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still 28-29% is too high for that, I think.
though that should be checked across calculators.
definitely deserves a closer look. there's a real slight northwest leaning in and around Csangofold. on top of the real northeast leaning of 3/4 of Moldova (the 1/4 not included being Galati-Vrancea and Bessarabia/Budjak non-Russkies).
Moldova, a region of many ancestral populations. we should embrace not only Slavic and Vlach origin, but also Iranic, Germanic, Turkic. at the moment they're teaching the kids at school we descend from Rome ffs![]()




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Yes, the Rome part is unlikely, given the haplogroups that we have. It's the romanised folk of local Balkan origin who spread the language. They lost their original Dacian/Getae/Thracian languages slowly over time, because the Roman language allowed better opportunities and social status. Albanians were also on the verge of assimilation. Albanian is considered a partially romanised language, but probably more of them lived an isolated high altitude life than others from the Balkans. So their language survived, though quite romanised. It's quite the miracle that it's still here.
Then when the Slavs came later from the 7-8th centuries onwards, the same processes that happened in what was later called Bulgaria, also happened in Wallachia. Slavs moved to the plains, rivers and swamps (they were farmer people), while Balkan folk to avoid the plague and the movement of nationalities typical for that period lived high in the mountains all over the Balkans (those in the plains died to the Justinian plague and left a gap that Slavs exploited).
(To open a caveat, ironically, the Slavs also adopted the same tactic of living isolated in the mountains when the Ottomans came, and this is why the Bosniaks are genetically the most Slavic of all in the Balkans. They got them religiously though.)
Returning to our story, eventually they slowly started to interact and influence each other. Slavs were more successful culturally in Bulgaria and slavicised the romanised Dacians/Getae/Thracians. The opposite happened in Wallachia, where Slavs got romanised. This is why genetically, apart from some really Southern cases in Bulgaria, you would struggle to tell apart a Slavic Bulgarian from a Latin Wallachian.
This is nothing unusual. Hungarians from Hungary can be modelled as half Slavs and half Germans. Others as 1/3 Slavs, 1/3 Germans, 1/3 old Balkan. Others are indistinguishable from Slovaks. But the culture of the Hungarian elite managed to turn them all into Hungarians. Only those in the mountains of Romania have managed to preserve up to 7-8% East Asian-like genes from the original Hungarian elite.
A great related video that I listened to last night: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_5nTOlpLkQ
Moldova repeats the same history later. Romanised folk, who 6th centuries later from the events in Wallachia and Bulgaria, were now themselves mixed with Slavs like Wallachians and Bulgarians, founded the ruling class of the new Moldovan principality and became successful culturally. Whatever non-Moldovan folk came in their way way were either assimilated, enslaved or killed. The strong rule the weak. A history as old as time itself.
Love or hate Grigore Ureche, but this is one of the few sources that we have. Correct me if you have something better. I don't believe in modern historians. Everyone has a stupid agenda to push a narrative. Some make us Romans, others Dacians, and others Slavs.
The truth is that there always was a romanised Balkan core who ate everyone up, like Pac-Man. The process in Moldova is just easier to see than in Wallachia, because Wallachia didn't and doesn't border West Slavic and East Slavic groups, like Moldova or Northern Transylvania.
Wallachia interacted and mixed even stronger than Moldova with Slavs in my opinion. You can see that very clearly in surnames, toponyms and even the Romanian language spoken there. But it's harder to spot genetically, because Bulgarians and Wallachians are like brothers from the same mother.
(SIMEON DASCĂLUL)
Predoslovie a létopisețului moldovenescu ce īntr-īnsa spune că este făcută țara den doao limbi, de rumāni și de ruși, de care lucru să cunoaște că și păn' astăzi este țara giumătate de ruși și giumătate de rumāni.
Scrie la létopisețul cel moldovenescu, la predoslovie, de zice că deaca au ucis acei vānători acel buor, īntorcāndu-se īnapoi, văzānd locuri desfătate, au luat pre cāmpi īntr-o parte și au nemerit la locul unde acum tārgul Sucévei. Acolo aminosindu-le fum de foc și fiind locul despre apă, cu pădure mănuntă, au pogorāt pre mirodeniia fumului la locul unde este acum mănăstirea Ețcanei. Acolea pre acelaș loc au găsit o priseacă cu stupi și un moșneag bătrān, de prisăcăriia stupii, de seminție au fost rus și l-au chiemat Ețco. Pre carele deaca l-au intrebat vānătorii, ce omu-i și den ce țară este, el au spus că este rus den Țara Leșască. Așijderea și pentru loc l-au intrebat, ce loc este acesta și de ce stăpān ascultă ? Ețco au zis: este un loc pustiiu și fără stăpān, de-l domnescu fierile și pasările și să tinde locul īn gios, păn' īn Dunăre, iar īn sus păn' īn Nistru, de să hotăraște cu Țara Leșască, și este loc foarte bun de hrană. Īnțelegānd vānătorii acest cuvānt, au sārguit la Maramorăș, de ș-au tras oamenii săi īntr-această parte și pre alții au īndemnat, de au descălecat īntăi supt munte și s-au lățit pre Moldova īn gios. Iar Iațco prisecariul, deaca au īnțeles de descălecarea maramorășénilor, īndată s-au dus și el īn Țara Leșască, de au dus ruși mulți și i-au descălecat pre apa Sucévei īn sus și pre Sirétiu despre Botoșiani. Și așa de sārgu s-au lățit rumănii īn gios și rușii īn sus.
200 years later
Cāndu au prădat Ștefan vodă Țara Leșască 7006(1498) iunie 22 zile
Īntr-același an, Ștefan vodă vrāndu să-și īntoarcă dispre léși strāmbătatea sa, strānsă țara și au intratu la Podoliia și la ruși, trecutau și de Liov la Canțug orașului, la apa Visloca, toate satile arzāndu și prădāndu. Ars-au orașul Premișlia, Radumnea, Prevorsca, Lanțut și cetatea Tereabul și multă bunătate dintr-īnsa au luatu și mulți joimiri au scos, ci pre toți i-au tăiatu și alții mai mulți au arsu īn cetate. Și cetatea Buceaciul multă nevoie au pățitu și Podhaețul au arsu. Și mulți oameni, bărbați, muieri, copii, au scos īn robie, mai mult de 100.000, mulți de aceia au așezatu Ștefan vodă īn țara sa, deși pănă astăzi trăiește limba rusască īn Moldova, ales pre unde i-au discălicatu, că mai a treia parte grăiescu ruséște.
Last edited by AnthrogenicaRefugee; 12-03-2025 at 12:23 PM.



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Yes I agree with that some modern romianian historians suck. They call every thing fake they don't agree with . For example their is a big chunk of them who think that vlachs come in 13 century but the sources already show that they were there and pretty organized but of course they ignore them. Don't get me wrong their are some good romaians historians out there. Example : Corpus draculianum they are really good
https://youtube.com/@corpusdraculian...RO2HadCUoFGQ6F and another good historian is Mihai florin Hasan
Also I don't think all the vlachs that came to Moldova, came from Maramureș because in 1370s the Pope was talking about bunch of vlachs living in southern Moldova near the Tatars as the Pope says. They weren't part of the principally of Moldova yet because Moldova only reached that part later (1390s) I can't find the papal document online yet so I am using this as a substitute
https://www.facebook.com/10000072590...Bdo9l/?app=fbl
I will put some sources
https://romaniaembassy.orderofmalta....ului-de-malta/
https://tiparituriromanesti.wordpres...opia-cumaniei/
Last edited by sage; 12-03-2025 at 04:23 PM.




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1390s is already 7 centuries later since the first interaction of romanised locals and the Slavs. Vlachs were probably spread in different places on the Moldovan plain and along riversides, but they were few in numbers.
Before the Hungarian crown attempted to stabilise the Dniester border, and Moldovan voievodes formed the principality and started to patrol it, all that territory from the Pontic steppe and all the way deep into the Wallachian plain was a kill zone. A highway of death and terror where steppe nomads raided regularly and no normal life could be had. Locals survived in remote places.
Even centuries after the establishment of the principality, raids continued, and this is why if you divide Moldova in 1770s into 3 parts -
1) Carpathians to Siret 16 people per km2
2) Siret to Prut 10 people per km2
3) Prut to Dniester 7 people per km2
The population of Moldova closest to the mountains was the most numerous. Those were natural safety zones.
https://arhiva.gov.md/datele-recensa...ri-impozabili/



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I don't think it was bad for vlachs as you say,sure it was bad but they had their own bishops in the church of cumania which was southern Moldova and eastern Wallachia, where they converting Hungarians and Saxons to orthodoxy. Also they had their own leaders. Sadly only one from Wallachia and oltienia are named. Sorry I know this not related to Moldova but what your thoughts on the voidevodships of litovoi and seneslu , on how they were formed and how they played in the part of forming Wallachia They have always interested me so much but it's an obscure part of romianian history. Also You kinda forgetting that Wallachia plain was a forest in that time
Last edited by sage; 12-03-2025 at 05:42 PM.




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Deleteed



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Look man I just trying to have a conversation because I am passionate on this stuff. Not trying to troll or anything




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