Spin-off: twistedmind vs. Äike

[Äike]

Except that Jean Sibelius, Elias Lönnrot and other founding figures of Finnish cultural nationalism were born Swedish speakers.
Fieldmarshal Mannerheim had also Swedish as his mother tongue, spoke perfect Russian, French, German... but wasn't fluent at all in Finnish.

Finland is Nordic because it's been called for a half millenium Östermanland.



"DEN UNDERBARA SAGAN OM ETT LAND PÅ ANDRA SIDAN HAFVET"...



... and Romanians are romance like the Italians, crowds of Romanians go to university in Italy or emigrate there ; that doesn't make Romania a Western Mediterranean country but an Eastern European one — just like Estonia.

Dude, you're utterly retarded if you think that finns/Estonians are like Italians/Romanians.

Finland and Estonia, especially their capitals are one of the most tied regions in Europe. The distance between Helsinki and Tallinn is 70km, that's just 1 hour to travel. You can get on a ferry and meet up with your finnish/estonian friends in either countries, have a coffee, go see a movie and then go back with the ferry in the evening.

Finnics are even a closer group than the Scandinavians and you're a dumb troll with a lower IQ than 60.

[Twistedmind]

Not really. More like 2,5%.
Up to 20% of Finland's population used to speak swedish at some point, but about half of them were still finns.
And the other half were not exactly purely germanic either.

Its strawmaning.

You could just as well claim that probably 20% of Swedish population is of Finnish origin.

I cant. There is no basis whatsoever for it. Finnish language arrived in Finland in first century AD. There is no reason whatsoever to believe Sweden ever had Finnic speaking population.

[Äike]

I cant. There is no basis whatsoever for it. Finnish language arrived in Finland in first century AD. There is no reason whatsoever to believe Sweden ever had Finnic speaking population.

The Finnish language (or its predecessor, to be more correct) arrived in Finland around 6000 years ago, 4000 BC. We, Finnic people, predate Germanics and Indo-Europeans in Northern-Europe and Scandinavia.

I don't know, definitely they are northmen, so if Nordic is taken to mean northmen then yes, however my understanding of Nordic is that it means north Germanic, so therefore they wouldn't be.

North-Germanic = Scandinavian, that's why the term "Scandinavian languages" is used for them, synonymously with North-Germanic, not "Nordic languages". Get your facts straight.

[Twistedmind]

The Finnish language (or its predecessor, to be more correct) arrived in Finland around 6000 years ago, 4000 BC. We, Finnic people, predate Germanics and Indo-Europeans in Northern-Europe and Scandinavia.

Seems Finnish scholars do not share your opinion. And please spare me further discussions on topic.

http://www.helsinki.fi/~jolaakso/fufaq.html

North-Germanic = Scandinavian, that's why the term "Scandinavian languages" is used for them, synonymously with North-Germanic, not "Nordic languages". Get your facts straight.

Lol, you speaking about facts. What a joke.

[Jackson]

The Finnish language (or its predecessor, to be more correct) arrived in Finland around 6000 years ago, 4000 BC. We, Finnic people, predate Germanics and Indo-Europeans in Northern-Europe and Scandinavia.



North-Germanic = Scandinavian, that's why the term "Scandinavian languages" is used for them, synonymously with North-Germanic, not "Nordic languages". Get your facts straight.

Yes i know, i was just saying that the general perception is that north Germanic/Scandinavian languages coincide best with Nordic areas. Calm down Karl. In any case Norwegian, Danish, Swedish, Icelandic, Faroese, Finnish people are considered Nordic. I left my comment open ended as well, as you can see by reading it.

How do you know when proto-Finnic arrived, glottochronology or something else? Glottochronolgy can be pretty unreliable.

[Äike]

Seems Finnish scholars do not share your opinion. And please spare me further discussions on topic.

http://www.helsinki.fi/~jolaakso/fufaq.html

Dude, listen. I'm an academic historian, studying history and having passed the European prehistory year with flying colors. You're a random fat teenager living with with your mother.

You know absolutely nothing about this topic and are just trolling the thread. Even a person with half of a brain knows that you're full of shit.

Europe 4000 BC, notice the massive extent of Finno-Ugrians/Comb-Ceramic:



Apply cold water to burned area

Lol, you speaking about facts. What a joke.

Yeah, I'm actually one of the few people actually qualified to speak about topics like this, I'm not a random retard like you.

[Äike]

Yes i know, i was just saying that the general perception is that north Germanic/Scandinavian languages coincide best with Nordic areas. Calm down Karl. In any case Norwegian, Danish, Swedish, Icelandic, Faroese, Finnish people are considered Nordic. I left my comment open ended as well, as you can see by reading it.

How do you know when proto-Finnic arrived, glottochronology or something else? Glottochronolgy can be pretty unreliable.

You said "Nordic = North-Germanic". But Nordic is a cultural term, not an ethnic/linguistic one, that encompasses people with the same culture, identity, traditions mentality and historical background, thus Estonians/Finns are Nordics, but not Scandinavians (North-Germanic), although some of us have Scandinavian blood, like me and other Estonians & Finns.

[Jackson]

You said "Nordic = North-Germanic". But Nordic is a cultural term, not an ethnic/linguistic one, that encompasses people with the same culture, identity, traditions mentality and historical background, thus Estonians/Finns are Nordics, but not Scandinavians (North-Germanic), although some of us have Scandinavian blood, like me and other Estonians & Finns.

Are there evidenced reasons why you do not consider Scandinavians to be Nordic? It's true that if Finnish are considered Nordic and if they are very similar to Estonians, they could also be. If only Finns and Estonians are Nordic, and they are also Finnic - Why bother with the term at all? Perhaps you can both just be Finnic and the Scandinavians north Germanic?

[Äike]

Are there evidenced reasons why you do not consider Scandinavians to be Nordic?

Brush up your English and reread my post.

It's true that if Finnish are considered Nordic and if they are very similar to Estonians, they could also be. If only Finns and Estonians are Nordic, and they are also Finnic - Why bother with the term at all? Perhaps you can both just be Finnic and the Scandinavians north Germanic?

Scandinavians are also Nordic, we are in the same cultural and historical sphere. It's like with the Scots, the Welsh and the English being British, although one group is Celtic and the other is Anglo-Saxon.

[Jackson]

Scandinavians are also Nordic, we are in the same cultural and historical sphere. It's like with the Scots, the Welsh and the English being British, although one group is Celtic and the other is Anglo-Saxon.

Ah ok i see what you mean now, i thought you said only Finns and Estonians were Nordic in your last post.

Well if the people consider themselves so, and their neighbors do as well - and it's academically plausible, i don't see the problem with it.