The Controversial Origins Of Haplogroup J and R

[Mopi of the Julii]

My dad's 11th chromosome may hold the secret

your dad may have some balkan blood perhaps ?

[nittionia]

your dad may have some balkan blood perhaps ?

It could be, although it would have to be quite distant since he doesn't get Balkan on 23andme or Ancestry

[PrimarisOrion]

I doubt that the people who went to Europe from the Caucasus 30 thousand years ago were light-skinned.

They did not leave 30,000 years ago. They left around 10,000 years ago. The Caucuses was a mix of darker Caucasoids and Fair skinned Caucasoids but most of the fair skinned men left for the Middle Easter and some went to Europe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satsurblia_Cave#Genetics


"Their genomes showed that a continued mixture of the Caucasians with Middle Eastern populations took place up to 25,000 years ago, when the coldest period in the last Ice Age started.[4]"

Migrating Brown Caucasoids from the middle east entered the region then all admixture with these people stopped and they would have whitened themselves up again due to natural selection.


"The ancient individual from Satsurblia was male with black hair and brown eyes; however, the individual is one of the earliest found to carry the derived HERC2 allele for blue eyes. The Satsurblia individual also likely had light skin, as he was found to carry the derived SLC24A5 allele for light skin. The Satsurblia individual was also lactose intolerant and did not carry the derived EDAR allele commonly found in East Asians and Native Americans.[8][9]"

This is where Haplogroup J comes from originally, the Caucuses, early Haplogroup J migrations to the middle east were all fair to light tan colored men. "light intermediate". They bred Brown Caucasoid women in mass and many Haplogroup E men fled into North Africa.

I would estimate around 80% of them at least had fair skin (not really pale) and the rest had light tan intermediate skin.

[sarmsaksogan]

.....

Thanks for the information.


Are you trying to say that there was a migration from the Arabian peninsula or North Africa to the Caucasus, Iran and Anatolia?


Also, which part of the Caucasus are you talking about? South Caucasus?

[Abti]

There is no controversy. It’s widely known.

J-M304 — Early West Eurasian turned Cro-Magnon.


R-M207 — Early East Asian turned East Eurasian.

[Abti]

Thanks for the information.


Are you trying to say that there was a migration from the Arabian peninsula or North Africa to the Caucasus, Iran and Anatolia?


Also, which part of the Caucasus are you talking about? South Caucasus?

No, a migration from the Transcaucasian Area into SouthWest Asia — Arabia, Indian Subcontinent, Southern Europe.

[Oasis]

As the topic of IJ is being vigourosly discussed, you may observe that, in “Human genetic history on the Tibetan Plateau in the past 5100 years”, some ancient yDNA R1a-Z93 representatives and some ancient yDNA J representatives (mostly J2 and J*) formed an autosomal component, which is observed in ancient Iron Age Indo-Aryans of the Swat Valley, Pakistan, in the Yamnaya population and Afanasievo pupulation, and such a component appeared in some Altaic-related individuals as well as some Taiwanese Austronesians. However, the only ancient population, which would be capable of mediating the arrival of yDNA J-related ancestry to Austronesians, is an ancient Qihe3 individual, who is 11356-11747 years old and who is an ancient coastal Fujianese, geographically isolated from the mainland part of China, where Sino-Tibetan languages originated. The fact that the component in Austronesians is Indo-European-like, means that yDNA J*, which reached this territory adjacent to Southeast Asia (J* is detected as IJK in relevant ancient samples), was related to the kind of yDNA J, whose western J relative contributed to the formation of Indo-Europeans, and yDNA R1a-Z93 developed together with such an yDNA J branch, whose distant yDNA J relative traveled as far as the border of Austronesian Southeast Asia not later than by the Mesolithic period. This yDNA J connection is helpful in explaining the theory of Indo-European-Austronesian connection, developed by Koji Ohnishi, a Japanese researcher.

Such a user, as “Japanese Wikipedia” editor Ebizur may think, whether our theory on his yDNA O1b2-47z adoption by Austronesians is acceptable for him, or otherwise he would like to explain affinities of his yDNA O1b2-47z by late direct contact with Indo-Europeans somewhere in Mongolia and farther to the West.