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Lucas
12-18-2019, 10:21 PM
Target: South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
Distance: 2.3607% / 2.36073073 | ADC: 1x
62.8 Croatian
34.8 Serbian_Bosnia
2.4 Moldavian
Target: South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
Distance: 2.3213% / 2.32125498 | ADC: 0.5x
56.2 Croatian
38.8 Serbian_Bosnia
5.0 Moldavian
Mingle
12-18-2019, 10:22 PM
I followed Mingle advice to break South Croat cluster in two, because there are two distinct types of south Croats. You can remove south croat average now which was mix of both, and add these 2 averages separately!
South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster,25.45,35.03,15.55,6.7,1 1.30,2.50,0.29,0.34,0.99,0.69,0.50,0.00,0.32
South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster,25.25,29.91,16.48,8.85 ,15.03,1.97,0.74,0.26,0.64,0.48,0.17,0.01,0.16
Looks good, nice work. I would just use the names South Croat_1 and South Croat_2 instead as I think the name Morlach may carry some political undertones and some may not like it.
By the way, how many samples did you use for each of those clusters?
Lucas
12-18-2019, 10:23 PM
Looks good. I would just use the name South Croat_1 and South Croat_2 instead as I think the name Morlach may carry some political undertones and some may not like it.
By the way, how many samples did you use for each of those clusters?
Morlach sounds cool.
Looks good. I would just use the name South Croat_1 and South Croat_2 instead as I think the name Morlach may carry some political undertones and some may not like it.
By the way, how many samples did you use for each of those clusters?
But Morlachs lived in dinaric alps, they were both Serbs and Croats. And they are believed to be more Vlach by blood than Čakavian southern Croats.
I used 5 samples for each.
Morlach sounds cool.
One Serb poster has username Morlak, I don't think he ashamed of it.
Thracian
12-18-2019, 10:23 PM
Updated EU test. It is different than previous one that I posted in page 6. It seems my Turkic part shifted to Iranics, maybe because of my relatively low Mongoloid.
https://i.ibb.co/YtFbY6h/20191219-021637.jpg
Lucas
12-18-2019, 10:29 PM
Updated EU test. It is different than previous one that I posted in page 6. It seems my Turkic part shifted to Iranics, maybe because of my relatively low Mongoloid.
]
Add to it those later regional Turkish averages?
Morlachs has been an exonym used for a rural Christian community in Herzegovina, Lika and the Dalmatian Hinterland. The term was initially used for a Vlach pastoralist community in the mountains of Croatia in the second half of the 14th until the early 16th century.
The etymology of the exonym points to a connection with Vlachs, but as stated in Fortis' work Travels in Dalmatia, they were at that time Slavic-speaking. Because of migrations from various parts of the Balkans, the name had passed to later communities. The Morlach people were both of the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic faith.
-unlike Vlach, this term has no derogaratory conotations in Croatia.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d6/Valerio_-_Paysan_Morlaques_des_environs_de_Spalato%2C_1864. jpg/800px-Valerio_-_Paysan_Morlaques_des_environs_de_Spalato%2C_1864. jpg
Cumansky
12-18-2019, 10:30 PM
FIX EASTERN EUROPE THANK YOU
Cumansky
12-18-2019, 10:31 PM
Start by removing fake nationality Belarusian, Ukrainian, Estonian, etc
Thracian
12-18-2019, 10:35 PM
Add to it those later regional Turkish averages?
Yeah, it would be great if we have them.
I am completely Central European/Austro-Hungarian, and much closer to NW Croats than to any kind of southerners. But my distances are quite large.
https://i.imgur.com/ZJvUvpB.png
andre
12-18-2019, 10:42 PM
added to k13
Could you add Romanian_Apuseni without the strange samples, please?
Bakha
12-18-2019, 10:42 PM
Please This shit is not funny. Thank Türan atleast the distance is high.
<tbody>
Target: BakhaFather
Distance: 7.9962% / 7.99621065 | ADC: 0.5x
34.2
Hazara
23.0
Sephardic_Jews
20.2
Iranian_Jews
15.2
Kurd
7.4
Azerbaijan_Jews
</tbody>
<tbody>
Target: BakhaFather
Distance: 6.8385% / 6.83852967 | ADC: 0.25x
41.6
Azerbaijan_Jews
25.2
Hazara
22.0
Sephardic_Jews
4.0
Buryat
3.8
Bnei_Menashe_Jews
2.6
Oroqen
0.8
TUNISIA
</tbody>
<tbody>
Target: BakhaFather
Distance: 5.1536% / 5.15364296
34.8
Azerbaijan_Jews
28.6
Sephardic_Jews
8.6
Adygei
8.6
Velama
7.2
JPT
7.0
Koryak_15
4.0
CHB
1.2
Mozabite
</tbody>
Lucas
12-18-2019, 10:44 PM
On other forum user posted Minoan and Myceanean samples for MDLP K11.
Added to datasheet.
andre
12-18-2019, 10:44 PM
Distance to: K13
5.25476926 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
5.72958973 Serbian_new
6.00030833 South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster
6.24445856 Macedonian
6.47237572 Montenegrin
6.80810546 Romanian_Oltenia
7.17518474 Bosnian
7.71079114 Bulgarian
7.82883133 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
7.88712162 Serbian_Bosnia
8.23652232 Romanian_Muntenia
8.43411525 Szekely
9.56461349 North_Macedonian
9.83250222 Csango_Gymes
10.79834247 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
10.86410144 Moldavian
13.04815801 Slovenian
13.36603905 Croatian
13.80887034 Hungarian
13.98351803 Kosovo_Albanian
14.32474782 Albanian
15.56970991 GR_Macedonia
16.29180162 Kaykavian_Croatian
16.42651211 Greek_Thessaly
16.56041470 Slovak
Nice! I’m so Vlach.
andre
12-18-2019, 10:47 PM
I am completely Central European/Austro-Hungarian, and much closer to NW Croats than to any kind of southerners. But my distances are quite large.
https://i.imgur.com/ZJvUvpB.png
Just a question, from which zone are the “morlak” croatian? Monstar zone? Split zone?
EUtest looks solid
Just lacking some samples
https://i.imgur.com/C1GLBLN.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/bAiJbVq.jpg
Just a question, from which zone are the “morlak” croatian? Monstar zone? Split zone?
Both Dalmatian and BiH Croats who form a distinct cluster. They all score similary.
Bakha
12-18-2019, 10:59 PM
PuntDnal looks much better
<tbody>
Target: BakhaFather
Distance: 8.3087% / 8.30870507 | ADC: 0.5x
78.4
Turkish_Kayseri
8.0
Gond
5.8
Eskimo
3.8
Thai
3.4
Egyptian
0.6
Afghan_Hazara
</tbody>
<tbody>
Target: BakhaFather
Distance: 4.5029% / 4.50286220 | ADC: 0.25x
40.6
Turkish_Kayseri
17.0
Turkish_Trabzon
11.6
Lebanese_Muslim
10.6
Gond
9.6
Eskimo
6.2
Thai
3.0
Fulani
1.4
Moroccan
</tbody>
<tbody>
Target: BakhaFather
Distance: 0.9431% / 0.94314580
49.8
Turkish_Trabzon
8.0
Pulliyar
5.8
Cypriot
5.2
Hakkipikki
4.4
Samaritan_Jew
4.0
Mozabite
3.4
Eskimo
3.2
Oroqen
2.8
Igorot
2.8
Yakut
2.4
Mayan
2.2
Yoruba
2.0
Naxi
1.2
Nganasan
1.0
Chukchi
0.6
San
0.4
Biaka_Pygmy
0.4
Murut
0.2
Japanese
0.2
Xibo
</tbody>
https://i.imgur.com/BG4Vcgg.png
https://i.imgur.com/6udT13H.png
:thumb001::thumb001:
Good night
Compared to the other four Szekler samples (including your mom), you seem to be a bit atypical. Your Baltic and NA scores are significantly different than that of other Szeklers. You get 23% Baltic while the four other Szekler samples range from 28-34% for example.
Here are the distances for you and your mom in case you're interested:
Distance to: Szekely_Harghita
6.57028919 Serbian
7.31385671 Szekely
8.68095041 Romanian
8.91351221 Csango_Gymes
10.28211554 Hungarian
10.44558759 Romanian_NorthMoldova
10.51534117 Romanian_SouthMoldova
10.59561230 Serbian_Bosnia
11.41228204 North_Macedonian
11.57418248 Romanian_Muntenia
11.97250600 Bulgarian
12.10280546 Austrian
12.97408571 Moldavian
14.61010951 West_German
14.67437222 Croatian
14.67741122 East_German
15.68618500 Albanian
16.13717138 French
16.55376090 South_Dutch
16.74727739 Czech
17.79896345 North_Italian
19.06300344 Greek_Thessaly
19.99565203 Portuguese
20.12848479 Tuscan
20.56283541 Spanish_Galicia
Distance to: Kokeny_mom
2.61333121 Szekely
3.69089420 Serbian
4.33343974 Csango_Gymes
5.08643293 Serbian_Bosnia
5.33487582 Romanian_NorthMoldova
6.37115374 Szekely_Harghita
7.52511129 Hungarian
7.55863083 Moldavian
7.98695186 Romanian_SouthMoldova
8.00615388 Romanian
9.38358141 Croatian
10.38082367 Romanian_Muntenia
11.14372020 Bulgarian
11.56461413 Austrian
11.89177368 North_Macedonian
13.25301852 Czech
13.28402800 East_German
16.40858617 Ukrainian_Lviv
16.67068085 South_Polish
17.07353508 Albanian
17.63673156 West_German
17.78807466 Ukrainian
19.36667757 South_Dutch
19.80282051 French
20.32069635 Greek_Thessaly
She gets it at a very close distance now. Are you planning on testing your father? I guess he'll have the most interesting results.
Since Szekely cluster so close to Serbs, does this mean that Serbs are larger descendants of Avars than Croats and Bosnians?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/04/Historical_map_of_the_Balkans_around_582-612_AD.jpg/800px-Historical_map_of_the_Balkans_around_582-612_AD.jpg
:)
Target: Mr.G
Distance: 2.6416% / 2.64160132
49.8 Szekely_Harghita
37.4 North_German
12.8 Southwest_English
how recent is your szekely parent in America?
Can't sleep :(
EU test is really decent, their modeling works best for me. I am basically West-Slavic like with extra neolithic and CHG admixture.
https://i.imgur.com/vKjHZXB.png
Can't sleep :(
EU test is really decent, their modeling works best for me. I am basically West-Slavic like with extra neolithic and CHG admixture.
https://i.imgur.com/vKjHZXB.png
Yep just needs more samples
Luke35
12-19-2019, 12:32 AM
how recent is your szekely parent in America?
No my dad's family are Hungarians from Hungary. His maternal side is from Western Hungary, paternal side is from Eastern Hungary. No Szekely.
The combo of Northern Germany/English in that particular result probably plots a little bit North and West of my maternal side. So, with that small shift, Szekely then fits as my other half.
Luke35
12-19-2019, 12:41 AM
Just for fun, I took my mom's result and my result and went half/half on each component. For instance, if my mom gets 45% North Atlantic, and I get 38%, the difference is 7%. So I take 38% - 7% = 32% North Atlantic for my dad. I did that for every component, made a theoretical kit for him, and plugged in the result:
Distance to: Mr.G-dad
5.10509001 Hungarian
6.18576301 Csango_Gymes
6.42302296 Austrian
6.63315189 Szekely
7.46847968 Slovenian
7.63765173 Kaykavian_Croatian
8.30401373 East_German
9.11297654 Serbian_Bosnia
9.48926362 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
10.12259716 Bosnian
10.30034547 Serbian_new
10.34613360 Slovak
10.38479099 Croatian
10.56696664 Moldavian
10.59972566 Czech
10.64391488 Southern_Croat
11.61325966 Montenegrin
11.93755268 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
12.46010209 West_German
13.17242666 Romanian_Oltenia
14.02111279 South_Dutch
14.44991541 Macedonian
15.62949788 South_Polish
15.80664114 French
16.01078836 Ukrainian_Lviv
No my dad's family are Hungarians from Hungary. His maternal side is from Western Hungary, paternal side is from Eastern Hungary. No Szekely.
The combo of Northern Germany/English in that particular result probably plots a little bit North and West of my maternal side. So, with that small shift, Szekely then fits as my other half.
This is why I don't trust all these % whatever + % whatever
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 12:46 AM
Can't sleep :(
EU test is really decent, their modeling works best for me. I am basically West-Slavic like with extra neolithic and CHG admixture.
https://i.imgur.com/vKjHZXB.png
Show your distance table for EUtest
My father’s K23b
Distance to: Dick-dad
5.79459231 Serb_Serbia
6.31726207 Montenegrian
6.63110850 German-Volga
7.62754220 Bulgarian
8.01280850 Macedonian
8.56452567 South_German
8.90767646 Austrian
9.56622182 Italian_North
9.83224288 Serb_BH
9.93675500 German_East
10.46808961 Croat
11.04240463 Dutch
11.06821124 Bosnian
11.21945186 Hungarian_Budapest
11.59082827 Belgian
11.78454496 Hungarian
12.04349202 Frisian
12.18812947 Slovenian
12.43222024 Irish
12.46667157 English
12.93983385 North_German
13.30245466 Croat_BH
13.40989560 Gagauz
13.46734569 Kosovar
13.47630884 Romanian
Target: Dick-dad
Distance: 0.5585% / 0.55851642
16.0 Frisian
15.4 Greek_Thessaly
12.0 Kashub
10.2 Latvian
8.2 Sicilian_East
7.4 South_German
5.2 Croat_BH
4.0 Spanish_Pais_Vasco_IBS
2.8 Armenian
2.8 Greek_Northwest
2.8 Sorb
2.4 Basque_Spanish
1.8 Christian_Arabs_Israel
1.8 North_German
1.4 Sardinian
1.2 Georgian
1.0 Georgian_Imereti
0.6 Austrian
0.6 Eskimo_Naukan
0.6 Georgian_Laz
0.6 West_Greenland
0.4 Haida
0.4 Huichol
0.4 Koinanbe
Target: Dick-dad
Distance: 1.3041% / 1.30406031 | ADC: 0.25x
39.4 Bulgarian
34.4 German-Volga
14.4 South_German
9.4 Montenegrian
1.0 West_Greenland
0.8 Tsimsian
0.4 Italian_North
0.2 BedouinB
Target: Dick-dad
Distance: 2.0980% / 2.09796659 | ADC: 0.5x
50.0 German-Volga
25.0 Montenegrian
24.6 Bulgarian
0.4 Italian_North
Target: Dick-dad
Distance: 2.6174% / 2.61737294 | ADC: 1x
52.8 Montenegrian
47.2 German-Volga
Target: Dick-dad
Distance: 4.2272% / 4.22723132 | ADC: 2x
75.6 Serb_Serbia
24.4 German-Volga
Strange that ADC 2x didn't erase German Volga. How Slavic is it
Luke35
12-19-2019, 12:55 AM
This is why I don't trust all these % whatever + % whatever
Right, you can't take them at face value that's for sure. One thing that has really helped me is that my mom is on GEDmatch too, so I know how she scores. Because she gets South Dutch #1 in populations, I can then look at my 50/50 splits and see that I do indeed get split South Dutch/Hungarian - reinforces the possibility that my father would score Hungarian as his first population. Without this added info from my mother's result, I would have been doing a lot more guessing.
Luke35
12-19-2019, 01:55 AM
Just for fun, I took my mom's result and my result and went half/half on each component. For instance, if my mom gets 45% North Atlantic, and I get 38%, the difference is 7%. So I take 38% - 7% = 32% North Atlantic for my dad. I did that for every component, made a theoretical kit for him, and plugged in the result:
Distance to: Mr.G-dad
5.10509001 Hungarian
6.18576301 Csango_Gymes
6.42302296 Austrian
6.63315189 Szekely
7.46847968 Slovenian
7.63765173 Kaykavian_Croatian
8.30401373 East_German
9.11297654 Serbian_Bosnia
9.48926362 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
10.12259716 Bosnian
10.30034547 Serbian_new
10.34613360 Slovak
10.38479099 Croatian
10.56696664 Moldavian
10.59972566 Czech
10.64391488 Southern_Croat
11.61325966 Montenegrin
11.93755268 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
12.46010209 West_German
13.17242666 Romanian_Oltenia
14.02111279 South_Dutch
14.44991541 Macedonian
15.62949788 South_Polish
15.80664114 French
16.01078836 Ukrainian_Lviv
Compare to his Eurogenes K15, which I estimated using the same method as above.
Distance to: Mr.G-dad
6.28683545 Hungarian
8.36756559 Slovenian
8.91938759 Szekely
9.61651704 Kaykavian_Croatian
9.79043105 Slovak
10.21380928 Austrian
10.22384468 East_German
10.89729673 Bosnian
10.97814277 Serbian_Bosnia
11.04895470 Croatian
11.84444173 Moldavian
12.01658853 Serbian
13.33162031 Ukrainian_Lviv
13.43349089 Montenegrin
14.23998596 South_Polish
14.55301687 Romanian
14.95774381 Ukrainian
15.14817481 West_German
15.61950605 Macedonian
16.50950938 Southwest_Finnish
16.72143834 North_German
16.98935255 Polish
17.31774235 Finnish
17.41192120 French
17.84699695 Bulgarian
Cumansky
12-19-2019, 03:22 AM
MDLP K23b
0x
Target: Cumansky_Father
Distance: 2.9180% / 2.91803781
44.8 Latvian
26.8 Serb_Serbia
17.6 Serb_BH
5.8 Frisian
4.6 Lithuanian
0.4 Karitiana
Cumansky
12-19-2019, 03:24 AM
What kind of Serb is that?
What kind of Serb is that?
I2a1b3 człowiek cheddar ahahhaha
Cumansky
12-19-2019, 03:44 AM
I2a1b3 człowiek cheddar ahahhaha
This the Bran Castle Serbs or what
Ljubic
12-19-2019, 05:01 AM
Distance to: Ljubic-Dad
2.94245068 Bosnian
3.23188799 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
3.76884598 South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster
3.89253662 Serbian_new
3.95490044 Serbian_Bosnia
4.38734544 Moldavian
5.33645013 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
5.75703048 Szekely
6.05145437 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
6.40815106 Csango_Gymes
7.59501810 Croatian
7.92424699 Montenegrin
8.35285403 Slovenian
9.25499865 Romanian_Oltenia
9.32309222 Macedonian
Looks good. Also nuce that Romanians got split into multiple clusters. A country with such a big population shouldnt be put into one category.
Distance to: Ljubic-Dad
2.94245068 Bosnian
3.23188799 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
3.76884598 South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster
3.89253662 Serbian_new
3.95490044 Serbian_Bosnia
4.38734544 Moldavian
5.33645013 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
5.75703048 Szekely
6.05145437 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
6.40815106 Csango_Gymes
7.59501810 Croatian
7.92424699 Montenegrin
8.35285403 Slovenian
9.25499865 Romanian_Oltenia
9.32309222 Macedonian
Looks good. Also nuce that Romanians got split into multiple clusters. A country with such a big population shouldnt be put into one category.
Nice results, fit his ancestry well. I used him as one of samples for Morlach cluster, btw :P
17571imre
12-19-2019, 05:51 AM
6.40052342 Szekely
7.30343070 South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster
7.44680468 Csango_Gymes
7.49268300 Serbian_new
7.57414995 Montenegrin
7.60630577 Serbian_Bosnia
7.76620242 Hungarian
8.50508083 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
8.72234072 Slovenian
8.75270244 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
8.79205528 Bosnian
9.23349880 Romanian_Oltenia
9.31366201 Austrian
10.21732170 Macedonian
10.95488019 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
10.98421140 Moldavian
11.08027075 Kaykavian_Croatian
11.29292256 Romanian_Muntenia
11.64149475 East_German
11.73996593 Croatian
12.05286610 North_Macedonian
12.57828685 Bulgarian
12.96335294 Slovak
13.79458227 Czech
i am closest to szekely now wich is not suprising because a lot of my family is from transylvania.
harutsafaryan07
12-19-2019, 06:03 AM
i updated Armenians and Turkey Kurds for Eurogenes K13
Armenian_East,3.34,2.6,11.32,39.4,34.05,5.27,2.98, 0.22,0.1,0.17,0.36,0.09,0.04
Armenian_West,2.91,1.84,12.8,36.23,36.53,6.22,2.55 ,0.25,0.09,0.09,0.34,0.25,0.27
Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey,3.73,4.75,7.96,38.41,30.58,5. 17,7.45,0.4,1.11,0.56,0,0,0
Friend from Hungary
Distance to: Blanka
6.30492665 Hungarian
6.37269726 Slovenian
7.06498818 Slovak
7.33430978 Czech
7.36590795 Kaykavian_Croatian
8.61925751 East_German
8.78030182 Austrian
8.81152654 Croatian
8.90207841 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
8.93839471 Csango_Gymes
My mother
Distance to: Mama
4.20708913 Slovenian
4.72158872 Csango_Gymes
4.88118838 Szekely
5.07506527 Serbian_Bosnia
5.15662680 Moldavian
5.33922279 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
5.58235613 Croatian
5.66741564 Hungarian
5.91976711 Bosnian
5.95406584 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
Results for @Hrvoje Vukčić Hrvatinić
https://i.imgur.com/SBqx6iC.png
Mingle
12-19-2019, 06:45 AM
Results for @Hrvoje Vukčić Hrvatinić
https://i.imgur.com/SBqx6iC.png
Can you post his K13 results? Forgot what he scored like.
Also, I couldn't find the result of the Varazdin Croat. Could you post their K13 as well?
Can you post his K13 results? Forgot what he scored like.
Also, I couldn't find the result of the Varazdin Croat. Could you post their K13 as well?
Unfortunately I don't have Varaždin Croat K13 results, seems nobody does.
Hrvoje K13:
https://i.imgur.com/ysSBgBy.png
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 09:39 AM
Added!
If someone has good new refs for this and other calcs I will add.
Azeri sample for EUtest ver.1 :
Azeri_Kars_1,0,6.12,4.40,3.85,3.95,31.48,30.04,8.4 4,5.63,0,2.72,3.35,0
Population,SOUTH_BALTIC,EAST_EURO,NORTH-CENTRAL_EURO,ATLANTIC,WEST_MED,EAST_MED,WEST_ASIAN ,MIDDLE_EASTERN,SOUTH_ASIAN,EAST_AFRICAN,EAST_ASIA N,SIBERIAN,WEST_AFRICAN
gedmatch kit number: T184053
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 09:55 AM
Added!
If someone has good new refs for this and other calcs I will add.
Palestinian sample for EUtest ver.1:
Palestinian_1,0,0,1.6,2.86,10.27,30.65,14.93,27.81 ,3.78,4.51,0,0.86,2.7
gedmatch kit number: M750194
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 10:08 AM
Added!
If someone has good new refs for this and other calcs I will add.
Turkmen sample for EUtest ver.1:
Turkmen_Uzbekistan_1,3.61,10.85,1.33,5.19,0,17.32, 20.63,4.4,11.66,0,10.7,14.31,0
gedmatch kit number: F910004
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 10:36 AM
Its interesting how are they very far from each other - souther and kaykavian ones.
https://i.imgur.com/yKAnDkI.jpg https://i.imgur.com/06awmKz.jpg
Someone will say - artificial nation. ;)
I think everyone here agrees that 23andme needs to do to slovenians and nw croats what they've done do finns, give them their own category.
Then you'll see a lot of croats scoring different mixes between bosnians(serbs) and this new slovenian/nw croat group, showing how their EE on 23andme has been artificially inflated.
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 10:43 AM
Added!
If someone has good new refs for this and other calcs I will add.
Mexican sample for EUtest ver.1:
Mexican_1,2.23,14.43,10.66,11.96,6.33,1.67,5.27,3. 23,4.76,3.12,9.34,19.89,7.11
gedmatch kit number: M112219
Nurzat
12-19-2019, 10:52 AM
MOLDOVA REGION, ROMANIA, results now after the source updates (+ removed from source the Moldova averages for which these were part of the samples)
Target: Suceava_County-1
Distance: 0.3965% / 0.39646670
43.8 Ukrainian
22.0 Romanian_Muntenia
8.4 Sardinian
3.8 Lezgin
3.8 South_Polish
3.4 Tabassaran
2.8 Abhkasian
2.8 Southeast_English
2.6 Southwest_Russian
1.8 French_Basque
1.8 Ukrainian_Belgorod
1.0 Estonian
0.8 Turk_East_Black_Sea
0.4 Malay
0.4 NAN_Melanesian
0.2 Kalash
0.2 Pima
Target: Suceava_County-2
Distance: 0.4122% / 0.41215925
20.2 Southwest_Finnish
20.0 North_Macedonian
15.4 Greek_Thessaly
8.8 Belorussian
6.4 Lebanese_Druze
4.8 East_German
4.4 Southern_Croat
3.8 Austrian
3.0 North_Italian
2.6 Hungarian
2.2 RU_Pinega
1.8 Estonian
1.8 Estonian_Polish
1.4 Chamar
1.0 Greek_Cappadocian
0.8 Mari
0.6 Danish
0.2 North_Amerindian
0.2 Sardinian
0.2 Selkup
0.2 Serbian_new
0.2 South_Dutch
Target: Botosani_County
Distance: 0.5983% / 0.59830630
15.8 Belorussian
13.8 GR_Macedonia
12.2 Erzya
9.2 Serbian_Bosnia
8.4 Latvian
8.2 Russian_Smolensk
8.2 Sardinian
7.8 South_Polish
3.8 Greek_Cappadocian
3.4 Greek_Chios
2.4 Turk_East_Black_Sea
1.6 Albanian
1.6 Georgian_Jewish
1.2 Bosnian
0.8 Cossacks_Kuban
0.8 Greek_Trabzon
0.2 Gujarati
0.2 Lebanese_Christian
0.2 Mari
0.2 Romani
Target: Neamt_County
Distance: 0.5920% / 0.59195085
18.8 Cossacks_Kuban
14.0 Montenegrin
12.0 Greek_Chios
10.4 Laz
9.0 GR_Macedonia
8.0 Serbian_new
7.0 Belorussian
6.4 Romanian_Muntenia
4.8 Latvian
3.6 Albanian
2.0 South_Polish
1.2 Norwegian
1.0 She
0.6 Austrian
0.6 Xibo
0.4 North_Ossetian
0.2 Evenki
Target: Vaslui_County-1
Distance: 0.3551% / 0.35511776
34.2 North_Macedonian
16.4 Cossacks_Kuban
11.0 Latvian
6.6 Sardinian
5.8 Greek_Chios
4.8 Montenegrin
4.4 GR_Macedonia
3.0 Estonian
2.8 Greek_Trabzon
2.8 Serbian_new
2.2 Finnish
1.4 RU_Pinega
1.4 Selkup
1.0 Bulgarian
1.0 Laz
0.6 Greek_Cappadocian
0.6 Southwest_French
Target: Vaslui_County-2
Distance: 0.7164% / 0.71641170
20.6 Albanian
15.4 Southwest_Finnish
12.6 Tuscan
11.4 Belorussian
10.8 Austrian
6.6 Serbian_new
5.8 Lebanese_Christian
5.6 Cossacks_Kuban
2.6 East_Finnish
2.2 Greek_Cappadocian
2.0 Greek_Chios
1.2 Lebanese_Druze
1.2 Sardinian
0.6 Dolgan
0.6 Evens
0.6 Romanian_Muntenia
0.2 Selkup
harutsafaryan07
12-19-2019, 11:54 AM
Turkmen sample for EUtest ver.1:
Turkmen_Uzbekistan_1,3.61,10.85,1.33,5.19,0,17.32, 20.63,4.4,11.66,0,10.7,14.31,0
gedmatch kit number: F910004
if you want i can send you Some kits Turkish , Azeri and other nations from Anatolia for EUtest
andre
12-19-2019, 12:11 PM
Added!
If someone has good new refs for this and other calcs I will add.
Romanians from Transylvania (Romanian_Transylvania) for k13:
Romanian_Transylvania,24.69,25.70,18.14,11.08,16.3 5,0.79,0.36,0.52,0.68,0.84,0.7,0,0.13
ph2ter
12-19-2019, 12:28 PM
K15
German_Bavarian,28.38,26.11,11.62,8.33,11.51,6.15, 6.01,0.76,0.10,0.21,0.10,0.23,0.30,0.13,0.05
Mingle
12-19-2019, 12:32 PM
Romanians from Transylvania (Romanian_Transylvania) for k13:
Romanian_Transylvania,24.69,25.70,18.14,11.08,16.3 5,0.79,0.36,0.52,0.68,0.84,0.7,0,0.13
What counties' samples are these based off of?
Mingle
12-19-2019, 12:35 PM
K15
German_Bavarian,28.38,26.11,11.62,8.33,11.51,6.15, 6.01,0.76,0.10,0.21,0.10,0.23,0.30,0.13,0.05
Do you think you can make a Kaykavian Croat average for the Eurogenes EUtest calculator? It looks like it's the most accurate for you and may potentially be better than K13.
andre
12-19-2019, 12:46 PM
What counties' samples are these based off of?
Romanian Apuseni.
CommonSense
12-19-2019, 12:46 PM
Latest K13 update:
https://i.imgur.com/I0ePXqd.png
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 12:48 PM
Romanian Apuseni.
do Gorj too
andre
12-19-2019, 12:53 PM
do Gorj too
Romanian Oltenia it’s based on Gorj.
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 12:58 PM
Romanian Oltenia it’s based on Gorj.
it's the old Romanian average which was in k13, it was just renamed to Romanian Oltenia
andre
12-19-2019, 01:02 PM
it's the old Romanian average which was in k13, it was just renamed to Romanian Oltenia
And why was renamed Romanian Oltenia? Because it’s based on Gorj samples, isn’t? :)
Mingle
12-19-2019, 01:03 PM
And why was renamed Romanian Oltenia? Because it’s based on Gorj samples, isn’t? :)
That was what I thought which is why I asked it to be renamed. But it may not be based on Gorj after all. The only way to confirm is to calculate an average for the Gorj samples and see if it's the same as the one here.
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 01:03 PM
Croat_Split,26.60,31.52,16.57,7.89,13.14,1.59,0.44 ,0.22,0.52,0.51,0.59,0.24,0.14
Split Croats, academic
with that sample which was a big outlier in k15 added:
Croat2_Split,25.95,31.39,16.33,8.23,13.73,1.64,0.3 9,0.35,0.52,0.56,0.56,0.22,0.13
in k13 he is not such a big outlier
andre
12-19-2019, 01:12 PM
Croat_Split,26.60,31.52,16.57,7.89,13.14,1.59,0.44 ,0.22,0.52,0.51,0.59,0.24,0.14
Split Croats, academic
Split it’s in south Croatia, i think it’s better to put it in the South_Croatian_Slavic_Cluster.
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 01:14 PM
Split it’s in south Croatia, i think it’s better to put it in the South_Croatian_Slavic_Cluster.
yes, some of the samples should be added to "Morlachs" and some to proper South Croats
harutsafaryan07
12-19-2019, 01:43 PM
For K 13
Crimean_Tatar,13.17,20.04,7.55, 16.36,8.88,1.83,3.23,10.25,16.40,1.28,0.47,0.27,0. 21
Nusayri,5.95,1.56,13.93,24.33,39.43,9.69,1.82,0.42 ,0.76,0.21,0.35,1.28,0.23
Georgian_imereti,2.27,2.24,11.58,54.44,23.83,1.88, 2.24,0.27,0.06,0,0.89,0.01,0.25
ph2ter
12-19-2019, 01:58 PM
Here are some of my avearges for K15:
Bavarian,28.38,26.11,11.62,8.33,11.51,6.15,6.01,0. 76,0.10,0.21,0.10,0.23,0.30,0.13,0.05
Albanian-Kosovo,14.93,15.66,11.94,6.23,18.27,10.32,19.43,2. 54,0.09,0.30,0.04,0.04,0.21,0.00,0.00
Albanian-Macedonia,11.79,17.19,12.38,6.66,16.85,10.32,20.82 ,3.28,0.04,0.38,0.11,0.03,0.17,0.00,0.00
Albanian-North,14.45,14.29,11.27,5.18,18.11,11.91,21.57,2.6 8,0.00,0.03,0.05,0.15,0.24,0.07,0.00
Albanian-South,13.63,14.55,9.85,5.47,17.69,11.03,23.38,3.51 ,0.00,0.25,0.09,0.34,0.16,0.00,0.04
Austria-Burgenland,27.63,20.42,15.58,12.08,9.89,5.91,5.45, 0.69,0.63,0.01,0.05,0.86,0.34,0.27,0.19
Austria-Tyrol,25.37,22.36,10.49,8.78,13.81,8.06,8.11,1.89, 0.10,0.17,0.28,0.28,0.16,0.10,0.06
Belgium,32.68,27.36,9.52,7.25,10.65,5.06,5.22,0.60 ,0.64,0.07,0.13,0.11,0.22,0.32,0.15
Bosniak,16.68,16.19,21.25,13.20,11.12,8.39,10.75,1 .07,0.59,0.29,0.09,0.19,0.08,0.08,0.05
Bulgarian_Thracian,7.44,15.78,16.37,6.07,14.41,11. 92,22.38,2.27,2.17,0.67,0.28,0.00,0.25,0.00,0.00
Bulgarian,14.40,14.28,16.61,9.81,13.50,10.73,17.01 ,2.37,0.23,0.09,0.19,0.39,0.32,0.06,0.01
Italy_Emiliaromagna,17.94,19.13,7.04,3.17,20.08,8. 91,19.65,3.29,0.03,0.12,0.00,0.04,0.29,0.15,0.02
Italy_Friuli,19.00,21.50,10.42,6.03,17.50,7.38,14. 76,2.41,0.28,0.15,0.02,0.34,0.06,0.13,0.00
Italy_Lazio,15.18,17.36,7.06,2.43,19.99,9.92,23.83 ,3.74,0.07,0.14,0.03,0.10,0.03,0.05,0.09
Italy_Liguria,18.23,21.71,6.84,3.24,20.21,7.98,17. 82,3.03,0.11,0.17,0.07,0.23,0.24,0.03,0.08
Italy_Lombardy,21.50,22.45,6.34,2.73,20.71,6.38,16 .91,2.27,0.11,0.21,0.08,0.06,0.16,0.07,0.00
Italy_Marche,15.34,17.26,5.97,2.22,19.56,11.73,22. 54,4.32,0.21,0.10,0.00,0.37,0.10,0.27,0.07
Italy_Tuscany,17.25,20.05,6.52,2.79,20.41,9.07,19. 20,3.54,0.57,0.25,0.02,0.06,0.14,0.08,0.02
Italy_Veneto,21.07,21.37,8.50,5.45,18.65,7.15,14.6 9,2.42,0.14,0.18,0.05,0.08,0.15,0.09,0.00
France_Corsica,13.78,21.54,5.02,1.26,24.13,8.14,22 .27,3.14,0.01,0.27,0.07,0.04,0.26,0.06,0.01
Czech,23.49,20.03,22.22,13.99,9.20,4.59,3.88,1.05, 0.53,0.08,0.09,0.37,0.20,0.11,0.14
Danish,39.23,25.55,13.14,10.31,5.77,2.83,0.81,0.31 ,0.76,0.18,0.01,0.59,0.17,0.18,0.14
Dutch,36.81,27.02,10.81,9.42,8.04,3.92,1.47,0.72,0 .83,0.03,0.16,0.24,0.17,0.31,0.05
England,36.15,29.24,10.14,8.74,9.22,3.96,0.75,0.23 ,0.66,0.07,0.04,0.35,0.24,0.05,0.16
France-South,24.81,28.86,7.83,4.15,20.13,2.81,8.79,1.30,0 .44,0.08,0.09,0.39,0.13,0.09,0.07
Gagauz,13.85,12.01,15.31,9.84,13.82,12.36,18.58,2. 86,0.29,0.13,0.19,0.24,0.47,0.04,0.00
Greek_Crete,8.69,10.84,7.57,3.47,16.52,16.62,30.27 ,4.78,0.01,0.10,0.18,0.14,0.51,0.24,0.06
Macedonian,14.32,14.52,13.71,9.18,15.61,10.30,18.7 1,2.88,0.09,0.17,0.05,0.18,0.26,0.02,0.00
Italy_Aostavalley,26.62,25.03,7.48,4.39,17.71,6.75 ,9.38,1.80,0.00,0.02,0.17,0.19,0.14,0.15,0.16
Italy_Piedmont,21.38,25.13,7.86,4.01,19.32,6.70,12 .69,2.19,0.11,0.01,0.06,0.12,0.24,0.13,0.03
Italy_Trentino,21.92,21.72,11.28,5.55,18.46,5.83,1 3.09,1.32,0.00,0.03,0.11,0.16,0.47,0.06,0.00
Norway,39.19,23.96,13.30,11.79,6.40,2.39,0.24,0.07 ,0.47,0.05,1.08,0.58,0.25,0.17,0.06
Romania_Ne,16.39,15.98,19.22,12.75,10.65,9.33,11.6 2,1.95,0.04,0.36,1.26,0.07,0.08,0.25,0.04
Romania_Nw,17.07,15.18,18.02,13.43,12.11,7.48,12.8 4,1.27,0.27,0.46,1.21,0.31,0.34,0.02,0.00
Romania_Se,17.84,12.38,15.14,11.64,15.21,7.88,14.2 2,2.06,1.27,0.21,1.00,0.64,0.29,0.23,0.00
Romania_South,16.57,13.97,16.17,8.97,13.72,11.44,1 5.14,2.36,0.15,0.55,0.25,0.54,0.16,0.00,0.05
Romania_Sw,16.69,14.59,17.91,8.98,13.57,9.89,14.00 ,2.04,0.58,0.00,1.08,0.29,0.40,0.00,0.00
Scotland,37.96,28.39,9.51,10.04,7.46,3.26,1.28,0.2 6,0.76,0.03,0.19,0.48,0.13,0.03,0.25
South_Serbian,17.53,16.17,15.54,11.30,13.19,10.26, 13.26,1.49,0.07,0.04,0.04,0.42,0.28,0.10,0.29
Slovak,24.13,15.37,23.26,17.25,8.47,3.93,3.58,1.55 ,0.70,0.00,0.26,0.42,0.33,0.43,0.05
Slovenian,21.68,18.51,20.42,14.29,10.90,5.88,6.34, 0.99,0.29,0.09,0.11,0.18,0.15,0.11,0.03
Italy_Abruzzo,11.25,15.03,6.36,2.91,16.39,15.65,26 .38,5.48,0.00,0.08,0.00,0.00,0.23,0.17,0.07
Italy_Apulia,9.50,14.93,6.66,2.94,17.44,14.90,27.2 4,4.99,0.03,0.05,0.00,0.18,0.58,0.55,0.01
Italy_Calabria,8.07,12.92,4.55,1.98,17.48,15.12,31 .66,6.46,0.13,0.11,0.04,0.09,0.36,0.97,0.07
Italy_Campania,8.83,15.10,5.33,2.06,18.31,14.96,29 .68,5.57,0.12,0.14,0.04,0.06,0.13,0.56,0.08
Italy_Central_Sicily,8.94,14.64,4.78,1.31,17.60,14 .12,29.14,6.68,0.05,0.15,0.03,0.14,0.20,1.84,0.36
Italy_East_Sicily,8.07,12.81,4.41,1.82,18.07,15.44 ,30.59,6.26,0.22,0.18,0.13,0.07,0.23,1.20,0.48
Italy_West_Sicily,9.37,13.38,4.79,1.71,18.12,13.93 ,30.01,5.89,0.32,0.25,0.05,0.16,0.21,0.98,0.85
North_Swedish,37.45,23.37,14.64,13.68,6.12,1.22,0. 23,0.11,0.75,0.18,0.91,0.78,0.43,0.02,0.11
Aland_Sweden,32.07,22.77,18.94,17.59,4.27,0.00,0.0 3,0.00,1.25,0.04,1.91,0.78,0.34,0.00,0.00
Swedish,38.75,24.05,14.44,11.79,5.64,2.45,0.29,0.2 7,0.74,0.11,0.43,0.55,0.29,0.08,0.11
Ukraine_East,18.08,13.38,31.97,22.31,6.69,2.68,1.1 0,0.14,1.86,0.29,0.40,0.42,0.36,0.20,0.12
andre
12-19-2019, 01:59 PM
@Ph2ter, nice!
Eurogenes K13:
Bandari,1.22,5.00,1.58,39.40,17.21,4.19,19.92,0.00 ,0.19,1.09,0.71,2.73,6.66
Iran_Centraleast,3.29,4.79,3.67,39.54,25.33,5.16,1 5.06,0.17,1.02,0.62,0.51,0.37,1.89
Yagnobi,9.72,17.37,1.77,39.98,10.25,1.18,12.38,0.8 0,3.81,1.72,0.00,1.27,0.34
Parsi_India,1.23,2.54,5.08,34.92,22.35,5.58,26.09, 0.25,0.23,0.35,0.13,0.67,0.35
Lucas
12-19-2019, 02:16 PM
ALL today's updates addded for K13, K15 and Eutest.
Thank you all.
Lucas
12-19-2019, 02:26 PM
Here are some of my avearges for K15:
Bavarian,28.38,26.11,11.62,8.33,11.51,6.15,6.01,0. 76,0.10,0.21,0.10,0.23,0.30,0.13,0.05
Albanian-Kosovo,14.93,15.66,11.94,6.23,18.27,10.32,19.43,2. 54,0.09,0.30,0.04,0.04,0.21,0.00,0.00
Albanian-Macedonia,11.79,17.19,12.38,6.66,16.85,10.32,20.82 ,3.28,0.04,0.38,0.11,0.03,0.17,0.00,0.00
Albanian-North,14.45,14.29,11.27,5.18,18.11,11.91,21.57,2.6 8,0.00,0.03,0.05,0.15,0.24,0.07,0.00
Albanian-South,13.63,14.55,9.85,5.47,17.69,11.03,23.38,3.51 ,0.00,0.25,0.09,0.34,0.16,0.00,0.04
Austria-Burgenland,27.63,20.42,15.58,12.08,9.89,5.91,5.45, 0.69,0.63,0.01,0.05,0.86,0.34,0.27,0.19
Austria-Tyrol,25.37,22.36,10.49,8.78,13.81,8.06,8.11,1.89, 0.10,0.17,0.28,0.28,0.16,0.10,0.06
Belgium,32.68,27.36,9.52,7.25,10.65,5.06,5.22,0.60 ,0.64,0.07,0.13,0.11,0.22,0.32,0.15
Bosniak,16.68,16.19,21.25,13.20,11.12,8.39,10.75,1 .07,0.59,0.29,0.09,0.19,0.08,0.08,0.05
Bulgarian_Thracian,7.44,15.78,16.37,6.07,14.41,11. 92,22.38,2.27,2.17,0.67,0.28,0.00,0.25,0.00,0.00
Bulgarian,14.40,14.28,16.61,9.81,13.50,10.73,17.01 ,2.37,0.23,0.09,0.19,0.39,0.32,0.06,0.01
Italy_Emiliaromagna,17.94,19.13,7.04,3.17,20.08,8. 91,19.65,3.29,0.03,0.12,0.00,0.04,0.29,0.15,0.02
Italy_Friuli,19.00,21.50,10.42,6.03,17.50,7.38,14. 76,2.41,0.28,0.15,0.02,0.34,0.06,0.13,0.00
Italy_Lazio,15.18,17.36,7.06,2.43,19.99,9.92,23.83 ,3.74,0.07,0.14,0.03,0.10,0.03,0.05,0.09
Italy_Liguria,18.23,21.71,6.84,3.24,20.21,7.98,17. 82,3.03,0.11,0.17,0.07,0.23,0.24,0.03,0.08
Italy_Lombardy,21.50,22.45,6.34,2.73,20.71,6.38,16 .91,2.27,0.11,0.21,0.08,0.06,0.16,0.07,0.00
Italy_Marche,15.34,17.26,5.97,2.22,19.56,11.73,22. 54,4.32,0.21,0.10,0.00,0.37,0.10,0.27,0.07
Italy_Tuscany,17.25,20.05,6.52,2.79,20.41,9.07,19. 20,3.54,0.57,0.25,0.02,0.06,0.14,0.08,0.02
Italy_Veneto,21.07,21.37,8.50,5.45,18.65,7.15,14.6 9,2.42,0.14,0.18,0.05,0.08,0.15,0.09,0.00
France_Corsica,13.78,21.54,5.02,1.26,24.13,8.14,22 .27,3.14,0.01,0.27,0.07,0.04,0.26,0.06,0.01
Czech,23.49,20.03,22.22,13.99,9.20,4.59,3.88,1.05, 0.53,0.08,0.09,0.37,0.20,0.11,0.14
Danish,39.23,25.55,13.14,10.31,5.77,2.83,0.81,0.31 ,0.76,0.18,0.01,0.59,0.17,0.18,0.14
Dutch,36.81,27.02,10.81,9.42,8.04,3.92,1.47,0.72,0 .83,0.03,0.16,0.24,0.17,0.31,0.05
England,36.15,29.24,10.14,8.74,9.22,3.96,0.75,0.23 ,0.66,0.07,0.04,0.35,0.24,0.05,0.16
France-South,24.81,28.86,7.83,4.15,20.13,2.81,8.79,1.30,0 .44,0.08,0.09,0.39,0.13,0.09,0.07
Gagauz,13.85,12.01,15.31,9.84,13.82,12.36,18.58,2. 86,0.29,0.13,0.19,0.24,0.47,0.04,0.00
Greek_Crete,8.69,10.84,7.57,3.47,16.52,16.62,30.27 ,4.78,0.01,0.10,0.18,0.14,0.51,0.24,0.06
Macedonian,14.32,14.52,13.71,9.18,15.61,10.30,18.7 1,2.88,0.09,0.17,0.05,0.18,0.26,0.02,0.00
Italy_Aostavalley,26.62,25.03,7.48,4.39,17.71,6.75 ,9.38,1.80,0.00,0.02,0.17,0.19,0.14,0.15,0.16
Italy_Piedmont,21.38,25.13,7.86,4.01,19.32,6.70,12 .69,2.19,0.11,0.01,0.06,0.12,0.24,0.13,0.03
Italy_Trentino,21.92,21.72,11.28,5.55,18.46,5.83,1 3.09,1.32,0.00,0.03,0.11,0.16,0.47,0.06,0.00
Norway,39.19,23.96,13.30,11.79,6.40,2.39,0.24,0.07 ,0.47,0.05,1.08,0.58,0.25,0.17,0.06
Romania_Ne,16.39,15.98,19.22,12.75,10.65,9.33,11.6 2,1.95,0.04,0.36,1.26,0.07,0.08,0.25,0.04
Romania_Nw,17.07,15.18,18.02,13.43,12.11,7.48,12.8 4,1.27,0.27,0.46,1.21,0.31,0.34,0.02,0.00
Romania_Se,17.84,12.38,15.14,11.64,15.21,7.88,14.2 2,2.06,1.27,0.21,1.00,0.64,0.29,0.23,0.00
Romania_South,16.57,13.97,16.17,8.97,13.72,11.44,1 5.14,2.36,0.15,0.55,0.25,0.54,0.16,0.00,0.05
Romania_Sw,16.69,14.59,17.91,8.98,13.57,9.89,14.00 ,2.04,0.58,0.00,1.08,0.29,0.40,0.00,0.00
Scotland,37.96,28.39,9.51,10.04,7.46,3.26,1.28,0.2 6,0.76,0.03,0.19,0.48,0.13,0.03,0.25
South_Serbian,17.53,16.17,15.54,11.30,13.19,10.26, 13.26,1.49,0.07,0.04,0.04,0.42,0.28,0.10,0.29
Slovak,24.13,15.37,23.26,17.25,8.47,3.93,3.58,1.55 ,0.70,0.00,0.26,0.42,0.33,0.43,0.05
Slovenian,21.68,18.51,20.42,14.29,10.90,5.88,6.34, 0.99,0.29,0.09,0.11,0.18,0.15,0.11,0.03
Italy_Abruzzo,11.25,15.03,6.36,2.91,16.39,15.65,26 .38,5.48,0.00,0.08,0.00,0.00,0.23,0.17,0.07
Italy_Apulia,9.50,14.93,6.66,2.94,17.44,14.90,27.2 4,4.99,0.03,0.05,0.00,0.18,0.58,0.55,0.01
Italy_Calabria,8.07,12.92,4.55,1.98,17.48,15.12,31 .66,6.46,0.13,0.11,0.04,0.09,0.36,0.97,0.07
Italy_Campania,8.83,15.10,5.33,2.06,18.31,14.96,29 .68,5.57,0.12,0.14,0.04,0.06,0.13,0.56,0.08
Italy_Central_Sicily,8.94,14.64,4.78,1.31,17.60,14 .12,29.14,6.68,0.05,0.15,0.03,0.14,0.20,1.84,0.36
Italy_East_Sicily,8.07,12.81,4.41,1.82,18.07,15.44 ,30.59,6.26,0.22,0.18,0.13,0.07,0.23,1.20,0.48
Italy_West_Sicily,9.37,13.38,4.79,1.71,18.12,13.93 ,30.01,5.89,0.32,0.25,0.05,0.16,0.21,0.98,0.85
North_Swedish,37.45,23.37,14.64,13.68,6.12,1.22,0. 23,0.11,0.75,0.18,0.91,0.78,0.43,0.02,0.11
Aland_Sweden,32.07,22.77,18.94,17.59,4.27,0.00,0.0 3,0.00,1.25,0.04,1.91,0.78,0.34,0.00,0.00
Swedish,38.75,24.05,14.44,11.79,5.64,2.45,0.29,0.2 7,0.74,0.11,0.43,0.55,0.29,0.08,0.11
Ukraine_East,18.08,13.38,31.97,22.31,6.69,2.68,1.1 0,0.14,1.86,0.29,0.40,0.42,0.36,0.20,0.12
This is really substantial update:) !
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 02:48 PM
ALL today's updates addded for K13, K15 and Eutest.
Thank you all.
Romanian_Gorj,25.62,23.57,18.72,9.22,17.21,1.49,1. 41,1.28,0.58,0.01,0.32,0.39,0.19
Mingle
12-19-2019, 02:50 PM
@Lukasz Now it would be best to revert Romania_Oltenia's name back to regular "Romania" since we have an actual Romanian Oltenia sample (Romanian_Gorj posted above).
Here are some of my avearges for K15:
Can you post the Albanian averages for K13/15 in normal format? I would like to save them for future reference as that ethnic group is largely absent in spreadsheets except one or two.
Mingle
12-19-2019, 04:15 PM
Romanian Apuseni.
What about Romanian Muntenia? What counties is the Romanian Muntenian average based off of?
Eurogenes K13
Turkmen_Iran,5.34,7.07,3.13,37.09,16.37,2.33,11.33 ,5.70,9.32,1.06,0.50,0.47,0.35
When will you remove Croat-like Bosnian_Serb average, how many times I need to repeat?
I see you had no problem to remove Romanian-like Serb average, now be so kind and do the same thing for Bosnian Serb which is much closer to Croats than to Serbs.
It's fucking up calculator for Croats. Get rid of it already.
Show your distance table for EUtest
Only after Bosnian Serbs which you added will be removed.
Nurzat
12-19-2019, 04:28 PM
does anyone get such a big score of any component on K13 updated as Suceava_County-1 sample? (he gets up to 49.6% Ukrainian with nothing removed from source - interesting to get 1 component of 267 at this share)
https://scontent.fotp1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/79968916_139876380785494_8114411004286205952_n.jpg ?_nc_cat=103&_nc_ohc=ZtVtgK8gxd0AQkFdCNazJ1Rbob0oA_MeLGbnvGdxE3 BGHtD0St_YD7k7Q&_nc_ht=scontent.fotp1-2.fna&oh=75a61f5ebf371c319c72da3afc2b63a8&oe=5E70916A
I think everyone here agrees that 23andme needs to do to slovenians and nw croats what they've done do finns, give them their own category.
Then you'll see a lot of croats scoring different mixes between bosnians(serbs) and this new slovenian/nw croat group, showing how their EE on 23andme has been artificially inflated.
Unfortunately for you, it's Serbs who cluster in Central Balkans, between Croats/Bosnians and Romanians/Bulgarians, not the opposite.
According to a 2014 autosomal analysis of Western Balkan, the Croatian population shows genetic uniformity with other South Slavic populations. The Croatians and Bosnians were more close to East European populations and largely overlapped with Hungarians from Central Europe. In the 2015 analysis, they formed a western South Slavic cluster with the Bosnians and Slovenians in comparison to eastern cluster formed by Macedonians and Bulgarians with Serbians in the middle. The western cluster has an inclination toward Hungarians, Czechs, and Slovaks, while the eastern cluster toward Romanians and some extent Greeks
And this quote comes from academic study of western Balkans, unlike your fantasies.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4141785/
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 04:31 PM
Only after Bosnian Serbs which you added will be removed.
dose your father get Croat_Split as No 1 now? i think it's pretty similar to him
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 04:33 PM
Only after Bosnian Serbs which you added will be removed.
it is academic samples, why should it be removed? they will not be removed.
dose your father get Croat_Split as No 1 now? i think it's pretty similar to him
Yes. And it makes sense because 50% of his ancestry is from Split-Dalmatia county.
https://i.imgur.com/ugIbpZb.png
it is academic samples, why should it be removed? they will not be removed.
You have problems with intelligence? Serbian academic average was already removed, because it is too Romanian-like.
This average made of 4 people from northern Bosnia needs to be removed as well. It's Croat like and Serbs don't score it.
Yes it will be removed.
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 04:41 PM
Added!
If someone has good new refs for this and other calcs I will add.
for EUtest ver.1:
Karitiana_Brazil,0,18.67,0,0,0,0,0,0,11.27,0,26.28 ,43.78,0
Pima_Native_American,0,22.34,0,0,0,0,0,0,10.18,0,2 1.75,45.55,0.17
Romani_1,4.76,7.34,9.29,6.16,10,16.64,13.16,7.01,2 4.27,0,1.08,0,0.3
Latvian_1,40.185,25.92,16.835,12.915,3.045,0.25,0. 82,0,0,0,0,0.025,0
Moroccan_Jew,0,3.47,7.43,9.16,18.83,30.8,9.17,18.3 ,0,1.58,0,0,1.26
Population,SOUTH_BALTIC,EAST_EURO,NORTH-CENTRAL_EURO,ATLANTIC,WEST_MED,EAST_MED,WEST_ASIAN ,MIDDLE_EASTERN,SOUTH_ASIAN,EAST_AFRICAN,EAST_ASIA N,SIBERIAN,WEST_AFRICAN
My father results without Bosnian Serbs (I will from now on delete them from reference data)
https://i.imgur.com/39BjPlF.png
Not that I care much about this tool but here is my father's MDLP K23b
Distance to: Dad
2.81780056 Russian-West
3.20206184 Belarusian-East
3.28240765 Russian-North-West
3.30342247 Russian_South
3.72048384 Belarusian_West
3.73765970 Ukrainian_East
4.08066171 Sorb
4.09450852 Don_cossack
4.28672369 Ukrainian
4.30903702 Russian_North
4.42098405 Ukrainian_Center
4.80004167 Russian_Meshtchyora
4.83626922 Kashub
5.50746766 Russian-Upper-Volga
6.54197982 Pole
6.99778536 Mordovian
7.01084874 Belarusian_South
7.12734874 Balt
7.14537613 Ukrainian_West
7.32196695 Belarusian
8.24581106 Russian_Center
8.52157262 Erzya
8.84841229 Russian_Vologda
8.98704067 Slovak
9.00239968 Belarusian_Russian
Target: Dad
Distance: 1.0661% / 1.06610812
62.0 Latvian
15.6 Kashub
13.4 Frisian
6.8 Georgian_Svan
1.0 Lithuanian
0.4 Ami_Taiwan
0.4 Dai
0.4 Eskimo_Chaplin
Will do my mom's too.
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 04:48 PM
You have problems with intelligence? Serbian academic average was already removed, because it is too Romanian-like.
This average made of 4 people from northern Bosnia needs to be removed as well. It's Croat like and Serbs don't score it.
Yes it will be removed.
Serbs like Ford (Serb from Bosnia) and Dusan are the closest to this average Serbian_Bosnia in EUtest ver.1. Deal with it. It will not be removed.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 04:50 PM
Unfortunately for you, it's Serbs who cluster in Central Balkans, between Croats/Bosnians and Romanians/Bulgarians, not the opposite.
And this quote comes from academic study of western Balkans, unlike your fantasies.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4141785/
Its the second time i have to repeat myself: its all context dependent. If you're trying to parrot me at least have some logic.
Genetics are not enough to prove assimilation, because we can model every euro ethnicity using others, it needs to be paired with other things like language, names, traditions...
Your southern croats speak serbian, unlike slovenians and those 50%+ EE slovenized croats.
And from a historical point of view its hilarious to just think Romania and Serbia came from a fake, with no history and recent country like Croatia, with the north plotting with slovenians/czechs and south with bosnians or slightly more north, not to mention stolen cities from italians and serbs.
You would be typical serbian in genetics had it not been for your german and slovenian mixture(like your cetnik dad according to Vahaduo :lol00002: ), so I'd keep my head down if I were in your place.
Serbs like Ford (Serb from Bosnia) and Dusan are the closest to this average Serbian_Bosnia. Deal with it. It will not be removed.
No, Dušan isn't closest to it and Ford is closer to Croats than to Serbs. It will be removed, I already messaged Lucas.
He had no problem to remove academic Serb samples which contain much more people than your pathetic average.
Fuck off from South Slavic genetics orthodox Mongrel, it's none of your business.
Cumansky
12-19-2019, 04:51 PM
If a race did not exist until 1918, 1947, 1990, 2000s, etc this is not a race, so why is the calculator using I don't understand. K13 is poor calculator update or not, the foundation is shit
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 04:53 PM
No, Dušan isn't closest to it and Ford is closer to Croats than to Serbs. It will be removed, I already messaged Lucas.
He had no problem to remove academic Serb samples which contain much more people than your pathetic average.
Fuck off from South Slavic genetics orthodox Mongrel, it's none of your business.
in EUtest ver.1 they get it as number 1, not in k13. See previous pages for results. You are a troll anyway, I don't take you seriously.
Its the second time i have to repeat myself: its all context dependent. If you're trying to parrot me at least have some logic.
Genetics are not enough to prove assimilation, because we can model every euro ethnicity using others, it needs to be paired with other things like language, names, traditions...
Your southern croats speak serbian, unlike slovenians and those 50%+ EE slovenized croats.
And from a historical point of view its hilarious to just think Romania and Serbia came from a fake, with no history and recent country like Croatia, with the north plotting with slovenians/czechs and south with bosnians or slightly more north, not to mention stolen cities from italians and serbs.
You would be typical serbian in genetics had it not been for your german and slovenian mixture(like your cetnik dad according to Vahaduo :lol00002: ), so I'd keep my head down if I were in your place.
Ofcourse Serbia doesn't come from Croatia, it has nothing to do with it.
My father plot like typical Croat everywhere, and he has nothing to do with Serbs neither he can pass for one.
I just told him about this and he laughed. He told me how is he close to them when they look like Vlachs and nothing like Croats.
I said dad, only to Bosnian Serbs.
He said ofcourse, they are orthodox Croats forced to eastern religion during Ottoman occupation of Catholic Bosnia.
in EUtest ver.1 they get it as number 1, not in k13. See previous pages for results. You are a troll anyway, I don't take you seriously.
I don't care for that test. In K13 they need to be removed. Or they can be renamed to Orthodox_Croat_Bih
Zmey Gorynych
12-19-2019, 04:59 PM
Lots of drama here. The problem is that averages were made from small groups of people. Romanians have 5-6 averages, croatians 4, bosnians 3, etc. What is the point in having so many regional averages? What is Bosnian and Bosniak from k13 and k15 respectively?
The Ottoman conquest of the Kingdom of Bosnia in 1463 led to drastic changes in the confessional structure of Bosnia and Herzegovina, with Islam taking root and Orthodox Christianity spreading into Bosnia. Sultan Mehmed the Conqueror vowed to protect Orthodox Christianity and, like all Orthodox churches, the Serbian Orthodox Church enjoyed great support of the Ottoman state. The Ottomans introduced a sizeable Orthodox Christian population into Bosnia proper, including Vlachs from the eastern Balkans. The conversion of the adherents of the Bosnian Church also aided the spread of Eastern Orthodoxy. Later, areas abandoned by Catholics during the Ottoman–Habsburg wars were settled with Muslims and Orthodox Christians.The Ottoman regime consistently favored the Orthodox Church over the Catholic and encouraged conversions of Catholics to Orthodoxy due to political expediency: while the entire Orthodox hierarchy was subjected to the sultan, the Catholics were suspected of conspiring with their brethren outside the Ottoman Empire.
While Bosnian Catholics were only allowed to repair existing sacral objects, a large scale construction of Orthodox monasteries and churches throughout Bosnia started in the northwest in 1515.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eastern_Orthodoxy_in_Bosnia_and_Herzegovina
Will do my mom's too.
Distance to: Mom
5.77298017 Russian-Upper-Volga
6.20587625 Erzya
6.91616946 Russian-North
6.99197397 Russian_Vologda
7.06806197 Russian_Meshtchyora
7.31379518 Finnish_FIN
7.50860839 Finnish-East
7.51081221 Russian-Ural
7.51674797 Finn_East
7.77401441 Russian_North
8.01592789 Mordovian
8.15341033 Russian-West
8.72650560 Finn
8.93351555 Russian_South
8.95936940 Moksha
9.02956810 Belarusian-East
9.09478422 Russian-North-West
9.79992857 Ukrainian_Center
10.11438579 Finn_West
10.18150775 Belarusian_West
10.36615647 Ukrainian_East
10.56621503 Ukrainian_West
10.65387723 Ukrainian
10.85980202 Sorb
10.91351914 Karelian
Target: Mom
Distance: 2.4112% / 2.41124482
43.8 Pole
24.8 Estonian
9.4 Udmurd
9.0 Finnish_FIN
5.2 Khant
2.6 BedouinB
2.2 Greek_Phokaia
1.4 Swede
1.2 Eskimo_Naukan
0.4 Sardinian
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 05:04 PM
it is academic samples, why should it be removed? they will not be removed.
maybe it should be merged with the academic Belgrade sample? the Bosnian Serb samples are typical north-shifted Serbs which are missing from the Belgrade sample, maybe it would work well together.
here it is:
Serb_academic,24.84,28.98,16.81,8.79,16.32,1.55,0. 47,0.42,0.70,0.48,0.51,0.10,0.03
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 05:05 PM
I don't care for that test. In K13 they need to be removed. Or they can be renamed to Orthodox_Croat_Bih
you have EUtest result in your signature, and you had written "Trollina" in your ethnicity or meta-ethnicity some time ago. You think I should take your insults seriously?
https://i.imgur.com/QFX5A1F.png
you have EUtest result in your signature, and you had written "Trollina" in your ethnicity or meta-ethnicity some time ago. You think I should take your insults seriously?
I am not happy with my father being close to Serbs because he is not south shifted Croat, he is average Croat (who never got Serbs close on gedmatch)
Serbs like Dušan get hysterical when close to Croats too.
We don't like Serbs, they don't like us and we are genetically not the same. What is hard to understand?
I already made South_Croat Morlach average which is closest to proper Serbs, and have no problem with it because it's realistic.
Bosnian Serb average isn't. Serbs live all over Bosnia and if more people were added from more southernly parts they would not be so close to Croats.
Dunai
12-19-2019, 05:10 PM
Interesting that even with all these new additions to the database I'm still getting mostly the same results, with a few new entries, like Czech and Székely. Of course this test is unable to correctly find my true German ancestry, which is of Western type (at least my Danube Swabian roots were connected to West Germany, not with Austria and East Germany), but at least it finds mostly Hungarian, which I am 7/8 parts.
K13
Distance to: Dunai
3.60105540 Hungarian
4.48241007 Austrian
5.63640843 Kaykavian_Croatian
5.73868452 East_German
6.94808599 Slovenian
7.93761929 Czech
8.15456927 Csango_Gymes
8.42805413 Slovak
8.55763986 Szekely
9.94504399 Croatian
10.00323948 Croat_Split
10.28045901 Serbian_Bosnia
10.95142456 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
11.11678461 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
11.29995575 Moldavian
11.55813376 Bosnian
11.89537725 South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster
12.03761604 West_German
12.10770115 Serbian_new
13.19294129 South_Polish
13.52265876 South_Dutch
14.20422824 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
14.28767817 Montenegrin
14.39797902 Ukrainian_Lviv
14.44320602 North_German
Target: Dunai
Distance: 0.8296% / 0.82964568 | ADC: 0.25x
49.8 Hungarian
44.6 Austrian
2.0 Oroqen
1.4 North_German
1.4 North_Swedish
0.4 Mongolian
0.4 NAN_Melanesian
Target: Dunai
Distance: 1.6896% / 1.68955473 | ADC: 0.5x
55.6 Hungarian
43.0 Austrian
1.4 Oroqen
Target: Dunai
Distance: 2.7708% / 2.77081894 | ADC: 1x
69.8 Hungarian
30.2 Austrian
K15
Distance to: Dunai
5.48811443 Hungarian
6.40308519 Austria-Burgenland
6.43275213 Kaykavian_Croatian
6.55948931 East_German
6.59875746 Czech
6.95816012 Slovenian
7.28060437 Austrian
8.37676399 Szekely
8.89500086 Slovak
9.98492364 Croatian
11.57899823 German_Bavarian
11.62819418 Moldavian
11.65716169 Serbian_Bosnia
11.73259988 Austria-Tyrol
11.74618417 Bosnian
11.94728003 Bosniak
11.97922785 Serbian
12.31175048 Romania_Ne
12.70065746 South_Polish
12.97095216 Ukrainian_Lviv
13.28372689 Romania_Nw
13.30366867 Southwest_Finnish
13.44508832 South_Dutch
13.46184237 North_German
13.89553525 South_Serbian
Target: Dunai
Distance: 2.7460% / 2.74602373 | ADC: 0.25x
30.4 Hungarian
29.2 Czech
21.4 North_German
15.4 Szekely
2.2 North_Ossetian
0.8 Oroqen
0.6 Hezhen
Target: Dunai
Distance: 3.6934% / 3.69339295 | ADC: 0.5x
45.2 Hungarian
20.4 Szekely
13.4 North_German
10.8 Czech
10.2 East_German
Target: Dunai
Distance: 4.8344% / 4.83444247 | ADC: 1x
71.4 Hungarian
16.8 Austria-Burgenland
11.8 East_German
Cumansky
12-19-2019, 05:12 PM
This is lower distance than what my parents got in GEDmatch Eurogenes K13, but to get this lower distance I actually had to remove many overlapping non representative samples, and the distance is still shit, especially on my Mothers kit
0x
Target: Cumansky_Mother
Distance: 4.3279% / 4.32785291
73.6 Latvian
8.4 Moroccan_Jew
7.2 Algerian_Jewish
4.8 Romanian_Muntenia
2.2 Sardinian
2.0 Yoruban
1.8 Yemenite_Jewish
0x
Target: Cumansky_Father
Distance: 2.8752% / 2.87517833
61.2 Latvian
13.2 Romanian_Muntenia
8.0 Danish
6.0 Spanish_Valencia
4.6 Moroccan_Jew
4.0 Finnish
1.8 Lebanese_Druze
0.6 Karitiana
0.6 Norwegian
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 05:16 PM
quote
where is this massive Croat influence in the Bosnian Serbs? :scratch:
btw, these are the absolutely most north-shifted Bosnian Serbs i've seen. Bosnian Serbs can get 28-29 too, probably even 27.
https://i.imgur.com/419lC5Z.png
To my knowledge the smallest distance for a Croat I've seen was on MDLP World. Some of you guys are too much obsessed with the holy K13. To me personally (my own results) it's crap.
where is this massive Croat influence in the Bosnian Serbs? :scratch:
btw, these are the absolutely most north-shifted Bosnian Serbs i've seen. Bosnian Serbs can get 28-29 too, probably even 27.
https://i.imgur.com/419lC5Z.png
I am just answering in same manner that Romanian trolled my father.
Where is Serb influence in my dad?
He is half Croat from Hvar Island, 1/8 Central Croat, 1/8 NW Croat and 1/4 Bosniak with all surnames of his Bosniak ancestors being only found among Catholic Croats, never among Serbs.
And they have roots from western BiH.
in MDLP K16 he plots like this:
1. Croat (Croatia)
2. Croat (BiH)
3. Bosniak (BiH)
4. Serb (BiH)
5. Slovenian
6. Hungarian
And that's exactly how average Croat should plot.
I think he perfectly represent Croats because he is mix of Adriatic Croatia, Panonnian Croatia and Bosnia_Herzegovina.
And his ancestors spoke all 3 dialects of Croatian language: 50% spoke Čakavian, 25% spoke Kajkavian and 25% spoke Štokavian.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 05:28 PM
I am just answering in same manner that Romanian trolled my father.
Where is Serb influence in my dad?
He is half Croat from Hvar Island, 1/8 Central Croat, 1/8 NW Croat and 1/4 Bosniak with all surnames of his Bosniak ancestors being only found among Catholic Croats, never among Serbs.
And they have roots from western BiH.
in MDLP K16 he plots like this:
1. Croat (Croatia)
2. Croat (BiH)
3. Bosniak (BiH)
4. Serb (BiH)
5. Slovenian
6. Hungarian
And that's exactly how average Croat should plot.
I have never implied recent admixture, don't change my words.Just pointed out the obvious, based on how different NW croats are to southern ones, as if they belong to different ethnicities.
If your dad was not 25% NW and central croat that 4th Serb would likely be first.
We don't like Serbs, they don't like us and we are genetically not the same. What is hard to understand?
Haha, I know you would claim you feel more at home in Budapest where Uralic mumbo-jumbo is spoken than in Belgrade, a fully Serbo-Croatian-speaking city. I remember talking to a Serb tourist in Belarus and he told me the Yu people are racially the same but some of them are primitive cavemen because of their beliefs, not DNA (presumably Bosniaks and some Croats).
Dunai
12-19-2019, 05:34 PM
It's weird to constantly see both Croatians and Serbians claim Bosnians as part of their nation, however both sides fail to understand that Bosnians are a very old, distinct Medieval entity in the Western Balkans, often caught in a feud between Kingdom of Hungary and the Byzantine Empire. They are their own nation, which only in modern times was separated into 3 different parts, because of religious divisions. But Medieval Bosnia even had their own Church, separate from both Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox ones.
"The Bosnian Church was a Christian church in medieval Bosnia that was independent of and considered heretical by both the Roman Catholic and the Eastern Orthodox hierarchies.
The East–West Schism then led to the establishment of Roman Catholicism in Croatia and most of Dalmatia, while Eastern Orthodoxy came to prevail in Serbia. Lying in-between, the mountainous Bosnia was nominally under Rome, but Catholicism never became firmly established due to a weak church organization and poor communications. Medieval Bosnia thus remained a "no-man's land between faiths" rather than a meeting ground between the two Churches, leading to a unique religious history and the emergence of an "independent and somewhat heretical church".
Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy predominated in different parts of what is today Bosnia and Herzegovina; the followers of the former formed a majority in the west, the north and in the center of Bosnia, while those of the latter were a majority in most of Zachlumia (present-day Herzegovina) and along Bosnia's eastern border. This changed in the mid-13th century, when the Bosnian Church began eclipsing the Roman. While Bosnia remained nominally Catholic in the High Middle Ages, the Bishop of Bosnia was a local cleric chosen by Bosnians and then sent to the Archbishop of Ragusa solely for ordination. Although the Papacy already insisted on using Latin as the liturgical language, Bosnian Catholics retained Church Slavonic language."
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 05:34 PM
I am not happy with my father being close to Serbs because he is not south shifted Croat, he is average Croat (who never got Serbs close on gedmatch)
Serbs like Dušan get hysterical when close to Croats too.
We don't like Serbs, they don't like us and we are genetically not the same. What is hard to understand?
I already made South_Croat Morlach average which is closest to proper Serbs, and have no problem with it because it's realistic.
Bosnian Serb average isn't. Serbs live all over Bosnia and if more people were added from more southernly parts they would not be so close to Croats.
so what if you don't like it? there is also one Ukrainian user here (Art23) that gets hysterical when he gets "Russian" or anything related to Russia in his results. I find it hilarious. Not sure, but he may get Russia in his 23andme results because there are millions Ukrainians in Russia, or maybe he is not aware of all his ancestors.
Plotting close to something does not always indicate real ancestry. You can be half Serbian and half British and plot like average Austrian (like Ayetooey), so what, he should be offended by his position on pca or oracle results? we should remove the Austrian reference because he doesn't like Austrians for example?
ph2ter
12-19-2019, 05:42 PM
Some more K13 averages:
Albanian,21.07,17.56,23.81,11.15,23.81,1.62,0.25,0 .07,0.15,0.13,0.17,0.00,0.00
Algerian,13.95,0.61,24.25,0.00,27.47,14.21,0.00,0. 31,0.12,0.10,0.39,8.89,9.66
Danish,48.13,28.42,11.20,4.88,3.64,0.68,1.07,0.07, 0.93,0.45,0.25,0.16,0.10
English,49.96,23.98,13.57,5.83,3.30,0.62,0.85,0.13 ,0.22,0.35,0.38,0.13,0.13
German_east,36.93,36.50,12.59,5.57,4.79,0.78,0.69, 0.09,0.30,0.78,0.55,0.15,0.20
German_West,45.37,25.20,13.22,7.02,5.78,0.85,0.30, 0.58,0.39,0.37,0.11,0.35,0.14
North-Dutch,51.14,26.48,10.78,5.58,2.75,0.38,1.17,0.02,0 .38,0.22,0.22,0.10,0.02
North-Swedish,44.53,36.23,6.25,3.95,0.66,0.40,1.26,0.39, 4.94,0.62,0.60,0.09,0.14
Scottish,52.74,22.77,12.06,6.59,1.74,0.62,1.28,0.0 4,0.43,0.97,0.40,0.07,0.04
Slovakian,29.47,38.84,11.90,5.00,8.64,2.35,1.09,0. 00,0.94,0.88,0.64,0.07,0.18
Slovene,30.66,34.00,14.71,7.03,9.92,1.18,0.72,0.32 ,0.46,0.51,0.32,0.10,0.07
South_Dutch,44.59,22.22,15.74,6.01,7.37,1.47,1.05, 0.20,0.84,0.24,0.02,0.09,0.16
Swedish,48.45,30.99,9.81,3.64,2.43,0.84,1.41,0.21, 0.68,0.56,0.40,0.32,0.23
Swiss_French,37.79,20.53,19.52,7.90,10.97,1.49,0.2 7,0.26,0.44,0.44,0.36,0.04,0.00
Swiss_German,40.15,22.01,17.27,6.58,10.31,1.90,0.0 8,0.28,0.25,0.52,0.29,0.29,0.09
Swiss_Italian,36.35,15.43,23.16,2.81,18.65,2.71,0. 26,0.00,0.41,0.00,0.18,0.08,0.00
Welsh,51.09,22.22,15.85,6.86,0.43,1.18,0.40,0.58,0 .00,0.74,0.38,0.17,0.12
EUtest:
Kaikavian_Croatian,23.50,17.22,18.47,17.04,9.49,8. 05,5.21,0.37,0.48,0.00,0.16,0.00,0.00
Morlak
12-19-2019, 05:46 PM
k13
Distance to: morlak
3.56569769 Romanian_Transylvania
3.65406623 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
3.86826835 South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster
3.93570631 Serbian_new
4.37617139 Montenegrin
5.45135028 Macedonian
5.48305572 Romanian_Oltenia
5.50760408 Bosnian
5.53452798 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
5.99600700 Croat_Split
6.13970989 Serbian_Bosnia
6.94177931 Szekely
6.96043820 Romanian_Muntenia
7.24777897 Bulgarian
8.13154967 Moldavian
8.78695055 Csango_Gymes
9.08145810 North_Macedonian
9.54484154 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
10.86526571 Slovenian
11.34314771 Croatian
12.39668907 Hungarian
13.13552769 Kosovo_Albanian
14.05566790 Albanian
14.35261649 Kaykavian_Croatian
15.08873740 Slovak
Target: moralk
Distance: 1.0061% / 1.00612675
22.0 Macedonian
20.4 South_Polish
18.6 Romanian_Muntenia
11.2 Ukrainian_Belgorod
9.0 Sardinian
6.8 Polish
5.2 Laz
4.2 Albanian
1.4 Georgian_imereti
1.2 Dai
k15
Distance to: morlak
6.82126088 Romania_Se
7.57150620 Montenegrin
8.67752269 Romania_Nw
8.73471808 South_Serbian
9.09948438 Bosnian
9.17187549 Romania_Sw
9.21227985 Romania_South
9.28128864 Serbian_Bosnia
9.44176361 Serbian
9.44239906 Moldavian
9.99305759 Romania_Ne
10.29775704 Romanian
10.48350872 Macedonian
10.56819284 Bosniak
11.14978475 Bulgarian
11.91198556 Gagauz
12.13231223 Hungarian
12.18895709 Szekely
12.77361734 Macedonian_2
12.98228171 Slovenian
13.50683901 Croatian
14.48580770 Slovak
15.35330909 Albanian-Kosovo
15.38509993 Kaykavian_Croatian
15.48446641 Austria-Burgenland
Target: morlak
Distance: 5.0911% / 5.09108258
73.6 Romania_Se
14.8 Ukrainian
6.8 Tabassaran
4.8 West_Norwegian
so what if you don't like it? there is also one Ukrainian user here (Art23) that gets hysterical when he gets "Russian" or anything related to Russia in his results. I find it hilarious. Not sure, but he may get Russia in his 23andme results because there are millions Ukrainians in Russia, or maybe he is not aware of all his ancestors.
Ukraine also has many Russians in the East and Southeast, maybe now many started calling themselves Ukrainian, I don't know but back in 1989 20-40% declared Russian ethnicity during the census (depending on the oblast). It's all the same to me, Kiev is the cradle of Russia and 70% of the pop don't live in Galicia or Volyn (the most distant Ukrainians). if the Sicilians can be the same nation with the Lombardians, we East Slavs can be even more so. That guy represents modern UA "nationalism" very well. Not a positive identity but negative as they care more about being non-Russian than Ukrainian. Really makes you think.
P.S. Just my take on that.
It's weird to constantly see both Croatians and Serbians claim Bosnians as part of their nation, however both sides fail to understand that Bosnians are a very old, distinct Medieval entity in the Western Balkans, often caught in a feud between Kingdom of Hungary and the Byzantine Empire. They are their own nation, which only in modern times was separated into 3 different parts, because of religious divisions. But Medieval Bosnia even had their own Church, separate from both Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox ones.
"The Bosnian Church was a Christian church in medieval Bosnia that was independent of and considered heretical by both the Roman Catholic and the Eastern Orthodox hierarchies.
The East–West Schism then led to the establishment of Roman Catholicism in Croatia and most of Dalmatia, while Eastern Orthodoxy came to prevail in Serbia. Lying in-between, the mountainous Bosnia was nominally under Rome, but Catholicism never became firmly established due to a weak church organization and poor communications. Medieval Bosnia thus remained a "no-man's land between faiths" rather than a meeting ground between the two Churches, leading to a unique religious history and the emergence of an "independent and somewhat heretical church".
Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy predominated in different parts of what is today Bosnia and Herzegovina; the followers of the former formed a majority in the west, the north and in the center of Bosnia, while those of the latter were a majority in most of Zachlumia (present-day Herzegovina) and along Bosnia's eastern border. This changed in the mid-13th century, when the Bosnian Church began eclipsing the Roman. While Bosnia remained nominally Catholic in the High Middle Ages, the Bishop of Bosnia was a local cleric chosen by Bosnians and then sent to the Archbishop of Ragusa solely for ordination. Although the Papacy already insisted on using Latin as the liturgical language, Bosnian Catholics retained Church Slavonic language."
Bosnian church was never widespread among the lower classes and only briefly among the nobles.
Cumansky
12-19-2019, 05:54 PM
Ukraine also has many Russians in the East and Southeast, maybe now many started calling themselves Ukrainian, I don't know but back in 1989 20-40% declared Russian ethnicity during the census (depending on the oblast). It's all the same to me, Kiev is the cradle of Russia and 70% of the pop don't live in Galicia or Volyn (the most distant Ukrainians). if the Sicilians can be the same nation with the Lombardians, we East Slavs can be even more so. That guy represents modern UA "nationalism" very well. Not a positive identity but negative as they care more about being non-Russian than Ukrainian. Really makes you think.
P.S. Just my take on that.
My take, 1989 there was no Ukraine, 1989 there was no Belarus
You are all no offence, fake
But I am 1/2 Cossack so fuck you my friend I can say what I want when I want
Nurzat
12-19-2019, 05:58 PM
Ukraine also has many Russians in the East and Southeast, maybe now many started calling themselves Ukrainian, I don't know but back in 1989 20-40% declared Russian ethnicity during the census (depending on the oblast). It's all the same to me, Kiev is the cradle of Russia and 70% of the pop don't live in Galicia or Volyn (the most distant Ukrainians). if the Sicilians can be the same nation with the Lombardians, we East Slavs can be even more so. That guy represents modern UA "nationalism" very well. Not a positive identity but negative as they care more about being non-Russian than Ukrainian. Really makes you think.
P.S. Just my take on that.
українці Карпат - сицилійці східних слов'ян xD
My take, 1989 there was no Ukraine, 1989 there was no Belarus
You are all no offence, fake
But I am 1/2 Cossack so fuck you my friend I can say what I want when I want
Dude, I don't care about your ancestry, go be angry elsewhere. I identify as Russian and you barely understood my post.
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 06:06 PM
k13
did you get Serbian 1st before? we should add a more southern Serbian average again
Cumansky
12-19-2019, 06:07 PM
Dude, I don't care about your ancestry, go be angry elsewhere. I identify as Russian and you barely understood my post.
Я думал, что ты белорус. Твой язык глуп, это была пропаганда, чтобы этнически очистить тебя.
Even Nursultan Kazakh President said fuck this language, but Russian is dumbest race even worse than other Cyrillic village idiots
Nurzat
12-19-2019, 06:08 PM
Dude, I don't care about your ancestry, go be angry elsewhere. I identify as Russian and you barely understood my post.
did I tell you that Ukrainians in Romania although they all know they are Ukrainian call themselves руснаки and their language руський? informally they much more often use "знаєш по-нашому?" / "по-руськи" than "по-українськи". this is archaic.
did I tell you that Ukrainians in Romania although they all know they are Ukrainian call themselves руснаки and their language руський? informally they much more often use "знаєш по-нашому?" / "по-руськи" than "по-українськи". this is archaic.
Yes and it makes sense as the Ukr identity gradually spread from the East to the West and not the other way around. The actual borderland was in the East. Even Ryazan at some point was referred to as украина.
so what if you don't like it? there is also one Ukrainian user here (Art23) that gets hysterical when he gets "Russian" or anything related to Russia in his results. I find it hilarious. Not sure, but he may get Russia in his 23andme results because there are millions Ukrainians in Russia, or maybe he is not aware of all his ancestors.
Plotting close to something does not always indicate real ancestry. You can be half Serbian and half British and plot like average Austrian (like Ayetooey), so what, he should be offended by his position on pca or oracle results? we should remove the Austrian reference because he doesn't like Austrians for example?
Don't play fair here, I am asking why was Serb academic sample removed on Serbs demand, and it contain much more people than Bosnian Serbs average?
Lukasz said it is to be removed because it's too Romanian like and Serb members called it outdated.
Bosnian_Serb average is too Croat-like and is also outdated. So why should it be treated differently from academic Serbian sample?
You have no answer. Now bugger off.
Distance to: Ford
2.35378153 Serbian_Bosnia
2.41710571 Croat_Split
3.28102748 Serbian_new
3.56249912 South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster
3.56842113 Bosnian
3.70171582 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
5.05560085 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
5.19676823 Szekely
5.59177968 Moldavian
6.07702230 Csango_Gymes
6.43909702 Slovenian
6.61040846 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
7.11572203 Croatian
7.99668353 Montenegrin
8.02414481 Romanian_Transylvania
8.65580730 Hungarian
9.68915889 Romanian_Oltenia
9.77066484 Macedonian
10.36993381 Slovak
10.59790074 Kaykavian_Croatian
10.79979629 Romanian_Muntenia
11.98604188 Bulgarian
12.58008744 Czech
13.17466508 Austrian
13.36491232 North_Macedonian
:mad:
Distance to: Dick-dad
1.73026010 South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster
1.82500839 Serbian_new
2.53712488 Bosnian
2.74965225 Serbian_Bosnia
2.87947912 Croat_Split
3.20747564 Romanian_North_Moldova_Bukovina
4.08257272 Szekely
5.05919954 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
5.95143680 Csango_Gymes
6.08949954 Montenegrin
6.27698972 Moldavian
6.32393074 Romanian_Transylvania
6.54147537 South_Croat_Slavic_Cluster
7.60582671 Romanian_Oltenia
7.63600113 Slovenian
7.76042377 Macedonian
8.41325740 Croatian
8.97916477 Hungarian
9.55080101 Romanian_Muntenia
10.07375799 Bulgarian
11.20765363 Kaykavian_Croatian
11.46777142 North_Macedonian
11.64915994 Slovak
13.50640589 Austrian
13.77415696 Czech
Target: Dick-dad
Distance: 1.7303% / 1.73026010 | ADC: 2x
100.0 South_Croat_Morlach_Cluster
:comp26::cussing
Maintenance
12-19-2019, 06:16 PM
funny how a mutt try to set its own result and family as ref points xD
Cumansky
12-19-2019, 06:17 PM
Man is comedy when I see Saxons writing Cyrillic, ultimate ethnic cleansing
Dušan
12-19-2019, 06:17 PM
No, Dušan isn't closest to it and Ford is closer to Croats than to Serbs. It will be removed, I already messaged Lucas.
He had no problem to remove academic Serb samples which contain much more people than your pathetic average.
Fuck off from South Slavic genetics orthodox Mongrel, it's none of your business.
I am very close to Bosnian Serb average on EUTest, and still closer to Serbian proper average than to Croatian average.
Deal with it! :)
https://i.imgur.com/bHZHbsf.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/hQDZ2Y2.jpg
Bosnian and Krajina Serb are genetically the same people.
It's weird to constantly see both Croatians and Serbians claim Bosnians as part of their nation, however both sides fail to understand that Bosnians are a very old, distinct Medieval entity in the Western Balkans, often caught in a feud between Kingdom of Hungary and the Byzantine Empire. They are their own nation, which only in modern times was separated into 3 different parts, because of religious divisions. But Medieval Bosnia even had their own Church, separate from both Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox ones.
"The Bosnian Church was a Christian church in medieval Bosnia that was independent of and considered heretical by both the Roman Catholic and the Eastern Orthodox hierarchies.
The East–West Schism then led to the establishment of Roman Catholicism in Croatia and most of Dalmatia, while Eastern Orthodoxy came to prevail in Serbia. Lying in-between, the mountainous Bosnia was nominally under Rome, but Catholicism never became firmly established due to a weak church organization and poor communications. Medieval Bosnia thus remained a "no-man's land between faiths" rather than a meeting ground between the two Churches, leading to a unique religious history and the emergence of an "independent and somewhat heretical church".
Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy predominated in different parts of what is today Bosnia and Herzegovina; the followers of the former formed a majority in the west, the north and in the center of Bosnia, while those of the latter were a majority in most of Zachlumia (present-day Herzegovina) and along Bosnia's eastern border. This changed in the mid-13th century, when the Bosnian Church began eclipsing the Roman. While Bosnia remained nominally Catholic in the High Middle Ages, the Bishop of Bosnia was a local cleric chosen by Bosnians and then sent to the Archbishop of Ragusa solely for ordination. Although the Papacy already insisted on using Latin as the liturgical language, Bosnian Catholics retained Church Slavonic language."
Croats don't claim Bosnians, they look down on them and discriminate BiH Croats too for being culturally Balkan.
They just know medieval Bosnia was closer to Croatia than to Serbia.
Btw, Catholics used Slavic language for liturgy in Croatia too for centuries until Vatican prohibited them. This influence came to Bosnia from Croatia, from Croatian popovi glagoljaši.
Original Bosnia was small piece of land around Sarajevo, later it spread to include territories that were historically either Croat or Serb.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/28/Medieval_Bosnian_State_Expansion-en.svg/1280px-Medieval_Bosnian_State_Expansion-en.svg.png
I am very close to Bosnian Serb average on EUTest, and still closer to Serbian proper average than to Croatian average.
Deal with it! :)
https://i.imgur.com/bHZHbsf.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/hQDZ2Y2.jpg
Bosnian and Krajina Serb are genetically the same people.
Good for you, proves you Ustaša roots like the rast of Krajina Serb mongrels.
funny how a mutt try to set its own result and family as ref points xD
Imbecile, I didn't include any of my family members in any kind of average I made. But my father is pure Croat ethnically.
Maintenance
12-19-2019, 06:24 PM
Imbecile, I didn't include any of my family members in any kind of average I made. But my father is pure Croat ethnically.
Did i say it was you?
Nice that you felt hit by my comment and instantly insult like always.
I have never implied recent admixture, don't change my words.Just pointed out the obvious, based on how different NW croats are to southern ones, as if they belong to different ethnicities.
If your dad was not 25% NW and central croat that 4th Serb would likely be first.
Lol no. His Dalmatian Croat side is probably most southern shifted. Hvar has strong Med/Romance admixture. His father probably shifted much more north, and he looked assordingly.
Vid Flumina
12-19-2019, 06:26 PM
K15 updated
Target: VFlumina
Distance: 5.0754% / 5.07535329 | ADC: 0.25x
45.6 Italy_Aostavalley
43.8 Italy_Trentino
6.2 Sardinian
4.2 Abhkasian
0.2 North_Ossetian
Target: VFlumina
Distance: 5.9273% / 5.92727044 | ADC: 0.5x
55.4 Italy_Trentino
29.4 Italy_Aostavalley
13.8 Italy_Lombardy
1.4 Abhkasian
(we're getting there)
Did i say it was you?
Nice that you felt hit by my comment and instantly insult like always.
I am not stupid Cypriot, you directed your comments to me. But I didn't use any of us in averages I made.
Dušan
12-19-2019, 06:27 PM
Good for you, proves you Ustaša roots like the rast of Krajina Serb mongrels.
Only thing what is proved is Serbian roots of so called "Southern Croats" who are catholicised Serbs.
Here are those apostates dancing Serbian national dance kolo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUYVHSmIEOM
They cannot against their Serbian ethnic nature, despite efforts of Catholic church to make Croats from them. :)
Only thing what is proved is Serbian roots of so called "Southern Croats" who are catholicised Serbs.
Here are those apostates dancing Serbian national dance kolo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUYVHSmIEOM
They cannot against their Serbian ethnic nature, despite efforts of Catholic church to make Croats from them. :)
Kolo is a Croatian dance too lol. Many Slavs have it.
Southern Croats are real Croats, and Croatia was founded in the south.
I already gave proof how disgusting orthodox religion that spreaded west with Turks, not the opposite. There are much more Croats who became Servs, than the opposite.
Maintenance
12-19-2019, 06:30 PM
I am not stupid Cypriot, you directed your comments to me. But I didn't use any of us in averages I made.
yes you are
Hungarian_master
12-19-2019, 06:30 PM
Kolo is a Croatian dance too lol. Many Slavs have it.
Southern Croats are real Croats, and Croatia was founded in the south.
I already gave proof how disgusting orthodox religion that spreaded west with Turks, not the opposite. There are much more Croats who became Servs, than the opposite.
Feiichy! Opinion for this thread?
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?310417-Classify-Rank-these-Hungarians
Lucas
12-19-2019, 06:31 PM
I will add Croat Bosnian academic (also from 4 kits for some reason) tomorrow...
But please I want to see more results using K15 now. After ph2ter addition especially Italy is interesting.
Btw, isn't it interesting borders of fantasy Great Serbia correspond with borders of Ottoman conquest in western Balkans?
Remains of Croatia under Ottoman pressure
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/hr/e/eb/Ostaci_ostataka.jpg
Borders of Great Serbia
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e3/Map_of_Greater_Serbia_%28in_Yugoslavia%29.svg/1200px-Map_of_Greater_Serbia_%28in_Yugoslavia%29.svg.png
Hahaha.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 06:34 PM
Lol no. His Dalmatian Croat side is probably most southern shifted. Hvar has strong Med/Romance admixture. His father probably shifted much more north, and he looked assordingly.
Croats have 0 percent "med"/italian genes let alone "strong" and his bosniak grandfather probably plotted like Bosniensis
yes you are
Obviously not since your intentions are extremely easy to read. Orthodox dog.
Dunai
12-19-2019, 06:35 PM
Bosnian church was never widespread among the lower classes and only briefly among the nobles.
This may be true, but I brought it up so I can show that Bosnians are as old an ethnic identity, with their own institutions, as both Croatians and Serbians, and it's dishonest to real history to claim them as nothing more but Croatians or Serbians. For example Bosnia appears a lot in Medieval Hungarian history and they were always called Bosnians.
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 06:35 PM
I will add Croat Bosnian academic (also from 4 kits for some reason) tomorrow...
But please I want to see more results using K15 now. After ph2ter addition especially Italy is interesting.
there is more of them.
there is 11 of them here:
https://evolbio.ut.ee/khazar/
you could divide them into Bosnia and Herzegovina(their names end with H or HZ in the .fam file)
could you add Romania Gorj? i posted it a few pages back
Maintenance
12-19-2019, 06:35 PM
Btw, isn't it interesting borders of fantasy Great Serbia correspond with borders of Ottoman conquest in western Balkans?
Remains of Croatia under Ottoman pressure
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/hr/e/eb/Ostaci_ostataka.jpg
Borders of Great Serbia
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e3/Map_of_Greater_Serbia_%28in_Yugoslavia%29.svg/1200px-Map_of_Greater_Serbia_%28in_Yugoslavia%29.svg.png
Hahaha.
Nice off topic just to start fights, stupid autistic bitch
I already gave proof how disgusting orthodox religion that spreaded west with Turks, not the opposite. There are much more Croats who became Servs, than the opposite.
Orthodox Christianity is the oldest Christian tradition and isn't synonymous with Serbia at all. If any historical country should be picked, it would be the Byzantine empire. Shall I remind you that the biggest Eastern Orthodox church is Russian, not Serbian. Also I doubt you have much against Romania, Bulgaria or Greece and how they believe, don't you. So that's definitely the wrong choice of words.
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 06:36 PM
Don't play fair here, I am asking why was Serb academic sample removed on Serbs demand, and it contain much more people than Bosnian Serbs average?
Lukasz said it is to be removed because it's too Romanian like and Serb members called it outdated.
Bosnian_Serb average is too Croat-like and is also outdated. So why should it be treated differently from academic Serbian sample?
You have no answer. Now bugger off.
SerbianBosnia is shifted towards us, Northeast Euro, you call it Croat-like, I can say that it is more Ukrainian-like or Moldavian-like.
You discuss and focus on eurogenes k13, but EUtest remains untouched, nothing was removed from there.
Also eurogenes k13 appears to be inferior calculator than eutest for Europeans. Grace, CelticDragon, ph2ter, me, one Belarusian posted by Leto, Dusan, Ford and many others got more accurate results on eutest. At least this is how we perceive it according to our recent known ancestry.
Croats have 0 percent "med"/italian genes let alone "strong" and his bosniak grandfather probably plotted like Bosniensis
No. His grandfather looked like Swede compared to that Vlach. Croats from Hvar have strong Med admixture, and my paternal grandmother was Gracile Med in phenotype.
Don't speak about things you have no clue about. Hvar is island where Romance population is present since antiquity.
Lucas
12-19-2019, 06:37 PM
Some more K13 averages:
Albanian,21.07,17.56,23.81,11.15,23.81,1.62,0.25,0 .07,0.15,0.13,0.17,0.00,0.00
Algerian,13.95,0.61,24.25,0.00,27.47,14.21,0.00,0. 31,0.12,0.10,0.39,8.89,9.66
Danish,48.13,28.42,11.20,4.88,3.64,0.68,1.07,0.07, 0.93,0.45,0.25,0.16,0.10
English,49.96,23.98,13.57,5.83,3.30,0.62,0.85,0.13 ,0.22,0.35,0.38,0.13,0.13
German_east,36.93,36.50,12.59,5.57,4.79,0.78,0.69, 0.09,0.30,0.78,0.55,0.15,0.20
German_West,45.37,25.20,13.22,7.02,5.78,0.85,0.30, 0.58,0.39,0.37,0.11,0.35,0.14
North-Dutch,51.14,26.48,10.78,5.58,2.75,0.38,1.17,0.02,0 .38,0.22,0.22,0.10,0.02
North-Swedish,44.53,36.23,6.25,3.95,0.66,0.40,1.26,0.39, 4.94,0.62,0.60,0.09,0.14
Scottish,52.74,22.77,12.06,6.59,1.74,0.62,1.28,0.0 4,0.43,0.97,0.40,0.07,0.04
Slovakian,29.47,38.84,11.90,5.00,8.64,2.35,1.09,0. 00,0.94,0.88,0.64,0.07,0.18
Slovene,30.66,34.00,14.71,7.03,9.92,1.18,0.72,0.32 ,0.46,0.51,0.32,0.10,0.07
South_Dutch,44.59,22.22,15.74,6.01,7.37,1.47,1.05, 0.20,0.84,0.24,0.02,0.09,0.16
Swedish,48.45,30.99,9.81,3.64,2.43,0.84,1.41,0.21, 0.68,0.56,0.40,0.32,0.23
Swiss_French,37.79,20.53,19.52,7.90,10.97,1.49,0.2 7,0.26,0.44,0.44,0.36,0.04,0.00
Swiss_German,40.15,22.01,17.27,6.58,10.31,1.90,0.0 8,0.28,0.25,0.52,0.29,0.29,0.09
Swiss_Italian,36.35,15.43,23.16,2.81,18.65,2.71,0. 26,0.00,0.41,0.00,0.18,0.08,0.00
Welsh,51.09,22.22,15.85,6.86,0.43,1.18,0.40,0.58,0 .00,0.74,0.38,0.17,0.12
EUtest:
Kaikavian_Croatian,23.50,17.22,18.47,17.04,9.49,8. 05,5.21,0.37,0.48,0.00,0.16,0.00,0.00
Added, except Slovakian and Slovenian. I think those academic which I added are ok.
Updated K15
3.34351892 Serbian_Bosnia
4.43035619 Bosnian
5.04413521 Bosniak
5.15313497 Romania_Nw
6.33881692 Romania_Ne
6.58376032 Moldavian
7.72230785 Slovenian
7.72935314 Romania_Sw
7.90444811 Croatian
8.07014554 Montenegrin
8.12596456 Serbian
8.22755128 Romania_Se
8.31912856 South_Serbian
8.51683040 Hungarian
8.73553519 Szekely
9.45547827 Macedonian
9.76327814 Romanian
9.95891058 Romania_South
10.35446883 Slovak
10.70991597 Bulgarian
10.89955504 Kaykavian_Croatian
11.57972366 Austrian
11.58190831 Czech
13.01095692 Ukrainian_Lviv
13.42447019 Gagauz
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=caofNg0UJMU
SerbianBosnia is shifted towards us, Northeast Euro, you call it Croat-like, I can say that it is more Ukrainian-like or Moldavian-like.
You discuss and focus on eurogenes k13, but EUtest remains untouched, nothing was removed from there.
Also eurogenes k13 appears to be inferior calculator than eutest for Europeans. Grace, CelticDragon, ph2ter, me, one Belarusian posted by Leto, Dusan, Ford and many others got more accurate results on eutest. At least this is how we perceive it according to our recent known ancestry.
Croats are more Slavic than Serbs and are closer to Ukrainians. What is not clear to you?
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 06:40 PM
No. His grandfather looked like Swede compared to that Vlach. Croats from Hvar have strong Med admixture, and my paternal grandmother was Gracile Med in phenotype.
Don't speak about things you have no clue about. Hvar is island where Romance population is present since antiquity.
Richmondbread is more native american than you are italian.
Lemgrant
12-19-2019, 06:40 PM
Croats are more Slavic than and are closer to Ukrainians. What is not clear to you?
you don't like Serbs, so I call it more Ukrainian-like, so you can feel better. What is not clear to you?
Richmondbread is more native american than you are italian.
Retard, Dalmatian Romance populaton had nothing to do with Italians. They were Latinised Illyrians and Venetian/Italian contribution was small, only among urban families.
I am very happy not to have anything with Italians either, they are as dear to me as Serbs just not that primitive.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 06:42 PM
Only thing what is proved is Serbian roots of so called "Southern Croats" who are catholicised Serbs.
They cannot against their Serbian ethnic nature, despite efforts of Catholic church to make Croats from them. :)
Its hilarious when Feiichy tries to claim croats being more northern because of more 'slavic' blood, when they're just a mix of slovenians/nw croatian nucleus admixed with bosnians(serbs) to different degrees.The more south you go the more bosnian(serb) like they are, the more northern the more slovenian "slavic" are.And of course, with the occasional austro-hungarian mixture.
Ljubic
12-19-2019, 06:42 PM
EUtest 1+:
Distance to: Ljubic-dad
4.83160170 SerbianBosnia
6.08118410 Moldavian_1
6.12992659 Hungarian
6.48952918 Croatian
7.70608201 Slovenian_1
9.15808386 Kaikavian_Croatian
9.21824278 Serbian
10.48804856 Czech
10.83733362 Romanian
11.10087384 Austrian
11.29054915 Bulgarian_1
11.80774322 Slovakian_1
15.16785087 Ukrainian
15.44757262 Polish
16.28353463 UA_Sumy
17.34761943 Ukrainian-Russian
17.45858242 Albanian_1
17.92354597 West_Russian
18.91375161 Kosovar_1
19.57517050 West_&_Central_German
20.01225874 Belorussian
21.33751391 Dutch
21.35500176 North_Italian
22.15679354 French
22.50160661 North_Swedish
I will add Croat Bosnian academic (also from 4 kits for some reason) tomorrow...
But please I want to see more results using K15 now. After ph2ter addition especially Italy is interesting.
Distance to: Dick-dad
5.78018420 Bosnian
6.21286719 Serbian_Bosnia
7.06656918 Bosniak
7.34521613 Moldavian
7.72449998 Romania_Nw
7.94914461 Romania_Ne
8.21312364 Romania_Sw
8.90979798 Hungarian
9.15296785 Montenegrin
9.33814221 Romania_Se
9.42937146 Slovenian
9.65026425 Croatian
9.65223161 Szekely
9.80885314 South_Serbian
9.86672185 Serbian
10.16224385 Romania_South
10.52230488 Romanian
10.73041462 Macedonian
10.75715012 Slovak
11.41477989 Bulgarian
12.14964197 Kaykavian_Croatian
12.65286924 Czech
12.76955363 Ukrainian_Lviv
13.51392245 Austrian
13.59559855 Gagauz
Dušan
12-19-2019, 06:42 PM
Good for you, proves you Ustaša roots like the rast of Krajina Serb mongrels.
I am shifted toward Moldova, not toward Croatia, you autistic woman.
https://i.imgur.com/bHZHbsf.jpg
Its hilarious when Feiichy tries to claim croats being more northern because of more 'slavic' blood, when they're just a mix of slovenians/nw croatian nucleus admixed with bosnians(serbs) to different degrees.The more south you go the more bosnian(serb) like they are, the more northern the more slovenian "slavic" are.And of course, with the occasional austro-hungarian mixture.
Why do Serbs look like Greeks?
CommonSense
12-19-2019, 06:43 PM
https://i.imgur.com/xthYP9u.png
I am shifted toward Moldova, not toward Croatia, you autistic woman.
https://i.imgur.com/bHZHbsf.jpg
Proper Southern Croats are closest to Moldovans from Basserabia. Morlacks closest to Serbs.
Nothing western about them.
Its hilarious when Feiichy tries to claim croats being more northern because of more 'slavic' blood, when they're just a mix of slovenians/nw croatian nucleus admixed with bosnians(serbs) to different degrees.The more south you go the more bosnian(serb) like they are, the more northern the more slovenian "slavic" are.And of course, with the occasional austro-hungarian mixture.
Nucleus is around Adriatic coast, not in Panonnia. They are far less Croats than those in the south.
Pribislav
12-19-2019, 06:47 PM
Proper Southern Croats are closest to Moldovans from Basserabia. Morlacks closest to Serbs.
Nothing western about them.
Which Morlachs? You mean Bunjevci?
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 06:48 PM
Retard, Dalmatian Romance populaton had nothing to do with Italians. They were Latinised Illyrians and Venetian/Italian contribution was small, only among urban families.
I am very happy not to have anything with Italians either, they are as dear to me as Serbs just not that primitive.
There is no proof that the romance speakers of the coast had illyrian origin.The last romance speakers of the coast were eastern romans, illyrians were gone from there for millenias.They analyzed a nobleman from Dalmatia/Zadar and he ended up cypriot autosomally,next time you insult Maintenance think of the fact that he probably has relatives that owned slavs like you.You and pretty much all croats dont even have a drop of native dalmatian dna, all your little paleo-balkan dna is from mainland dinaric regions, the romans eliminated the illyrians then you got myriad of invaders who settled on the coast from germanic tribes to the last possesors, the Byzantines,and even later Death plague killed 50-70% of the people.That you are foreign to Dalmatia is not even your biggest problem,the cognitive disonance is your biggest problem, you'd rather invent lie cause the reality is too brutal for you, its the opposite of what you want.
Which Morlachs? You mean Bunjevci?
I made ''Morlach'' average of southern shifted Dalmatian and BiH Croats (like Ljubic dad), they are closest to Serbs.
Others with high Baltic are in south Croat Slavic cluster which is closest to Moldovans from Basserabia.
There are two distinct clusters of south Croats and Mingle was first to notice it.
Pribislav
12-19-2019, 06:50 PM
Only thing what is proved is Serbian roots of so called "Southern Croats" who are catholicised Serbs.
Here are those apostates dancing Serbian national dance kolo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUYVHSmIEOM
They cannot against their Serbian ethnic nature, despite efforts of Catholic church to make Croats from them. :)
Croatian Franciskan monks play Serbian "Užičko kolo."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rnlc9nFyRs
There is no proof that the romance speakers of the coast had illyrian origin.The last romance speakers of the coast were eastern romans, illyrians were gone from there for millenias.They analyzed a nobleman from Dalmatia/Zadar and he ended up cypriot autosomally,next time you insult Maintenance think of the fact that he probably has relatives that owned slavs like you.You and pretty much all croats dont even have a drop of native dalmatian dna, all your little paleo-balkan dna is from mainland dinaric regions, the romans eliminated the illyrians then you got myriad of invaders who settled on the coast from germanic tribes to the last possesors, the Byzantines,and even later Death plague killed 50-70% of the people.That you are foreign to Dalmatia is not even your biggest problem,the cognitive disonance is your biggest problem, you'd rather invent lie cause the reality is too brutal for you, its the opposite of what you want.
That Cypriot nobleman was immigrant. I know who you talk about. He probably came from East Med region.
Dušan
12-19-2019, 06:51 PM
Nucleus is around Adriatic coast, not in Panonnia. They are far less Croats than those in the south.
So you, Hrvoje and ph2ter are fake Croats, and catholicised Serbs are real ones? :)
Croatian Franciskan monks play Serbian "Užičko kolo."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rnlc9nFyRs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iG3jzTEWeIQ
Maintenance
12-19-2019, 06:52 PM
That Cypriot nobleman was immigrant. I know who you talk about. He probably came from East Med region.
now sit down and dont speak until spoken to, slave.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 06:52 PM
Proper Southern Croats are closest to Moldovans from Basserabia.
Nothing western about them.
Only if they're bosnian genetically (hence preserve the original south slavic blood without admixing with austro-hungarians/slovenians), those that get slovenia/hungary/croatia in first place on genetics calculators(high North Sea to baltic ratio), like you and your family are foreign to Moldova genetics.
now sit down and dont speak until spoken to, slave.
Dude, he integrated in Slavic society.
Maintenance
12-19-2019, 06:54 PM
Dude, he integrated in Slavic society.
Sure, you knew him personally?
peasant.
Only if they're bosnian genetically (hence preserve the original south slavic blood without admixing with austro-hungarians/slovenians), those that get slovenia/hungary/croatia in first place on genetics calculators(high North Sea to baltic ratio), like you and your family are foreign to Moldova genetics.
Lol, it's rather some Bosnian muslims are Croat like genetically. There was no Bosnian Slavic tribe.
I don't speak about me, I speak about my southern Croat average that is closest to Basserabians.
People from this first average are purest Croats around, not Kaykavian Croats or whatever.
https://i.imgur.com/sRy5oCt.png
https://i.imgur.com/OmHlSqc.png
Btw, there are no Serbs genetically similar to this average. Only southern Croats and some Bosnian muslims.
Dušan
12-19-2019, 06:56 PM
Proper Southern Croats are closest to Moldovans from Basserabia. Morlacks closest to Serbs.
Nothing western about them.
More eastern-Moldovan shifted = more possibility their paleo-Balkan ancestors were Thracians (not local North Italian-like Ilyrians), that came from central and eastern Balkans.
Just like mine. :)
More eastern-Moldovan shifted = more possibility their paleo-Balkan ancestors were Thracians (not local North Italian-like Ilyrians), that came from central and eastern Balkans.
Just like mine. :)
What do you get now on K13?
Dušan
12-19-2019, 06:59 PM
What do you get now on K13?
Moldavia, Ukraine, Bulgaria and Greek Thessaly.
Orthodox brotherhood.
# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 93.4% Moldavian + 6.6% Sardinian @ 3.52
2 60.5% Ukrainian + 39.5% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.89
3 67.8% Ukrainian + 32.2% Central_Greek @ 4.09
4 54.2% Bulgarian + 45.8% Ukrainian @ 4.12
5 94.6% Moldavian + 5.4% Algerian_Jewish @ 4.15
6 72.2% Ukrainian_Belgorod + 27.8% Sardinian @ 4.16
7 90.5% Moldavian + 9.5% Greek_Thessaly @ 4.16
8 71.1% Ukrainian + 28.9% South_Italian @ 4.17
9 84.3% Moldavian + 15.7% Bulgarian @ 4.19
10 93.9% Moldavian + 6.1% Ashkenazi @ 4.23
11 68.8% Ukrainian + 31.2% East_Sicilian @ 4.23
12 62.8% Ukrainian_Lviv + 37.2% Greek_Thessaly @ 4.24
13 95.1% Moldavian + 4.9% Italian_Jewish @ 4.24
14 93.7% Moldavian + 6.3% Central_Greek @ 4.27
15 93.9% Moldavian + 6.1% East_Sicilian @ 4.27
16 94.6% Moldavian + 5.4% South_Italian @ 4.27
17 94% Moldavian + 6% West_Sicilian @ 4.28
18 95.9% Moldavian + 4.1% Cyprian @ 4.29
19 95.9% Moldavian + 4.1% Tunisian @ 4.29
20 96% Moldavian + 4% Moroccan @ 4.3
Moldavia, Ukraine, Bulgaria and Greek Thessaly.
Orthodox brotherhood.
# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 93.4% Moldavian + 6.6% Sardinian @ 3.52
2 60.5% Ukrainian + 39.5% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.89
3 67.8% Ukrainian + 32.2% Central_Greek @ 4.09
4 54.2% Bulgarian + 45.8% Ukrainian @ 4.12
5 94.6% Moldavian + 5.4% Algerian_Jewish @ 4.15
6 72.2% Ukrainian_Belgorod + 27.8% Sardinian @ 4.16
7 90.5% Moldavian + 9.5% Greek_Thessaly @ 4.16
8 71.1% Ukrainian + 28.9% South_Italian @ 4.17
9 84.3% Moldavian + 15.7% Bulgarian @ 4.19
10 93.9% Moldavian + 6.1% Ashkenazi @ 4.23
11 68.8% Ukrainian + 31.2% East_Sicilian @ 4.23
12 62.8% Ukrainian_Lviv + 37.2% Greek_Thessaly @ 4.24
13 95.1% Moldavian + 4.9% Italian_Jewish @ 4.24
14 93.7% Moldavian + 6.3% Central_Greek @ 4.27
15 93.9% Moldavian + 6.1% East_Sicilian @ 4.27
16 94.6% Moldavian + 5.4% South_Italian @ 4.27
17 94% Moldavian + 6% West_Sicilian @ 4.28
18 95.9% Moldavian + 4.1% Cyprian @ 4.29
19 95.9% Moldavian + 4.1% Tunisian @ 4.29
20 96% Moldavian + 4% Moroccan @ 4.3
I mean this updated K13 single distances. I doubt any Serbs will get South Croat Slavic cluster in first place.
Dušan
12-19-2019, 07:06 PM
Btw, there are no Serbs genetically similar to this average. Only southern Croats and some Bosnian muslims.
I got those catholicised Serbs very high, but Croatian proper average deep down. Not to mention kaykavian Croats who are differnt world.
https://i.imgur.com/MeFGH4b.jpg
This is how gedmatch results of proper Southern Croat look like. I used him as one for Slavic cluster averages. Hrvoje posted him long ago.
Person in question is native of coastal Dalmatia near Split in last 700 years. You won't find purer Croat than that.
1 Baltic 34.39
2 North_Atlantic 26.92
3 West_Med 14.89
4 East_Med 12.56
5 West_Asian 5.67
6 Siberian 1.91
7 South_Asian 1.28
8 Red_Sea 1.22
9 Oceanian 0.51
10 Amerindian 0.47
11 Sub-Saharan 0.11
12 East_Asian 0.07
Single Population Sharing:
1 Croatian 4.06
2 Moldavian 4.68
3 Hungarian 6.31
4 Serbian 7.81
5 Ukrainian_Lviv 9.58
6 South_Polish 10.01
7 Ukrainian 10.49
8 Austrian 10.74
9 East_German 10.81
10 Romanian 11.55
11 Polish 13.5
12 Bulgarian 13.63
13 Southwest_Russian 14.01
14 Ukrainian_Belgorod 14.73
15 Russian_Smolensk 15.64
16 Estonian_Polish 15.85
17 Belorussian 16.42
18 Kargopol_Russian 17.85
19 West_German 18.05
20 Southwest_Finnish 18.17
Mixed Mode Population Sharing:
1 61.9% Estonian_Polish + 38.1% Tuscan @ 1.73
2 62.8% Southwest_Russian + 37.2% North_Italian @ 1.99
3 52.3% Estonian + 47.7% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.05
4 71.3% Ukrainian + 28.7% Tuscan @ 2.17
5 64.8% Southwest_Russian + 35.2% Tuscan @ 2.19
6 54.9% Lithuanian + 45.1% Tuscan @ 2.2
7 74.1% Ukrainian + 25.9% West_Sicilian @ 2.21
8 61.1% Belorussian + 38.9% Tuscan @ 2.43
9 65.2% Estonian_Polish + 34.8% West_Sicilian @ 2.45
10 79.7% South_Polish + 20.3% Algerian_Jewish @ 2.53
11 59.5% Estonian + 40.5% West_Sicilian @ 2.53
12 62.3% Russian_Smolensk + 37.7% Tuscan @ 2.54
13 78.9% Ukrainian + 21.1% Italian_Jewish @ 2.56
14 68% Serbian + 32% Estonian_Polish @ 2.59
15 62.6% Estonian + 37.4% South_Italian @ 2.64
16 58% Serbian + 42% Ukrainian @ 2.68
17 69.4% South_Polish + 30.6% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.7
18 59.9% Bulgarian + 40.1% Estonian @ 2.74
19 79.8% South_Polish + 20.2% Italian_Jewish @ 2.74
20 58.4% Lithuanian + 41.6% West_Sicilian @ 2.77
Moje ime
12-19-2019, 07:10 PM
https://i.imgur.com/Gj7s2YE.png
https://i.imgur.com/fozfXt2.png
update
I got those catholicised Serbs very high, but Croatian proper average deep down. Not to mention kaykavian Croats who are differnt world.
https://i.imgur.com/MeFGH4b.jpg
Lol retard, these people are 34-37 Baltic on average, Serbs can only dream about such results.
And this average gets Croats in first place hahaha dummie Vlach who has bit of Ustaša admix.
Morlachs are unfotunately admixed with Valchs so they are close to Serbs, because you are Vlachs yourself.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 07:14 PM
Lol, it's rather some Bosnian muslims are Croat like genetically. There was no Bosnian Slavic tribe.
I don't speak about me, I speak about my southern Croat average that is closest to Basserabians.
People from this first average are purest Croats around, not Kaykavian Croats or whatever.
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?310328-Croat-23andme&p=6402195&highlight=pure#post6402195
Holy cow, check these results! Pure Dalmatian Islander from Olib island near Zadar, all 4 grandparents born there. He has highest East Euro among all Croats I posted, higher than any northern Croat!
Native Dalmatian haplogroup though!
They must be very pure Croats.
"Pure croat" with slovenian/NW croat like genetics.
By your logic 90% of croats have nothing to do with original south slavs and yet you are denying that Croatia is a fake country, but then again you are getting caught on a daily(if not hourly) basis changing your opinion to fit your narrative.
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?310328-Croat-23andme&p=6402195&highlight=pure#post6402195
"Pure croat" with slovenian/NW croat like genetics.
By your logic 90% of croats have nothing to do with original south slavs and yet you are denying that Croatia is a fake country.
Lol no, that person would be nothing like Slovenians. Dalmatians proper are Slavic as fuck, which makes Serbs seem like Slavic larpers.
Dušan
12-19-2019, 07:16 PM
Lol retard, these people are 34-37 Baltic on average, Serbs can only dream about such results.
And this average gets Croats in first place hahaha dummie Vlach who has bit of Ustaša admix.
Morlachs are unfotunately admixed with Valchs so they are close to Serbs, because you are Vlachs yourself.
Those people are eastern shifted and their origin is eastern. They came to todays Croatia with Turks, and than get catholicised.
If they are real Craots, than you, Hrvoje, ph2ter are fake ones. :D
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 07:26 PM
Lol no, that person would be nothing like Slovenians. Dalmatians proper are Slavic as fuck, which makes Serbs seem like Slavic larpers.
Nop, completely typical nw croat genetics, 60% EE, 30% balkan and some residual NW euro, you've said it yourself indirectly that he's an outlier, but of course if he puts that is grandparents were dalmatians on 23andme due to your nordicist complex you will say he is pure croat, but in the normal context northern croatians(who have identical 23andme) are 'far from pure croats'
This is how gedmatch results of proper Southern Croat look like. I used him as one for Slavic cluster averages. Hrvoje posted him long ago.
Person in question is native of coastal Dalmatia near Split in last 700 years. You won't find purer Croat than that.
1 Baltic 34.39
2 North_Atlantic 26.92
3 West_Med 14.89
4 East_Med 12.56
5 West_Asian 5.67
6 Siberian 1.91
7 South_Asian 1.28
8 Red_Sea 1.22
9 Oceanian 0.51
10 Amerindian 0.47
11 Sub-Saharan 0.11
12 East_Asian 0.07
Single Population Sharing:
1 Croatian 4.06
2 Moldavian 4.68
3 Hungarian 6.31
4 Serbian 7.81
5 Ukrainian_Lviv 9.58
6 South_Polish 10.01
7 Ukrainian 10.49
8 Austrian 10.74
9 East_German 10.81
10 Romanian 11.55
11 Polish 13.5
12 Bulgarian 13.63
13 Southwest_Russian 14.01
14 Ukrainian_Belgorod 14.73
15 Russian_Smolensk 15.64
16 Estonian_Polish 15.85
17 Belorussian 16.42
18 Kargopol_Russian 17.85
19 West_German 18.05
20 Southwest_Finnish 18.17
Mixed Mode Population Sharing:
1 61.9% Estonian_Polish + 38.1% Tuscan @ 1.73
2 62.8% Southwest_Russian + 37.2% North_Italian @ 1.99
3 52.3% Estonian + 47.7% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.05
4 71.3% Ukrainian + 28.7% Tuscan @ 2.17
5 64.8% Southwest_Russian + 35.2% Tuscan @ 2.19
6 54.9% Lithuanian + 45.1% Tuscan @ 2.2
7 74.1% Ukrainian + 25.9% West_Sicilian @ 2.21
8 61.1% Belorussian + 38.9% Tuscan @ 2.43
9 65.2% Estonian_Polish + 34.8% West_Sicilian @ 2.45
10 79.7% South_Polish + 20.3% Algerian_Jewish @ 2.53
11 59.5% Estonian + 40.5% West_Sicilian @ 2.53
12 62.3% Russian_Smolensk + 37.7% Tuscan @ 2.54
13 78.9% Ukrainian + 21.1% Italian_Jewish @ 2.56
14 68% Serbian + 32% Estonian_Polish @ 2.59
15 62.6% Estonian + 37.4% South_Italian @ 2.64
16 58% Serbian + 42% Ukrainian @ 2.68
17 69.4% South_Polish + 30.6% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.7
18 59.9% Bulgarian + 40.1% Estonian @ 2.74
19 79.8% South_Polish + 20.2% Italian_Jewish @ 2.74
20 58.4% Lithuanian + 41.6% West_Sicilian @ 2.77
Typical bosnian genetics, procentually bosnians have a lot more of these than croats.
Moje ime
12-19-2019, 07:26 PM
Szekely is probably similar to western plotting Serbs (Balkan+Slavic+Germanic/Celtic) so it gives artificial closeness in my case. Should be removed.
Nop, completely typical nw croat genetics, 60% EE, 30% balkan and some residual NW euro, you've said it yourself indirectly that he's an outlier, but of course if he puts that is grandparents were dalmatians on 23andme due to your nordicist complex you will say he is pure croat, but in the normal context northern croatians(who have identical 23andme) are 'far from pure croats'
He is a pure Croat retard and you are free to prove otherwise. Dalmatians from Olib have nothing to do with NW Croats, they are Čakavians and Čakavians are most Slavic shifted Croatian dialectical group.
He would surely shift towards Ukraine and not towards Slovenia.
Carpatz
12-19-2019, 07:28 PM
Updated k13 and k15
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/445888351053283329/657317766583287808/unknown.png
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/445888351053283329/657317830248759297/unknown.png
Nurzat
12-19-2019, 07:28 PM
K15 updated
I've got extra Atlantic facade and Caucasian in addition to the expected East Slav and Balkan:
42% Southwest_Russian + Ukraine_East + Latvian + Ukrainian_Belgorod
39% Romania_Nw + South_Serbian + Bulgarian_Thracian + Greek + Italy_Trentino
10.4% French_Basque + Sardinian
8.2% Tabassaran + Georgian_Laz + Turkish_Trabzon
0.4% Dai
detailed:
Target: Nurzat
Distance: 0.9999% / 0.99988570
32.8 Bosniak
25.2 Southwest_Russian
17.2 Romania_Nw
6.0 Tabassaran
5.0 Sardinian
4.6 French_Basque
2.4 Latvian
2.2 Ukraine_East
1.6 Erzya
1.6 Greek
1.0 Azeri_Dagestan
0.4 Dai
but since Bosniak doesn't make much sense for my ancestry, here's the result when I remove only Bosniak & Bosnian from source:
Target: Nurzat
Distance: 1.0727% / 1.07272384
25.2 Southwest_Russian
23.6 Romania_Nw
8.0 South_Serbian
7.8 Ukraine_East
6.8 Latvian
6.0 Tabassaran
5.4 French_Basque
5.0 Sardinian
3.6 Bulgarian_Thracian
2.6 Italy_Trentino
2.2 Ukrainian_Belgorod
1.6 Georgian_Laz
1.2 Greek
0.6 Turkish_Trabzon
0.4 Dai
while K13 updated not removing anything from source:
Target: Nurzat
Distance: 0.3471% / 0.34713963
50.6 Ukrainian
21.2 Romanian_Muntenia
7.2 Romanian_Transylvania
6.0 Lezgin
5.8 Sardinian
3.4 French_Basque
2.6 Abhkasian
0.8 Southeast_English
0.6 Balkar
0.6 Kalash
0.4 NAN_Melanesian
0.2 Malay
0.2 Pima
0.2 South_Polish
0.2 Tabassaran
Typical bosnian genetics, procentually bosnians have a lot more of these than croats.
He has nothing to with Bosnia, and not many Bosniaks are like that. I posted many who are too Balkan shifted. Only Vlatko Vuković has this South Croat like genetics.
Morlak
12-19-2019, 07:30 PM
did you get Serbian 1st before? we should add a more southern Serbian average again
This is first time I tried this so idk.
Those people are eastern shifted and their origin is eastern. They came to todays Croatia with Turks, and than get catholicised.
If they are real Craots, than you, Hrvoje, ph2ter are fake ones. :D
Haha, no, because you are much less Slavic. Serbs are nowhere close to 36% Baltic which is average for this cluster. Don't fatasize.
If these people are Serbs, than less than 5% of actual Serbs are Serbs.
Morlachs are close to your kind, not this ones.
Kökény
12-19-2019, 07:31 PM
https://i.imgur.com/Gj7s2YE.png
https://i.imgur.com/fozfXt2.png
update
How come that a serb get szekely as first place? And I usually get serbs as first. Is it because of our high Balkan?
Pribislav
12-19-2019, 07:32 PM
I made ''Morlach'' average of southern shifted Dalmatian and BiH Croats (like Ljubic dad), they are closest to Serbs.
Others with high Baltic are in south Croat Slavic cluster which is closest to Moldovans from Basserabia.
There are two distinct clusters of south Croats and Mingle was first to notice it.
Morlachs never existed as ethnic group. "Morlach" was mocking term for Serbs and Croatians from East Adriatic coast used by Venetians.
Serbs, do you agree with Dušan this almost 36% Baltic South Croat average is typical for Serbs? What does it make rest of poor Serbs? Šiptars?
Poor Dušan.
Morlachs never existed as ethnic group. "Morlach" was mocking term for Serbs and Croatians from East Adriatic coast used by Venetians.
I was chosing between that and Vlach. These southern Croats are Vlach admixed. Other cluster represent pre-Ottoman Southern Croats.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 07:35 PM
He is a pure Croat retard and you are free to prove otherwise. Dalmatians from Olib have nothing to do with NW Croats, they are Čakavians and Čakavians are most Slavic shifted Croatian dialectical group.
He would surely shift towards Ukraine and not towards Slovenia.
Get real, he has identical to average northern croats results and 23andme uses population references to assign percentages, probably some recent immigrant to the islands.
He has nothing to with Bosnia, and not many Bosniaks are like that. I posted many who are too Balkan shifted. Only Vlatko Vuković has this South Croat like genetics.
Percentage wise like what ,5% of croats score like that?Among bosnians its far easier to find, especially bosniaks(who didnt mix neither with orthodoxes nor your catholic kind).And we're supposed to believe those are the pure croats?
Daos777
12-19-2019, 07:36 PM
Target: Daos
Distance: 0.6167% / 0.61670647
42.8Southwest_Russian
22.4Latvian
17.6Albanian
11.6Romanian_Muntenia
1.8Lebanese_Druze
1.4Karitiana
1.2Kol
1.0Chamar
0.2Pima
K13 updated
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalkhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191219/86e2b6ba5be17bc33d1180bd3f60c1ec.jpg
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 07:37 PM
Szekely is probably similar to western plotting Serbs (Balkan+Slavic+Germanic/Celtic) so it gives artificial closeness in my case.
exactly.
Should be removed.
i don't agree. all Europeans are made of the same components and these coincidences will always happen, mo matter what you put or remove from the sheet.
the same goes for the Bosnian Serb average.
Get real, he has identical to average northern croats results and 23andme uses population references to assign percentages, probably some recent immigrant to the islands.
Percentage wise like what ,5% of croats score like that?Among bosnians its far easier to find, especially bosniaks(who didnt mix neither with orthodoxes nor your catholic kind).And we're supposed to believe those are the pure croats?
No. Most pure islanders score above 40% Eastern European. NW Croats never moved there, only the opposite. Deal with it.
Bosniaks are either Croats or Serbs, and majority of Bosnian Muslims are ex Catholics.
But among them there are both Serb/Vlach shifted ones and Croat/Slav shifted ones.
Yes, many Croatian nationalists considered certain Bosnian muslims some of purest Croats unmixed with both westerners and easterners.
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 07:38 PM
These southern Croats are Vlach admixed.
and that specifical group of Vlachs who they mixed with were the Bunjevci.
Pribislav
12-19-2019, 07:39 PM
I was chosing between that and Vlach. These southern Croats are Vlach admixed. Other cluster represent pre-Ottoman Southern Croats.
You could took Bunjevac. Catholics from Dalmatian hinterland are purer Bunjevci than those from Bačka who are German, Slovak and Hungarian influenced.
and that specifical group of Vlachs who they mixed with were the Bunjevci.
How do you comment Dušan claim Slavic South Croat average with almost 36% Baltic are Catholicised Serbs? Does he needs medication?
Don't dodge my question, answer to it.
What are 99% of Serbs than, šiptari?
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 07:40 PM
This is first time I tried this so idk.
i mean in the k13 oracle on gedmatch?
Moje ime
12-19-2019, 07:41 PM
exactly.
i don't agree. all Europeans are made of the same components and these coincidences will always happen, mo matter what you put or remove from the sheet.
the same goes for the Bosnian Serb average.
But it never happened with other calculators where I always get Serbian component as first.
Dušan
12-19-2019, 07:41 PM
Serbs, do you agree with Dušan this almost 36% Baltic South Croat average is typical for Serbs? What does it make rest of poor Serbs? Šiptars?
Poor Dušan.
I got 33.8% Baltic.
And guess what, I would rather be Ottoman Turk or Šiptar than Croat=shit of mankind.
I got 33.8% Baltic.
And guess what, I would rather be Ottoman Turk or Šiptar than Croat=shit of mankind.
Average Serbs have low Baltic, deal with it.
Mlukasz is it possible to remove the Chamar sample. I don’t like that word.Thank you
You could took Bunjevac. Catholics from Dalmatian hinterland are purer Bunjevci than those from Bačka who are German, Slovak and Hungarian influenced.
I can't because these samples include both coastal and hinterland Dalmatians, and BiH Croats.
Coastal Elite
12-19-2019, 07:43 PM
K15 updated
I've got extra Atlantic facade and Caucasian in addition to the expected East Slav and Balkan:
42% Southwest_Russian + Ukraine_East + Latvian + Ukrainian_Belgorod
39% Romania_Nw + South_Serbian + Bulgarian_Thracian + Greek + Italy_Trentino
10.4% French_Basque + Sardinian
8.2% Tabassaran + Georgian_Laz + Turkish_Trabzon
0.4% Dai
detailed:
Target: Nurzat
Distance: 0.9999% / 0.99988570
32.8 Bosniak
25.2 Southwest_Russian
17.2 Romania_Nw
6.0 Tabassaran
5.0 Sardinian
4.6 French_Basque
2.4 Latvian
2.2 Ukraine_East
1.6 Erzya
1.6 Greek
1.0 Azeri_Dagestan
0.4 Dai
but since Bosniak doesn't make much sense for my ancestry, here's the result when I remove only Bosniak & Bosnian from source:
Target: Nurzat
Distance: 1.0727% / 1.07272384
25.2 Southwest_Russian
23.6 Romania_Nw
8.0 South_Serbian
7.8 Ukraine_East
6.8 Latvian
6.0 Tabassaran
5.4 French_Basque
5.0 Sardinian
3.6 Bulgarian_Thracian
2.6 Italy_Trentino
2.2 Ukrainian_Belgorod
1.6 Georgian_Laz
1.2 Greek
0.6 Turkish_Trabzon
0.4 Dai
while K13 updated not removing anything from source:
Target: Nurzat
Distance: 0.3471% / 0.34713963
50.6 Ukrainian
21.2 Romanian_Muntenia
7.2 Romanian_Transylvania
6.0 Lezgin
5.8 Sardinian
3.4 French_Basque
2.6 Abhkasian
0.8 Southeast_English
0.6 Balkar
0.6 Kalash
0.4 NAN_Melanesian
0.2 Malay
0.2 Pima
0.2 South_Polish
0.2 Tabassaran
Lol...just as I thought, a Slav pretending to be Romanian.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 07:43 PM
No. Most pure islanders score above 40% Eastern European. NW Croats never moved there, only the opposite. Deal with it.
Nop, here are results posted by you.
ALL of them have some residual NW euro akin to slovenians and nw croats, its clear as day they are mixed and they average 25-35% EE with very few even below 10%, i see one with 40% EE but also 2.5% NW euro tho.
Let me refresh your memory
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?310328-Croat-23andme&p=6402126&viewfull=1#post6402126
For Morlach cluster I used following Croats:
Zadar and Vrlika (posted by Mingle)
Herzegovina Croat posted by Insuperable
Ljubic father
and one more I can't remember, but he was certified pure southern Croat.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 07:46 PM
Serbs, do you agree with Dušan this almost 36% Baltic South Croat average is typical for Serbs? What does it make rest of poor Serbs? Šiptars?
Poor Dušan.
Its not a matter of you either get 36% baltic or you're vlah, everyone is admixed with their neighbours.
From what we've seen, the poreklo PCA, serbs(from everywere, not just Serbia) are closer to bosnians than croats.
Nop, here are results posted by you.
ALL of them have some residual NW euro akin to slovenians and nw croats, its clear as day they are mixed and they average 25-35% EE with very few even below 10%, i see one with 40% EE but also 2.5% NW euro tho.
Let me refresh your memory
https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?310328-Croat-23andme&p=6402126&viewfull=1#post6402126
LOL
Croat from Olib scores 0.6% NW Euro.
LMAO
Slovenians/NW Croats score 10-25% usually.
I posted Croats from all over Croatia.
No, Dalmatian Islanders don't have anything to do with them and absolutely never mixed. But Čakavians are genetically not like Vlach-infected Štokavians. That's the secret.
They are what medieval Croats were before Vlachs from Bosnia came. And that's why our medieval language was what they speak.
Stop embarassing yourself.
WeirdLookingFellow
12-19-2019, 07:49 PM
Lmao at my Gf's 0.5x one.
Target: FellowGF
Distance: 1.6512% / 1.65123802 | ADC: 0.5x
43.0 Romanian_Muntenia
29.0 Romanian_Transylvania
22.4 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
5.6 Serbian_new
Target: Fellow
Distance: 3.2128% / 3.21281893 | ADC: 0.5x
48.6 Romanian_Muntenia
19.2 Montenegrin
15.6 Swiss_Italian
14.4 Hungarian
2.2 Serbian_new
Target: FellowGF
Distance: 1.4295% / 1.42945947 | ADC: 0.25x
48.8 Romanian_Muntenia
24.6 Romanian_Transylvania
12.4 Serbian_new
6.8 Macedonian
5.4 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
1.8 Erzya
0.2 Pima
Target: Fellow
Distance: 2.5725% / 2.57250759 | ADC: 0.25x
57.6 Romanian_Muntenia
23.0 Hungarian
19.0 Swiss_Italian
0.4 Karitiana
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 07:50 PM
How do you comment Dušan claim Slavic South Croat average with almost 36% Baltic are Catholicised Serbs? Does he needs medication?
Don't dodge my question, answer to it.
What are 99% of Serbs than, šiptari?
i think i was the first to propose that they are descendants of Medieval Croats, and the ones with 28% Baltic are Bunjevac newcomers in a chat with Mingle. Mingle can correct me if i'm wrong. and i still think that. i won't comment on the rest.
Btw, Goths lived in Dalmatia and our samples have high I1 (16%). Slovenians my ass. They have no R1b at all.
What a unbelivable fantasy of NW Croats settling to Dalmatian island villages.
You are jelaous because they are pure Croats and that destroys your Četnik wet dreams.
Lmao at my Gf's 0.5x one.
Target: FellowGF
Distance: 1.6512% / 1.65123802 | ADC: 0.5x
43.0 Romanian_Muntenia
29.0 Romanian_Transylvania
22.4 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
5.6 Serbian_new
Target: Fellow
Distance: 3.2128% / 3.21281893 | ADC: 0.5x
48.6 Romanian_Muntenia
19.2 Montenegrin
15.6 Swiss_Italian
14.4 Hungarian
2.2 Serbian_new
Target: FellowGF
Distance: 1.4295% / 1.42945947 | ADC: 0.25x
48.8 Romanian_Muntenia
24.6 Romanian_Transylvania
12.4 Serbian_new
6.8 Macedonian
5.4 Romanian_South_Central_Moldova
1.8 Erzya
0.2 Pima
Target: Fellow
Distance: 2.5725% / 2.57250759 | ADC: 0.25x
57.6 Romanian_Muntenia
23.0 Hungarian
19.0 Swiss_Italian
0.4 Karitianawhat are we supposed to be lmao-ing at?
Daos777
12-19-2019, 07:53 PM
Feichy scores high Neolithic farmer compared to me so her opinion is obviously not to be taken seriously unless talking about how to grow tomatoes.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
i think i was the first to propose that they are descendants of Medieval Croats, and the ones with 28% Baltic are Bunjevac newcomers in a chat with Mingle. Mingle can correct me if i'm wrong. and i still think that. i won't comment on the rest.
I agree.
WeirdLookingFellow
12-19-2019, 07:57 PM
what are we supposed to be lmao-ing at?
You are cordially invited to laugh my ass off.
Her getting 3 regions of Romania as an "oracle".
Lucas
12-19-2019, 07:57 PM
Mlukasz is it possible to remove the Chamar sample. I don’t like that word.Thank you
For some private reasons I want to keep this sample...
Maybe I will rename it. What is your proposal?:)
Feichy scores high Neolithic farmer compared to me so her opinion is obviously not to be taken seriously unless talking about how to grow tomatoes.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
https://i.imgur.com/sRFoNLs.jpg
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 08:00 PM
LOL
Croat from Olib scores 0.6% NW Euro.
LMAO
Slovenians/NW Croats score 10-25% usually.
I posted Croats from all over Croatia.
No, Dalmatian Islanders don't have anything to do with them and absolutely never mixed. But Čakavians are genetically not like Vlach-infected Štokavians. That's the secret.
They are what medieval Croats were before Vlachs from Bosnia came. And that's why our medieval language was what they speak.
Stop embarassing yourself.
Your own posted samples, she's like 2.5x more EE than average dalmatian croat, closest i could find was 40% EE and 2.5% NW, and at such low NW score among nw croats its a lottery how much you inherit.
Medieval southern croats = bosnian(serbs) Modern southern croats = medieval southern croats + kaykavian(real croat) + occasionaly catholic immigrant(be it german,extra slovenian,austrian,hungarian etc)
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 08:02 PM
For Morlach cluster I used following Croats:
Zadar and Vrlika (posted by Mingle)
Herzegovina Croat posted by Insuperable
Ljubic father
and one more I can't remember, but he was certified pure southern Croat.
you should have used the one from Lič too, he is the same as them.
i also found one with the surname Šegota, probably from Senj, he also had such results. the suffix -ota was typical for the pre-Slavic language of the Bunjevci
sadly his kit is lost now after the last Gedmatch fuckup.
Nurzat
12-19-2019, 08:03 PM
...
I hope you don't get upset but you are like those Russkies in denial aka Ukrainians that get anti-Russian to hysterical levels. just as East Slavs are one, Yugoslavs the same, are one, it's only politics and regional pride that put them apart, otherwise you wouldn't have the exact same language (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serbo-Croatian).
Serbs are a proud and strong nation, I think everyone would have benefited from a strong united Yugoslavia instead the tiny countries it broke into. I am not Yugo and I like the idea of a big Yugoslavia, imagine how Slovenes, Croats, Serbs, Bosnians, Montenegrins would like it too and would favour Yugoslavia, of course with Belgrade as capital.
...
No. There is no average Dalmatian Croat. They range a lot. Because they are not of same origins. Čakavians are usually far more Slavic than Štokavians and guess what, they remained only on islands and some coastal villages. And it's quite laughable to connect medieval Croats with Serbs when Serbs couldn't even understand their language and lived deep in mountains of Raška.
They are about as connected as Germans and Swedish.
Kajkavians aren't original Croats either. They are Croatised Panonnian Slavs.
All relevant medieval Croatian remains are either in north-central Dalmatia or North Adriatic region, written on čakavian dialect.
you should have used the one from Lič too, he is the same as them.
i also found one with the surname Šegota, probably from Senj, he also had such results. the suffix -ota was typical for the pre-Slavic language of the Bunjevci
sadly his kit is lost now after the last Gedmatch fuckup.
I used one you posted I think, but not that one. I was considering him, but didn't use him in the end because he is ''officially'' from Gorski Kotar.
Btw I used WestCoast from Posušje as one of guys for Slavic cluster. Also Max Soldo from Livno.
Morlak
12-19-2019, 08:14 PM
i mean in the k13 oracle on gedmatch?
# Population (source) Distance
1 Serbian 4.42
2 Romanian 4.94
3 Bulgarian 6.37
4 Moldavian 7.25
5 Croatian 9.99
6 Hungarian 10.9
7 Austrian 13.95
8 Greek_Thessaly 15
9 East_German 15.31
10 Ukrainian_Lviv 16.46
11 South_Polish 17.23
12 Ukrainian 17.59
13 North_Italian 18.31
14 West_German 19.08
15 Tuscan 19.48
16 French 20.16
17 South_Dutch 20.55
18 Polish 20.78
19 Southwest_Russian 20.98
20 Ukrainian_Belgorod 21.07
I hope you don't get upset but you are like those Russkies in denial aka Ukrainians that get anti-Russian to hysterical levels. just as East Slavs are one, Yugoslavs the same, are one, it's only politics and regional pride that put them apart, otherwise you wouldn't have the exact same language (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serbo-Croatian).
Serbs are a proud and strong nation, I think everyone would have benefited from a strong united Yugoslavia instead the tiny countries it broke into. I am not Yugo and I like the idea of a big Yugoslavia, imagine how Slovenes, Croats, Serbs, Bosnians, Montenegrins would like it too and would favour Yugoslavia, of course with Belgrade as capital.
Well no, if Yugoslavia wasn't a shithole there would be no breakup.
I usually prefer to be in company of more developed nations, not poorer more backwards ones.
And I hope you wan't be offended, but we don't like orthodox people or feel affinity with their culture. You are foreign world for us, no point to deny the obvious.
East Slavs are culturally one, South Slavs are not.
And our language is product of 19th century political agreement between south slavs. Not very relevant for history.
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 08:16 PM
# Population (source) Distance
1 Serbian 4.42
i think this avearege should be added back, as "Serb_Belgrade", because that's what they are.
ProudBrit
12-19-2019, 08:16 PM
No. There is no average Dalmatian Croat. They range a lot. Because they are not of same origins. Čakavians are usually far more Slavic than Štokavians and guess what, they remained only on islands and some coastal villages. And it's quite laughable to connect medieval Croats with Serbs when Serbs couldn't even understand their language and lived deep in mountains of Raška.
They are about as connected as Germans and Swedish.
Kajkavians aren't real Croats either. They are Croatised Panonnian Slavs.
All relevant medieval Croatian remains are either in north-central Dalmatia or North Adriatic region, written on čakavian dialect.
Of course they range a lot when theyre a mix a of pannonian slavs and bosnians at different ratios, stokavians being closer to bosnians and speaking serbian.
And even if you were right(you arent) and only cakavians are real croats than pretty much most of croatians have nothing(or a large chunk )with the original south slavs, including yourself.
nittionia
12-19-2019, 08:16 PM
Here is my K15 and my dad's, not sure which calculator is supposed to be the popular one
Mine:
https://i.imgur.com/lfy0sni.png
My dad:
https://i.imgur.com/i200HUi.png
Daos777
12-19-2019, 08:16 PM
Well no, if Yugoslavia wasn't a shithole there would be no breakup.
I usually prefer to be in company of more developed nations, not poorer more backwards ones.
And I hope you wan't be offended, but we don't like orthodox people or feel affinity with their culture. You are foreign world for us, no point to deny the obvious.
East Slavs are culturally one, South Slavs are not.
This post is pure proof of remove Croat for peace in Balkans. There is only room for Eastern Orthodox in the Balkans. Croats can move to Bavaria.
Orthodox Christianity is the oldest Christian tradition and isn't synonymous with Serbia at all. If any historical country should be picked, it would be the Byzantine empire. Shall I remind you that the biggest Eastern Orthodox church is Russian, not Serbian. Also I doubt you have much against Romania, Bulgaria or Greece and how they believe, don't you. So that's definitely the wrong choice of words.
We have nothing against other orthodox nations except Serbs. But when we say orthodox here we mean Serb orthodoxy.
They kept monopoly over all Orthodox Christians no matter their origins in the region for centuries.
Nurzat
12-19-2019, 08:19 PM
Well no, if Yugoslavia wasn't a shithole there would be no breakup.
I usually prefer to be in company of more developed nations, not poorer more backwards ones.
And I hope you wan't be offended, but we don't like orthodox people or feel affinity with their culture. You are foreign world for us, no point to deny the obvious.
East Slavs are culturally one, South Slavs are not.
truth is we don't like Catholics either, we have a bad word that translates to something like "popists" (because you've got the Pope, which we don't accept/like).
for my community it goes further - we are old calendar Orthodox (Ruthenians and Lipovans) versus new calendar Orthodox (Romanians) xD
vbnetkhio
12-19-2019, 08:20 PM
And it's quite laughable to connect medieval Croats with Serbs when Serbs couldn't even understand their language and lived deep in mountains of Raška.
do you agree Bunjevci came to Croatia from the Serbian medieval state, they spoke a Vlachified Serbian language (shtokavian ikavian) and they imposed their culture and language onto the more numerous local Croats?
i'm not being a Chetnik provocator, i'm asking seriously.
Of course they range a lot when theyre a mix a of pannonian slavs and bosnians at different ratios, stokavians being closer to bosnians and speaking serbian.
No. Dalmatian Islanders have 0% Panonnian Slavic blood, there was never contact and they lived separated in different countries for centuries, no linguistic influence no nothing.
You can prove us differently and present evidence of NW Croat migration into Dalmatian islands, I will be delighted to read it.
truth is we don't like Catholics either, we have a bad word that translates to something like "popists" (because you've got the Pope, which we don't accept/like).
for my community it goes further - we are old calendar Orthodox (Ruthenians and Lipovans) versus new calendar Orthodox (Romanians) xD
Well than stop trying to push idea we should live with easterners. No thanks.
do you agree Bunjevci came to Croatia from the Serbian medieval state, they spoke a Vlachified Serbian language (shtokavian ikavian) and they imposed their culture and language onto the more numerous local Croats?
i'm not being a Chetnik provocator, i'm asking seriously.
I don't believe Zahumljani, etc were Serbs. I believe they were separated Slavic tribes. I consider Kosovo-Resava dialect original Serbian language.
Morlak
12-19-2019, 08:24 PM
They kept monopoly over all Orthodox Christians no matter their origins in the region for centuries.
Such as? Serbian Church had authority over territories in which Serbs were present. If you are talking about Vlachs, well its not our fault they weren't able to organize themselves on any level to preserve their identity.
Such as? Serbian Church had authority over territories in which Serbs were present. If you are talking about Vlachs, well its not our fault they weren't able to organize themselves on any level to preserve their identity.
Why does Serb Orthodox Church doesn't want to acknowedge Macedonian church?
And I consider typical Serbs genetically Moje Ime and Commonsense.
Morlak
12-19-2019, 08:32 PM
Why does Serb Orthodox Church doesn't want to acknowedge Macedonian church?
I dont honestly care about that. I am not religious thus religious questions do not concern me. Neither am i familiar with Laws of Orthodox Church.
Morlak
12-19-2019, 08:33 PM
double post
Pribislav
12-19-2019, 08:33 PM
And I consider typical Serbs genetically Moje Ime and Commonsense.
Ženo Božja pita sam ga el mu ćaća ima neku babu/prababu Bunjevku i reka mi je da nema.
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