Germanics in Switzerland?

Not really considering the Cimbrian Wars (probably the first ever massive Germanic migration from modern day Denmark)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cimbrian_War

[Grace O'Malley]

They could be northern Celts. I'm not too far from some of these samples. Obviously the distances aren't close to any moderns.

Distance to: MX195_scaled
0.04190749 Norwegian
0.04451211 Swedish
0.04555708 Icelandic
0.04595731 Grace_scaled
0.04763377 Dutch
0.04884175 Orcadian
0.04893182 Irish
0.04942682 Scottish
0.04994741 Shetlandic
0.05119938 Danish
0.05142766 Afrikaner
0.05147107 Welsh
0.05280137 English
0.05292579 German
0.05448067 French_Brittany
0.05449511 Czech
0.05525978 Slovakian
0.05576292 English_Cornwall
0.05713404 German_East
0.05834048 Austrian
0.06034971 Hungarian
0.06178791 Moldovan_o
0.06274732 Belgian
0.06298421 French_Pas-de-Calais
0.06318391 French_Seine-Maritime

Distance to: MX190_scaled
0.04265581 Swedish
0.04275908 Icelandic
0.04353717 Norwegian
0.04371792 Grace_scaled
0.04402365 Orcadian
0.04427637 Dutch
0.04472942 Scottish
0.04476116 Irish
0.04550625 Welsh
0.04616030 German
0.04662647 Shetlandic
0.04731126 English
0.04771035 Afrikaner
0.04792178 French_Brittany
0.04812475 Danish
0.04828322 German_East
0.04943519 English_Cornwall
0.05116386 Czech
0.05193253 Austrian
0.05481130 French_Seine-Maritime
0.05530325 Slovakian
0.05547181 French_Pas-de-Calais
0.05555950 Hungarian
0.05593465 Belgian
0.05871971 French_Nord

Anyway very interesting and not really expected.

[XenophobicPrussian]

Not really considering the Cimbrian Wars (probably the first ever massive Germanic migration from modern day Denmark)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cimbrian_War

Yeah these could actually very easily be Cimbri or Teutons, who started invading the Romans around 110 BC.



They pass right by Switzerland.

[SharpFork]

Empuires and one of the Bohemian ones actually gives credence to this, but yeah, then you have the French-like Bohemian one and all the southern Lech ones. At most this says northern Euros used to be a lot more racist than they are today.

I mean only to some extent, the southernmost Lech samples are still 30% Steppe I believe while the highest one excluding the one highest outlier is 52% Steppe, I believe this would support some sort of caste system but not a complete one or at least it formed after significant amount of intermixing happened, even if from just top to bottom(given how those Swiss samples look)