Eurogenes Biogeographic Ancestry Project

[Sahson]

how and where do I submit mine?

[Loki]

Mine:

Basque 41.25
Chuvash 40.05
Armenian 18.68
Nganassan + Dolgan + Yukagir 0.00

[Electronic God-Man]

Basque: 49.8
Chuvash: 46.4
Armenian: 3.8
Nganassan + Dolgan + Yukagir: 0.00

[Loki]

Intra-North European ADMIXTURE analysis (unsupervised) (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/04/intra-north-european-admixture-analysis.html)

My results:

Red (Western European) 74.3%
Green (Finnish) 11.0%
Aqua (Russian) 14.5%
Purple (Baltic) 00.0%

It is interesting where I deviate from Germans and Dutch - all the German samples have quite a bit of Baltic, and the single Dutch one. I am very different from Hungarian since they have large chunks of Baltic seemingly. In this regard, again, my result seems closer to UK samples. But the UK samples seem to have either a Finnish or Russian "minority". I have both in fairly equal measures.

[Grumpy Cat]

I wasn't on that one.

[d3cimat3d]

I'm 2nd to last. The rest are Greeks & Italians:

http://i56.tinypic.com/5foyom.png

^Key:

Red = French (Atlantic)
Orange = Romanian (North Balkan)
Light Green = Cypriot (Eastern Mediterranean)
Green = Jordanian + Palestinian (Middle Eastern)
Aqua = Selected Mozabite Berber (North African)
Dark Blue = Norwegian + Swedish (North European)
Purple = Armenian + Georgian (Anatolian & Caucasus)
Pink = Chuvash (Volga-Ural)

[Loki]

I've just done some workings, and the samples who are closest to me are:


(Western European) (Finnish) (Russian) (Baltic)
FR 0.905241 0.04187 0.052879 0.00001
FR 0.803418 0.060144 0.136428 0.00001
Orcadian 0.801105 0.113429 0.085456 0.00001
UK14 0.837241 0.055214 0.107535 0.00001
UK22 0.846432 0.130924 0.022634 0.00001
Loki 0.743881 0.110156 0.145954 0.00001
NO1 0.69472 0.196717 0.108553 0.00001
NO8 0.664788 0.261191 0.074011 0.00001

[Agrippa]

Intra-North European ADMIXTURE analysis (unsupervised) (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/04/intra-north-european-admixture-analysis.html)

My results:

Red (Western European) 74.3%
Green (Finnish) 11.0%
Aqua (Russian) 14.5%
Purple (Baltic) 00.0%

It is interesting where I deviate from Germans and Dutch - all the German samples have quite a bit of Baltic, and the single Dutch one. I am very different from Hungarian since they have large chunks of Baltic seemingly. In this regard, again, my result seems closer to UK samples. But the UK samples seem to have either a Finnish or Russian "minority". I have both in fairly equal measures.

The Dutch, NL1 is interesting, such a high Western, relatively high Finnish and no Balto-Russian.

[Loki]

The Dutch, NL1 is interesting, such a high Western, relatively high Finnish and no Balto-Russian.

Yes, unfortunately one cannot draw conclusions from one sample. Would be good to have more Dutch samples on board.

[Pallantides]

http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/494/graphz.png

http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/3776/skandie.png

[Agrippa]

Only NO8 has more "Finnish" than you. ;)

[Pallantides]

Also a few of the Swedes have higher "Finnish" values than me,
what I find interesting is that SE8 and myself are the only Scandinavians with no "Russian".


edit* I believe NO8 have some Swedish ancestry, wich could explain his higher Finnish score.

[Agrippa]

Without overstretching things (this is just a test calculation and one could use other values I guess) I would associate a "Baltic and Russian" contribution with R1a carriers and probably even Indo-Europeans, in any case more Eastern and South Eastern influences.

I just wonder how the results would look, if a South Eastern component would be included, because now that ("Neolithic"/Near Eastern) component might be distributed among the 4 used components in a specific way...

[Franz]

Britons show more Finn than the French, Germans, Hungarians, and Poles.


Without overstretching things (this is just a test calculation and one could use other values I guess) I would associate a "Baltic and Russian" contribution with R1a carriers and probably even Indo-Europeans, in any case more Eastern and South Eastern influences.

I just wonder how the results would look, if a South Eastern component would be included, because now that ("Neolithic"/Near Eastern) component might be distributed among the 4 used components in a specific way...

Well, R1a1 dispersed some IE languages (e.g., Indo-Iranian and Balto-Slavic). I think the Near Eastern is more likely or much a subset of Russian for this run. The Baltic shows a stronger Northeast gradient.

[Ibericus]

Without overstretching things (this is just a test calculation and one could use other values I guess) I would associate a "Baltic and Russian" contribution with R1a carriers and probably even Indo-Europeans, in any case more Eastern and South Eastern influences.

I just wonder how the results would look, if a South Eastern component would be included, because now that ("Neolithic"/Near Eastern) component might be distributed among the 4 used components in a specific way...
Baltics are predominantly N1c

[Loki]

The "Neolithic belt" and surrounds at K=8 (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/04/neolithic-belt-and-surrounds-at-k8.html)

Polako included mainly Southern Europeans (among Europeans) in this run. I was included, too:



East Eurasian 0.02405
European + Anatolian 0.884999
North African 0.00001
South Asian 0.067035
Middle Eastern 0.00001
West Central African 0.015725
East African 0.00001
West African 0.008161


There is a major difference between me and modern Southern Europeans - I do not have any North African and Middle Eastern, whereas they seem to have sizeable portions of it.

[Agrippa]

Baltics are predominantly N1c

I think that should be more with the Finnish element.

[Olavsson]

edit* I believe NO8 have some Swedish ancestry, wich could explain his higher Finnish score.

Hello, I'm NO8 in the Eurogenes-project. He accepted my raw-data not too long ago. ;)
Well, as far as I know, I do not have any considerable ancestry from Sweden, but some of my most recent ancestors came from eastern Norway not far from the Swedish border, so who knows? I should perhaps do some deeper investigation into my genealogy.


Without overstretching things (this is just a test calculation and one could use other values I guess) I would associate a "Baltic and Russian" contribution with R1a carriers and probably even Indo-Europeans, in any case more Eastern and South Eastern influences.

That's interesting. What associations do you get regarding the "Finnish" and "Western-European" used in this analysis?

[Agrippa]

That's interesting. What associations do you get regarding the "Finnish" and "Western-European" used in this analysis?

Well, Western European could be a combination of Atlantic + Western Neolithic probably and Finnish should be North Eastern Mesolithic + Uralic.

But that is just my personal impression :)

[Pallantides]

Hello, I'm NO8 in the Eurogenes-project. He accepted my raw-data not too long ago. ;)
Well, as far as I know, I do not have any considerable ancestry from Sweden, but some of my most recent ancestors came from eastern Norway not far from the Swedish border, so who knows? I should perhaps do some deeper investigation into my genealogy.



That's interesting. What associations do you get regarding the "Finnish" and "Western-European" used in this analysis?
:thumbs up

My bad, it was evon from abf who listed you as swe/no on ABF in this graph he made:
http://www.forumbiodiversity.com/showpost.php?p=350221&postcount=3512

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/422/20110416131534.jpg

[Agrippa]

:thumbs up

My bad, it was evon from abf who listed you as swe/no on ABF in this graph he made:
http://www.forumbiodiversity.com/showpost.php?p=350221&postcount=3512

http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/422/20110416131534.jpg

Are there detail graphs for other ethnicities as well, the huge graph is not really that clearly arranged to say the least...

The higher the "Baltic", the lower the "Russian". I guess that is a computational thing also with those two being close.

[Pallantides]

evon made that graph, here are the UK and Irish avarages by quotablepatella from ABF:

http://img859.imageshack.us/img859/9756/northeuroirishaverage.png
http://img864.imageshack.us/img864/5845/northeuroukaverage.png

[Agrippa]

evon made that graph.

Ask him whether he used a standard program of Win or something else :)

[Electronic God-Man]

evon made that graph, here are the UK and Irish avarages by quotablepatella from ABF:

http://img859.imageshack.us/img859/9756/northeuroirishaverage.png
http://img864.imageshack.us/img864/5845/northeuroukaverage.png

Your color key is a little messed up, isn't it? (Green is red, red is blue, aqua is green.) :)

[Pallantides]

Your color key is a little messed up, isn't it? (Green is red, red is blue, aqua is green.) :)

I didn't make it... but quotablepatella from ABF did, I just reposted it here because Agrippa asked if there were more graphs.

[Ibericus]

UK17 looks like he has recent baltic admixture

[Agrippa]

I didn't make it... but quotablepatella from ABF did, I just reposted it here because Agrippa asked if there were more graphs.

It really just shows that Baltic-Russian is messed up in my opinion, because that distribution makes little sense and the differentiation of this component should be particularly weak.

[Franz]

UK17 looks like he has recent baltic admixture

He has some Polish or Ukrainian ancestry.

[Äike]

Traces of Neolithic migration waves in our genomes...? (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/04/neolithic-population-waves-in-our-genes.html)

My result:

34.7% Basque
65.29% Chuvash
0% Armenian
0% Nganassan + Dolgan + Yukagir


Intra-North European ADMIXTURE analysis (unsupervised) (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/04/intra-north-european-admixture-analysis.html)


My result:

10% Western-European
29% Finnish
0% Russian
61% Baltic

Translation of Polako's terms:

Genetically Northern-Finnic group = Finnish

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/European_Middle_Neolithic.gif/800px-European_Middle_Neolithic.gif

Genetically Southern-Finnic group = Baltic

Professional scientists have concluded that the linguistically Finnic Estonians and linugistically Indo-European Balts mostly descend from the same native (southern) Finnic population of the area.

But Polako is a funny guy:

Indo-Europeans were in Finland long before the Uralics got there.

[Agrippa]

Certain Uralic elements seem to have entered North Eastern Europe pretty late, so he might be right.

[Loki]

My result:

10% Western-European
29% Finnish
0% Russian
61% Baltic



:clap::clap::clap:

[Äike]

Certain Uralic elements seem to have entered North Eastern Europe pretty late, so he might be right.

The Comb-Ceramic Culture/Finno-Ugric people predate the Corded Ware culture/Indo-Europeans in North-Eastern Europe by 1300 years.

The gradual assimilation of the Finnic populations south of us(the Estonians) is proved by archeological evidence.

Estonians are practically the only representative of the former southern-Finnic group. As the Livonians are extinct/assimilated, the Votes are almost extinct and even further in the past, southern-Finnic populations were assimilated even more south(Lithuania, Belarus etc.)

Anyone who says that the Indo-Europeans predate the Finno-Ugrians in Northern-Europe is either an Indo-European fanatic/extremist or just dumb.

This isn't the question that people are thinking about. The main question is, did we arrive here around 10 000 BC or 4 200 BC? Few people(scientists) are bold enough to say that the Indo-Europeans predate anyone in Northern-Europe.

[Don Brick]

My results from the Intra-North European ADMIXTURE analysis.

34.2 % - Western European
41.5 % - Finnish
21.1 % - Russian
3.2 % Baltic

[Osweo]

.Intra-North European ADMIXTURE analysis.
....Western-European ...Finnish .....Russian .....Baltic
Loki .........0.743881 .. 0.110156 .. 0.145954 .. 0.00001
Karl .........0.10% ...... 0.29% ..... 0% .......... 0.61%
Don Draper 0.342 ....... 0.415 ....... 0.211 ...... 0.32
OSWEO......0.785143 .. 0.093324 .. 0.00001.... 0.121523 :chin:

Neolithic wave thingy;
KARL:
34.7% Basque
65.29% Chuvash
0% Armenian
0% Nganassan + Dolgan + Yukagir

OSWEO:
53.9665 Basque
46.0315 Chuvash
o
o

[Don Brick]

New results y´all! :thumb001:

http://eurogenes.blogspot.com/2011/04/intra-north-european-admixture-analysis.html

Mine:

45.3 % Finnish
27.8 % Western European
16.6 % Baltic
7.4 % North Atlantic
2.9 % Volga-Ural

[Olavsson]

Roughly:

78.3% North-Atlantic
20.3% Finnish
1.3% Volga-Ural
0.0% Baltic
0.0% Western-European

Why did I get 0% "Western European" this time? A bit confusing.

[Pallantides]

North Atlantic - 90.79%
Finnish - 6.77%
Volga Ural - 2.42%
Baltic - 0%
Western European - 0%


I'm the second most 'North Atlantic' Norwegian after NO9 and the second least 'Finnish' after NO3 on this run.

[Agrippa]

North Atlantic - 90.79%
Finnish - 6.77%
Volga Ural - 2.42%
Baltic - 0%
Western European - 0%


I'm the second most 'North Atlantic' Norwegian after NO9 and the second least 'Finnish' after NO3 on this run.

Must be a mistake :p

Interesting really, but looking at the results, I'm still least sure about the Finnish-Baltic distinction. Because it seems some people "jump" just on one side, in such a radical way in comparison to others, that it makes me still wonder how that can be and if the differentiation of Baltic and Finnic in particular is always that "clean".

[Pallantides]

K-4
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/494/graphz.png

K-5
http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/7122/graph1q.png


Lemminkäinen response to my results on ABF:

This K5 weights Nothern Russians and Irish references and have less Central European components. As result you have much North Atlantic and Finns have much common with Northern Russians. And you have Uralics, but not Baltic admix, because of less Central European components. But I dont know is it better or worse than some other results. I wnder however that Swedes have 6.5% Western European and 65% Atlantic admix.

[Äike]

New results y´all! :thumb001:

http://eurogenes.blogspot.com/2011/04/intra-north-european-admixture-analysis.html

Mine:

45.3 % Finnish
27.8 % Western European
16.6 % Baltic
7.4 % North Atlantic
2.9 % Volga-Ural

My results:

Finnish: 32.1%
Baltic: 60.2%
Western-European 0%
Volga-Ural 0%
North-Atlantic 7.5%


Interesting really, but looking at the results, I'm still least sure about the Finnish-Baltic distinction. Because it seems some people "jump" just on one side, in such a radical way in comparison to others, that it makes me still wonder how that can be and if the differentiation of Baltic and Finnic in particular is always that "clean".

That's Polako for you...

As I stated earlier, "southern-Finnic" is more dominant in that "Baltic" group than anything else.

At least Polako changed his "labels". Before Finnish was Finnic and completely Finnic Estonians could have scored very low in the Finnic area, because they are the last remaining southern-Finnics together with the Votes and the extinct Livonians. He only had Finns in his Finnic group, no other Finnic people. For him Finns = Finnic, while in reality, the proto-Finnic area was somewhere south-east of modern-day Finland and Finns are "peripheral" Finnic people. The core Finnic group has been assimilated by the Russians and the Balts ages ago. There was an article about this somewhere.

By the way, I have dozens of Finnish relatives on 23andme and I am even related to a Finnish member of this forum, while I have no Baltic cousins. The first people in my cousin's list are all Estonians, then come the Finns.

[Pallantides]

Average values:

BELARUS (N=10)
Finnish: 5.2%
Baltic: 76.9%
Western European: 13.0%
Volga-Ural: 2.1%
North Atlantic: 2.7%

CHUVASH (N=17)
Finnish: 1.1%
Baltic: 4.9%
Western European: 1.0%
Volga-Ural: 92.4%
North Atlantic: 0.5%

DENMARK (N=2)
Finnish: 6.4%
Baltic: 5.7%
Western European: 15.1%
Volga-Ural: 2.6%
North Atlantic: 70.2%

ESTONIA (N=2)
Finnish: 29.2%
Baltic: 57.5%
Western European: 2.8%
Volga-Ural: 0.2%
North Atlantic: 10.2%

FINLAND (N=18)
Finnish: 76.8%
Baltic: 6.7%
Western European: 2.9%
Volga-Ural: 2.5%
North Atlantic: 11.1%

FRANCE (N=31)
Finnish: 4.1%
Baltic: 6.7%
Western European: 51.9%
Volga-Ural: 1.1%
North Atlantic: 36.2%

GERMANY (N=9)
Finnish: 6.3%
Baltic: 22.2%
Western European: 28.4%
Volga-Ural: 1.5%
North Atlantic: 41.6%

HUNGARY (N=18)
Finnish: 5.2%
Baltic: 37.1%
Western European: 37.4%
Volga-Ural: 3.2%
North Atlantic: 17.1%

IRELAND (N=10)
Finnish: 1.5%
Baltic: 1.5%
Western European: 12.5%
Volga-Ural: 1.7%
North Atlantic: 82.7%

LITHUANIA (N=10)
Finnish: 1.8%
Baltic: 93.9%
Western European: 1.5%
Volga-Ural: 0.6%
North Atlantic: 2.2%

NORTH RUSSIA (N=25)
Finnish: 20.4%
Baltic: 49.3%
Western European: 3.3%
Volga-Ural: 23.7%
North Atlantic: 3.3%

NORWAY (N=8)
Finnish: 10.5%
Baltic: 5.4%
Western European: 1.1%
Volga-Ural: 2.5%
North Atlantic: 80.5%

POLAND (N=10)
Finnish: 4.3%
Baltic: 61.1%
Western European: 19.8%
Volga-Ural: 2.6%
North Atlantic: 12.2%

RUSSIA (N=12)
Finnish: 13.5%
Baltic: 58.3%
Western European: 9.0%
Volga-Ural: 11.9%
North Atlantic: 7.4%

SWEDEN (N=7)
Finnish: 16.6%
Baltic: 11.7%
Western European: 6.6%
Volga-Ural: 2.0%
North Atlantic: 63.2%

UK (N=20)
Finnish: 5.7%
Baltic: 5.3%
Western European: 21.6%
Volga-Ural: 0.9%
North Atlantic: 66.6%

UKRAINE (N=2)
Finnish: 14.0%
Baltic: 59.7%
Western European: 15.7%
Volga-Ural: 2.8%
North Atlantic: 7.9%



My Finnish score is now lower than the Norwegian average...

[Graham]

Average values:




My Finnish score is now lower than the Norwegian average...

My Finnish score is higher than yours lol

[Pallantides]

Also Norwegians are more North Atlantic than the Brits.:cool:




You can now call me Kull of Atlantis
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_p47Aa2K8l-E/S_7sIx5sggI/AAAAAAAAANE/Ot2hMJSj8Xg/s1600/kullbarbarian.jpg

[Äike]

My Finnish score is higher than yours lol

...And in a previous test Loki was 14% Russian while I was 0% Russian.

This is one of the many reasons why I look at 23andme and all of these "tests" as entertainment, not science.

[Graham]

My results

11.03 % Finnish
20.50 % Western European
00.31 % Baltic
68.16% North Atlantic
00.00 % Volga-Ural

[Aino]

Both of my parents are shown as 100% Finnish at K=4 and K=5.

[Efim45]

I've done a 23andme test. I've gotten >99% european and <1% asian, I would like to do this, but how do I get the raw data?

[Aino]

I've done a 23andme test. I've gotten >99% european and <1% asian, I would like to do this, but how do I get the raw data?

Download it from your 23andme account (Account > Browse Raw Data > Download Raw Data).

[Efim45]

I just read on the website that he closed the submission period back in February, is it still closed?

[Loki]

My results:

45.0% North Atlantic
37.0% Western European
11.5% Finnish
06.4% Volga-Ural
00.0% Baltic

[Pallantides]

The hell...
Loki is also more Volga-Ural and Finnish than me.:D

[Grumpy Cat]

Me too:

Finnish: 0.001%
Baltic: 11.7%
West European: 44.03%
Volga-Ural: 1.3%
North Atlantic: 42.95%

I seem to be more in line with the French folks, there.

[Loki]

Me too:

Finnish: 0.001%
Baltic: 11.7%
West European: 44.03%
Volga-Ural: 1.3%
North Atlantic: 42.95%

I seem to be more in line with the French folks, there.

Yeah, you and me are similar to French and German ... but I have the added quirk of having no Baltic component at all, which is weird. Averages about 20% in Germans. So I am clearly rather different.

[Grumpy Cat]

Yeah, you and me are similar to French and German ... but I have the added quirk of having no Baltic component at all, which is weird. Averages about 20% in Germans. So I am clearly rather different.

That's your Adonis DNA. :D

No, actually, I would think I would have a higher percentage from the Northern European areas because of my father.

I made a joke that I think I should call the Maury Povich show. :lol:

[Pallantides]

I thought North Atlantic was Adonis DNA!:D

[Äike]

Most of you are more Volga-Ural than I(0%) am. This is quite surprising, especially when seeing this in Western-Europeans.

Also being 0% Russian in a previous test, while seeing Western-Europeans being more Russian than me, was also interesting. As North-Western Russians are very Finnic/Northern-European. I assume that he didn't have any NW-Russians in his base groups. OR the NW-Russians all just scored 100% Finnish :p

[Agrippa]

Is there an easy to get program for this mess:
http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/04/genetic-distance-matrix-including-2000.html

Because my excel can't copy all the info, at least I can't do it and in the text form it is useless.

[Aino]

Most of you are more Volga-Ural than I(0%) am. This is quite surprising, especially when seeing this in Western-Europeans.

Also being 0% Russian in a previous test, while seeing Western-Europeans being more Russian than me, was also interesting. As North-Western Russians are very Finnic/Northern-European. I assume that he didn't have any NW-Russians in his base groups. OR the NW-Russians all just scored 100% Finnish :p

There were 25 Vologda Russians in the K=5 run. Their average scores were 49% Baltic, 24% Volga-Ural, 20% Finnish, 3% Western European, 3% North Atlantic.

[Loki]

Is there an easy to get program for this mess:
http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/04/genetic-distance-matrix-including-2000.html

Because my excel can't copy all the info, at least I can't do it and in the text form it is useless.

Access database is the way to go. I'll try importing it and see what I can do.

[Sikeliot]

I want to know why Lithuanians have autosomally almost no East Asian ancestry and not much "Finnish" in that analysis when their haplogroup frequencies are close to Finland's.

[Loki]

Access database is the way to go. I'll try importing it and see what I can do.

Okay I managed to pull all the data into Access. Now to see how to make sense of it.

Of course one could do Excel pivot tables on top of the Access table. I'll have a look.

[Grumpy Cat]

Access? Excel?

Puh. Microsoft.

[Äike]

I want to know why Lithuanians have autosomally almost no East Asian ancestry and not much "Finnish" in that analysis when their haplogroup frequencies are close to Finland's.

Finnic ancestry isn't related to East Asian ancestry. Some Finns have it because of the Saami and the Saami have it because of the Samoyedic/Siberian influence. But other Finnic groups do not have it at all.


Now to answer your other question. That "Baltic" group should actually be renamed to "southern-Finnic". As the Lithuanians, Latvians and some Belorussians descend mostly from the native Finnic population of this region.

Just look how heavily FinN1C the Lithuanians are. :p

[Loki]

Okay I managed to pull all the data into Access. Now to see how to make sense of it.

Of course one could do Excel pivot tables on top of the Access table. I'll have a look.

Damn. Maximum of 255 columns in my Access version. I'll use another database.

[Sikeliot]

Finnic ancestry isn't related to East Asian ancestry. Some Finns have it because of the Saami and the Saami have it because of the Samoyedic/Siberian influence. But other Finnic groups do not have it at all.


Now to answer your other question. That "Baltic" group should actually be renamed to "southern-Finnic". As the Lithuanians, Latvians and some Belorussians descend mostly from the native Finnic population of this region.

Just look how heavily FinN1C the Lithuanians are. :p


Are Estonians and Lithuanians more related to Finns or to people from Poland? That's my final question.

[Agrippa]

Damn. Maximum of 255 columns in my Access version. I'll use another database.

Not that easy hmm...it is just too large unfortunately.

[Loki]

Not that easy hmm...it is just too large unfortunately.

I've downloaded a programme called UltraEdit. Seems to be doing the trick. It easily opens the whole file. I'm now just fiddling to get it in the right format.

[Franz]

I could post individual results for whomever.

[Pallantides]

I could post individual results for whomever.

It would be nice If you'd post mine Franz:)

[Franz]

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8539&stc=1&d=1303417665

I think GSM536696 is Dodecad's V609.

[Loki]

I could post individual results for whomever.

Mine too please! :)

SAEU1

[Don Brick]

I´d appreciate it if you could do mine too, Franz. I´m FI6. :)

[Pallantides]

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8539&stc=1&d=1303417665

I think GSM536696 is Dodecad's V609.

Thank you!:thumb001:


my 20 highest (excluding US matches)

NO8 0.266303
IE8 0.267109
FI129 0.267129
BY 0.267272
UA2 0.267360
NO1 0.267445
Orcadian 0.267727
SE1 0.267858
PLNL1 0.267875
IE3 0.267888
IE11 0.267921
UK19 0.267949
UK18 0.267989
UK20 0.268055
NO6 0.268092
UK21 0.268132
IENO1 0.268182
LT 0.268198
SE6 0.268217
IE9 0.268230

[Franz]

SAEU1 (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8544&stc=1&d=1303418677)
FI6 (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8545&stc=1&d=1303418677)

[Loki]

Thanks a bunch Franz!

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8546&stc=1&d=1303419201

So ... my closest match is a BY (Belarusian?), followed by some USers, then Irish, UK, AA (?), German, Norwegian, French, Hungarian and a Swede.

[Franz]

Thanks a bunch Franz!

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8546&stc=1&d=1303419201

So ... my closest match is a BY (Belarusian?), followed by some USers, then Irish, UK, AA (?), German, Norwegian, French, Hungarian and a Swede.

There's definitely something wrong with AA3. That's Polako's error.

[Efim45]

Any of you know when they will be accepting submissions?

[Grumpy Cat]

I could post individual results for whomever.

I am CA21

[Loki]

In relation to me:

187 UK20 (Osweo)
243 NO8 (Olavsson)
294 NO2 (Pallantides)
336 CA21 (AcadianDriftwood)
380 FI6 (Don Draper)

[Osweo]

....There's no chance you could be so kind as to do the same for a certain UK20, is there, Franz? :o

[Loki]

In relation to me:

187 UK20 (Osweo)
243 NO8 (Olavsson)
294 NO2 (Pallantides)
336 CA21 (AcadianDriftwood)
380 FI6 (Don Draper)

Ah, I found Osweo :D My closest so far among Apricians. ;)

[Don Brick]

In relation to me:

187 UK20 (Osweo)
243 NO8 (Olavsson)
294 NO2 (Pallantides)
336 CA21 (AcadianDriftwood)
380 FI6 (Don Draper)

Hallelujah thank God we´re so distant!!! :D

j/k :wink:p

[Pallantides]

Apricians

2 (Olavsson) NO8 0.266303
25 (Osweo) UK20 0.268055
212 (Don Draper) FI6 0.269732
287 (AcadianDriftwood) CA21 0.270137
476 (Loki) SAEU1 0.271578

[Agrippa]

I could post individual results for whomever.

How did you do that, special program or trick? :)

[Don Brick]

Yay what fun! :D

28 NO8 (Olavsson)
62 UK20 (Osweo)
194 NO2 (Pallantides)
294 CA21 (AcadianDriftwood)
514 SAEU1 (Loki)

:thumb001:

[Pallantides]

My distances from those named fellows from genomesunzipped


17 Carl_Anderson Carl_Anderson 0.267914
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/carl_final.jpg

55 Kate_Morley Kate_Morley 0.268525
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/kate_final.jpg

92 Jan_Aerts Jan_Aerts 0.268879
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/jan_final.jpg

110 Jeff_Barrett Jeff_Barrett 0.269025
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/jeff_final.jpg

124 Caroline_Wright Caroline_Wright 0.269133
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/caroline_final.jpg

177 Vincent_Plagnol Vincent_Plagnol 0.269509
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/vince_final.jpg

190 Joe_Pickrell Joe_Pickrell 0.269575
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/joe_final.jpg

204 Ilana_Fisher Ilana_Fisher 0.269631
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/ilana_final.jpg

273 Don_Conrad Don_Conrad 0.270046
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/don_final.jpg

311 Luke_Jostins Luke_Jostins 0.270288
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/luke_final.jpg

440 Daniel_MacArthur Daniel_MacArthur 0.271288
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/daniel_final.jpg

739 Dan_Vorhaus Dan_Vorhaus 0.275157
http://www.genomesunzipped.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/dan_final.jpg

[Franz]

UK20 (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8562&stc=1&d=1303435423)


2 (Olavsson) NO8 0.266303

nearest identity-by-state neighbor, lucky you


How did you do that, special program or trick? :)

lots of tricks

[Pallantides]

By the way, here's a new intra-North Euro K=5, and we now have a Norwegian or North Sea cluster. We'll see how that develops.

Spreadsheet (https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0Ato3EYTdM8lQdFZqaS1qTjlBVXNiSkQ2MFU4YXBCS lE&hl=en&authkey=CKCzuPwN)

http://img816.imageshack.us/img816/494/neuk5.png




I'm pretty much close to 100% in the North Sea/Norwegian cluster.
http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/4628/northseanorwegian.png

[Loki]

Me:

51.9% Western European
31.3% North Sea
10.5% Finnish
06.1% Volga-Ural
00.0% Baltic

I have more North Sea (Norwegian) than all the German samples, and I seem to be on par with the Danes, British and the Irish. I actually am very similar to NL2.

Aha! DK3's distribution resembles mine narrowly:

53.3% Western European
31.5% North Sea
13.2% Finnish
01.8% Volga-Ural
00.0% Baltic

[Loki]

Averages, posted by Day Tripper on ABF:

FRANCE (N=31)
North Sea: 16%
Finnish: 5%
Volga-Ural: 2%
Baltic: 5%
Western European: 73%

IRELAND (N=10)
North Sea: 37%
Finnish: 5%
Volga-Ural: 1%
Baltic: 4%
Western European: 53%

UNITED KINGDOM (N=21)
North Sea: 34%
Finnish: 7%
Volga-Ural: 1%
Baltic: 5%
Western European: 54%

GERMANY (N=9)
North Sea: 24%
Finnish: 5%
Volga-Ural: 2%
Baltic: 20%
Western European: 48%

NORWAY (N=8)
North Sea: 78%
Finnish: 3%
Volga-Ural: 1%
Baltic: 5%
Western European: 13%

SWEDEN (N=7)
North Sea: 34%
Finnish: 17%
Volga-Ural: 2%
Baltic: 12%
Western European: 35%

FINLAND (N=18)
North Sea: 14%
Finnish: 67%
Volga-Ural: 3%
Baltic: 11%
Western European: 6%

POLAND (N=10)
North Sea: 12%
Finnish: 4%
Volga-Ural: 3%
Baltic: 56%
Western European: 25%

HUNGARY (N=18)
North Sea: 8%
Finnish: 5%
Volga-Ural: 4%
Baltic: 34%
Western European: 48%

LITHUANIA (N=10)
North Sea: 6%
Finnish: 3%
Volga-Ural: 1%
Baltic: 87%
Western European: 3%

BELARUS (N=10)
North Sea: 7%
Finnish: 4%
Volga-Ural: 2%
Baltic: 74%
Western European: 13%

RUSSIA (N=14)
North Sea: 8%
Finnish: 11%
Volga-Ural: 13%
Baltic: 57%
Western European: 12%

NORTH RUSSIA (N=25)
North Sea: 6%
Finnish: 16%
Volga-Ural: 20%
Baltic: 48%
Western European: 5%

CHUVASH (N=17)
North Sea: 0
Finnish: 1%
Volga-Ural: 91%
Baltic: 5%
Western European: 1%

[Olavsson]

I could post individual results for whomever.

Hi Franz, would you mind posting my individual results as well? :)

[Äike]

Are Estonians and Lithuanians more related to Finns or to people from Poland? That's my final question.

Ethno-culturally and linguistically, the Lithuanians are foreign to us Finnic Estonians and Finns. But genetically, Estonians and Lithuanians are similar, because the Lithuanians have a lot of Finnic blood running in their veins. They're quite heavily FinN1C.

Ethno-culturally Lithuanians and Poles are quite similar. While the Lithuanians aren't similar to the Estonians/Finns.

[Agrippa]

Thank you!:thumb001:


my 20 highest (excluding US matches)

NO8 0.266303
IE8 0.267109
FI129 0.267129
BY 0.267272
UA2 0.267360
NO1 0.267445
Orcadian 0.267727
SE1 0.267858
PLNL1 0.267875
IE3 0.267888
IE11 0.267921
UK19 0.267949
UK18 0.267989
UK20 0.268055
NO6 0.268092
UK21 0.268132
IENO1 0.268182
LT 0.268198
SE6 0.268217
IE9 0.268230

Do you know for what UA2 stands for or even who that is?

[Äike]

My results in the newest test:

2.3% North Sea
28.5% Finnish
0% Volga-Ural
53.6% Baltic
15.6% Western-European

[Pallantides]

Do you know for what UA2 stands for or even who that is?

I think it's Ukraine.

[Aino]

My parents' scores with Apricians:

FI8
3 FI6 (Don Draper) 0.265808 (Hello cousin Don! :D)
18 EE2 (Jäärapää) 0.26862
143 NO2 (Pallantides) 0.270636
181 UK20 (Osweo) 0.27089
183 NO8 (Olavsson) 0.27092
405 CA21 (Acadian Driftwood) 0.272625
415 SAEU1 (Loki) 0.272698


FI9
17 FI6 (Don Draper) 0.268355
43 EE2 (Jäärapää) 0.269859
51 NO2 (Pallantides) 0.270268
66 CA21 (Acadian Driftwood) 0.270616
102 UK20 (Osweo) 0.271206
179 SAEU1 (Loki) 0.272049
243 NO8 (Olavsson) 0.27248

[Franz]

I am CA21


Hi Franz, would you mind posting my individual results as well? :)

CA21.zip (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8616&stc=1&d=1303618988)
NO8.zip (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8617&stc=1&d=1303618988)

[Pallantides]

IBS scores by country

AA

Yoruba 0,26538
MANDENKA 0,26662
Bantu_S,W, 0,26713
Bantu_S,E, 0,26763
Bantu_N,E, 0,26824
Maasai 0,27423
EthiopiaOr 0,28056
ET 0,28475
EthiopiaTi 0,28522
SA 0,286160

AJ

GR 0,27202
IT 0,27259
TSI 0,27261
SJ 0,27281
CY 0,27287
N-ITALIAN 0,27294
SARDINIAN 0,27308
AM 0,27313
ES 0,27328
ASY 0,27330

ASY

AM 0,27140
GE 0,27168
CY 0,27173
GR 0,27197
GEJ 0,27243
IT 0,27248
TSI 0,27289
IQJ 0,27302
UZJ 0,27310
TR 0,27315


DE

LT 0,26931
SE 0,26934
UK 0,26944
PL 0,26946
BY 0,26952
EE 0,26955
NO 0,26959
DK 0,26991
IE 0,26993
HU 0,27004

DK

SE 0,26921
UK 0,26927
NO 0,26929
LT 0,26984
DE 0,26991
Orcadian 0,27014
IE 0,27015
FR 0,27030
BY 0,27031
EE 0,27037

EE

LT 0,26734
BY 0,26781
PL 0,26865
FI 0,26901
RU 0,26925
SE 0,26931
NO 0,26952
DE 0,26955
NRU 0,26957
UK 0,26975

ES

BASQUE 0,27041
FR 0,27074
UK 0,27076
SARDINIAN 0,27089
DE 0,27098
IE 0,27101
N-ITALIAN 0,27108
TSI 0,27117
HU 0,27131
DK 0,27135

FI


EE 0,26901
LT 0,26997
BY 0,27051
SE 0,27053
NO 0,27059
NRU 0,27070
RU 0,27083
PL 0,27085
UK 0,27121
DE 0,27133

FR


UK 0,26991
IE 0,27010
DE 0,27014
DK 0,27030
NO 0,27044
SE 0,27052
PL 0,27061
HU 0,27064
Orcadian 0,27066
LT 0,27067

IE

UK 0,26898
NO 0,26939
Orcadian 0,26953
SE 0,26968
LT 0,26969
DE 0,26977
EE 0,26997
FR 0,27001
BY 0,27003
DK 0,2700815

IT

GR 0,27077
TSI 0,27119
SaRDINIAN 0,27145
N1-ITALIAN 0,27151
ES 0,27173
CY 0,27187
FR 0,27190
DE 0,27194
UK 0,27213
HU 0,27216



NO

SE 0,26904
UK 0,26919
DK 0,26929
LT 0,26937
IE 0,26951
EE 0,26952
DE 0,26959
Orcadian 0,26974
PL 0,26979
BY 0,26992

NRU

LT 0,26928
EE 0,26957
BY 0,26967
RU 0,27002
PL 0,27017
FI 0,27070
NO 0,27088
SE 0,27093
DE 0,27096
UK 0,27121

PL

LT 0,26809
BY 0,26844
EE 0,26865
DE 0,26946
RU 0,26949
SE 0,26974
NO 0,26979
HU 0,26980
UK 0,26990
NRU 0,27017

PT

UK 0,271365
FR 0,271421
ES 0,271429
BASQUE 0,271507
SARDINIAN 0,27156
DE 0,27164
N-ITALIAN 0,27186
TSI 0,27189
IE 0,27191
GR 0,27204

RU


LT 0,26850
BY 0,26902
EE 0,26904
PL 0,26942
NRU 0,26990
SE 0,27029
DE 0,27031
NO 0,27037
HU 0,27046

SE

NO 0,26904
DK 0,26921
LT 0,26929
EE 0,26931
DE 0,26934
UK 0,26942
PL 0,26974
BY 0,26977
IE 0,26978
Orcadian 0,27002

SJ

GR 0,27241
IT 0,27279
AJ 0,27281
CY 0,27284
TSI 0,27295
SARDINIAN 0,27306
ASY 0,27322
N-ITALIAN 0,27330
AM 0,27332
ES 0,27367

TR

GE 0,27286
AM 0,27297
GR 0,27298
ASY 0,27315
CY 0,27351
IT 0,27369
Adygei 0,27375
TSI 0,27385
Lezgin 0,27428
GEJ 0,27430

UK

IE 0,26913
NO 0,26919
DK 0,26927
SE 0,26942
DE 0,26944
LT 0,26959
Orcadian 0,26968
EE 0,26975
PL 0,26990
FR 0,26991

US

UK 0,26958
IE 0,26986
NO 0,26988
DE 0,26989
SE 0,26999
DK 0,27001
LT 0,27015
EE 0,27025
PL 0,27026
Orcadian 0,27027

[quotablepatella]

0% Red/Finnish
4.5% Yellow/Baltic
15.7% Green/Western European
3.8% Blue/Volga-Ural
76.4% Purple/North Atlantic

[alzo zero]

IT

GR 0,27077
TSI 0,27119
SaRDINIAN 0,27145
N1-ITALIAN 0,27151
ES 0,27173
CY 0,27187
FR 0,27190
DE 0,27194
UK 0,27213
HU 0,27216
Most IT's in Eurogenes are from Sicily and the South so that is not an accurate national average.

[Franz]

Most IT's in Eurogenes are from Sicily and the South so that is not an accurate national average.

It appears his IT average is coming from samples with the IDs of IT that submitted their data. I don’t know where they’re all from, but many are from the south. There are 26 of them, and that’s a lot compared to only seven Germans. It looks it excludes the reference data of the Tuscans (TSI) and North Italians. The fact that IT shows closer to Greek probably means you’re right, and that they’re mostly from the south. I know most of the Germans are from the northern and/or eastern parts, and that can’t represent the average German which explains the Polish at 0.26946.

[Efim45]

My K=5 results:
0% Finnish
21.9% Western European
29.8% Southern Baltic
33.6% North Russian
14.7% North Sea

[Sikeliot]

PT

UK 0,271365
FR 0,271421
ES 0,271429
BASQUE 0,271507
SARDINIAN 0,27156
DE 0,27164
N-ITALIAN 0,27186
TSI 0,27189
IE 0,27191
GR 0,27204



Closer to Brits than to Spaniards?? :lol:

[Agrippa]

A new analysis about "Asian" genetic ancestry in Northern Europeans:

http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/05/asian-genetic-ancestry-in-northern.html

http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/6180/mdsoriginal.png


Key: AM = Armenia, AT = Austria, BE = Belgium, BY = Belarus, DE = Germany, DK = Denmark, EE = Estonia, FI = Finland, GE = Georgia, IE = Ireland, IR = Iran, KZ = Kazakhstan, LT = Lithuania, NL = Netherlands, NO = Norway, PL = Poland, RU = Russia, SE = Sweden, TR = Turkey, UA = Ukraine, UK = United Kingdom, UZ = Uzbekistan.

I think it is worth to note that Central Asia has a significant Europid component, largely with Eastern European and West Asian relations.

So that some Russians go towards Central Asia is to me less of a secure marker for a Mongoloid tendency, than the tendency towards North East and North Asia.

[Osweo]

So that some Russians go towards Central Asia is to me less of a secure marker for a Mongoloid tendency, than the tendency towards North East and North Asia.

Aye, the pull being to the pre-mongoloid substratum (Iranian-speaking) that is found in metis there with Turkic and Mongol elements.

Somebody needs to go and test the peasants around places like Alaincourt and Sermoiselles (Alans and Sarmatians) in France, to see if any peculiar R1a haplogroups pop up there, far from their home on the Steppes. ;)

[d3cimat3d]

http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/6180/mdsoriginal.png


Why is the gap between west Asians & north Europeans so big in Polako's MDS plot? I always thought the two were very close to eachother.

Like this:

http://i56.tinypic.com/640xl5.jpg
http://i52.tinypic.com/97uyde.jpg

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o21/Kadu_album/West_Central_Eurasia.png

[Franz]

Why is the gap between west Asians & north Europeans so big in Polako's MDS plot? I always thought the two were very close to eachother.

You did not read the plots' scales.

[Franz]

http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/6180/mdsoriginal.png


To make sense of the axes, here I graphically edited for equalized axes aspect ratio to 1:1. Scaling algorithm does something to the grid lines, but the relative position of the points are correct.

http://i.imgur.com/3GIIz.png

[poiuytrewq0987]

Haven't done this test yet, where do I get started?

[Äike]

A new analysis about "Asian" genetic ancestry in Northern Europeans:

http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/05/asian-genetic-ancestry-in-northern.html

http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/6180/mdsoriginal.png



I think it is worth to note that Central Asia has a significant Europid component, largely with Eastern European and West Asian relations.

So that some Russians go towards Central Asia is to me less of a secure marker for a Mongoloid tendency, than the tendency towards North East and North Asia.

At the same time, I have to point out that Northern-Asia/Siberia has a significant Europid component through the Finno-Ugric expansion into Northern-Asia/Siberia (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/69/qsqowo.jpg/), from Europe. This is visible in their genetic heritage even now, thus Finns pull towards North-Asia because of 2 reasons: 1. North-Asians have ancient European/Finno-Ugric ancestry. 2. Some Finns have Saami, thus Samoyedic, thus Siberian ancestry.

[Agrippa]

At the same time, I have to point out that Northern-Asia/Siberia has a significant Europid component through the Finno-Ugric expansion into Northern-Asia/Siberia (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/69/qsqowo.jpg/), from Europe. This is visible in their genetic heritage even now, thus Finns pull towards North-Asia because of 2 reasons: 1. North-Asians have ancient European/Finno-Ugric ancestry. 2. Some Finns have Saami, thus Samoyedic, thus Siberian ancestry.

I don't believe in the "Finno-Ugrians from Europe" tale, yet this is not even so important for that question, since languages and migrations are worse to reconstruct than genetic and racial relationships, which can be proven objectively now.

Sibirids (aboriginal Northern Asians) are considered a transitional racial type or even better group, spectrum of variants which have at least Proto-Europoid elements even as far as the North East of Asia actually.

Yet if you compare Lithuanians, which have about ass much "old European" in their genome, it is clear that the Finns are drawn to the Sibiroid populations because of the Mongoloid contribution and not the other way around.

Sure, if you compare the Sibiroids with the Tungus people without Europid admixture (even most Mongols have slight Europoid admixture), they too are closer to Europeans relatively speaking.

But as I said, especially the Lithuanian vs. Finnish comparison makes the case clear and what we see on this graph is primarily the Finnish deviation towards the Sibiroids.

Would be great to have some Lapps and some other Samoyedic than Nganasans as well as Tungid populations for comparison.

[Äike]

I don't believe in the "Finno-Ugrians from Europe" tale, yet this is not even so important for that question, since languages and migrations are worse to reconstruct than genetic and racial relationships, which can be proven objectively now.

The main theory, accepted by every linguist/scientist is that the Uralics/Finno-Ugrians originate from Eastern-Europe, the Volga river region and expanded from there.

If you disagree with that, then you're saying that we came from modern-day southern-Ukraine (http://www.wiik.fi/kalevi/images/kartta1.gif) and are the native Upper Paleolithic people of most of Europe.


Sibirids (aboriginal Northern Asians) are considered a transitional racial type or even better group of variants which have at least Proto-Europoid elements even as far as the North East actually.

Yet if you compare Lithuanians, which have as much or even more "old European" in their genome, it is clear that the Finns are drawn to the Sibiroid populations because of the Mongoloid contribution and not the other way around.

Sure, if you compare the Sibiroids with the Tungus people without Europid admixture (even most Mongols have slight Europoid admixture), they too are closer to Europeans relatively speaking.

But as I said, especially the Lithuanian vs. Finnish comparison makes the case clear and what we see on this graph is primarily the Finnish deviation towards the Sibiroids.

You are making assumptions by Polako's "one-man" amateurish works. This extremist thinks that the Indo-Europeans are the native people of Finland and predate the Finno-Ugrians.

Every professional genetic research, which is usually done by dozens of scientists, says that the Finns resemble the Upper Paleolithic Europeans the most(genetically and anthropologically).

[Agrippa]

You are making assumptions by Polako's "one-man" amateurish works. This extremist thinks that the Indo-Europeans are the native people of Finland and predate the Finno-Ugrians.

Every professional genetic research, which is usually done by dozens of scientists, says that the Finns resemble the Upper Paleolithic Europeans the most(genetically and anthropologically).

In all studies, not just that of Polako - Finns deviate strongly from most other Europeans and so so in a Sibiroid direction.

You might sugarcoat this fact this or that way, but fact is, Finns AND Lithuanians have a very strong "old European component", but Finns have more Sibiroid influences and Lithuanians more Neolithic.

Now even if percentage wise Finns would have very slightly more of the "old European component", Lithuanians would be still closer to them because the Neolithic-Southern component is closer related to "old European" than Sibiroid.

Even a very minor Sibiroid contribution will result in a stronger deviation.

That is like comparing one who is quarter Sicilian with one who is one eighth Negrid. The admixture in the quarter Sicilian might be higher percentage wise, but since the Sicilian component is much closer to North Eastern European than Negrid, the deviation in the Negrid admixed one eighth person will still be larger...

So it is with Finns, principally, which is why Lithuanians are better for being used as an example for "old European", even if saying the Neolithic and later coming Indo-European components are stronger in them.

[Äike]

In all studies, not just that of Polako - Finns deviate strongly from most other Europeans and so so in a Sibiroid direction.

You might sugarcoat this fact this or that way, but fact is, Finns AND Lithuanians have a very strong "old European component", but Finns have more Sibiroid influences and Lithuanians more Neolithic.

Now even if percentage wise Finns would have very slightly more of the "old European component", Lithuanians would be still closer to them because the Neolithic-Southern component is closer related to "old European" than Sibiroid.

Even a very minor Sibiroid contribution will result in a stronger deviation.

That is like comparing one who is quarter Sicilian with one who is one eighth Negrid. The admixture in the quarter Sicilian might be higher percentage wise, but since the Sicilian component is much closer to North Eastern European than Negrid, the deviation in the Negrid admixed one eighth person will still be larger...

So it is with Finns, principally, which is why Lithuanians are better for being used as an example for "old European", even if saying the Neolithic and later coming Indo-European components are stronger in them.

Finns went through a bottle-neck at one point, that's why they deviate so much.

Finns are a genetic isolate. It could be said that all other Europeans have Finnish(native Upper Paleolithic) genes but Finns don't have all the genes(Neolithic) found in other Europeans.

Still, Finns are more native European than any other group. For example, Haplogroup U5 is estimated to be the oldest mtDNA haplogroup in Europe and is found in the whole of Europe at a low frequency, but seems to be found in significantly higher levels among Finns, Estonians and the Sami.

Anthropology:
Of modern nationalities, Finns are closest to Cro-Magnons in terms of anthropological measurements.

and now to the crypto-Finnics. Lithuanians are something like Finnic+some Baltic/Indo-European/Neolithic.

Don't be fooled by Polako's researches, that call the Lithuanians just "Baltic". The Finno-Ugric/Finnic genes dominate in the Lithuanians and at best they're a Finnic-Baltic mix, while in reality they're more Finnic than anything else. Of course they have a lot of "old European" genes, if they don't have much Indo-European/Neolithic/Middle-Eastern influence. Lithuanians are the second most FinN1C Europeans. The "old European" background in them is explained by the native Finnic populations that they have assimilated during their expansion into our part of Europe.

[Agrippa]

Well, the detectable Sibiroid might have been increased by isolation and genetic drift too, but it had to be introduced in any case and was not indigenous nor part of the "old European component".

[Loki]

Polako's new K=4 and K=5 results (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/05/genetic-substructures-across-northern_13.html), this time with Americans included as well.

Me:

K=4
Southern + Western European: 45.4%
North Sea: 39.2%
Baltic: 5.4%
Finnish: 9.9%

K=5
Finnish: 9.7%
Southern + Western European: 39.3%
East European: 12.3%
Southern Baltic: 4.4%
North Sea: 34.2%

====================================
National averages, worked out by Day Tripper on ABF:

K=4 AVERAGES

BY
Southern + Western European: 14.1%
North Sea: 8.9%
Baltic: 75.8%
Finnish: 1.1%

CA
Southern + Western European: 34.3%
North Sea: 57.0%
Baltic: 6.1%
Finnish: 2.6%

DE
Southern + Western European: 30.9%
North Sea: 45.1%
Baltic: 22.4%
Finnish: 1.5%

DK
Southern + Western European: 20.3%
North Sea: 69.3%
Baltic: 3.7%
Finnish: 6.7%

EE
Southern + Western European: 1.9%
North Sea: 21.7%
Baltic: 51.6%
Finnish: 24.9%

ES
Southern + Western European: 90.6%
North Sea: 5.6%
Baltic: 2.2%
Finnish: 1.6%

FI
Southern + Western European: 2.3%
North Sea: 14.3%
Baltic: 6.7%
Finnish: 76.6%

FR
Southern + Western European: 57.6%
North Sea: 33.4%
Baltic: 6.1%
Finnish: 2.9%

HU
Southern + Western European: 40.0%
North Sea: 19.9%
Baltic: 35.5%
Finnish: 4.6%

IE
Southern + Western European: 24.2%
North Sea: 70.6%
Baltic: 4.5%
Finnish: 0.7%

LT
Southern + Western European: 1.8%
North Sea: 13.7%
Baltic: 83.9%
Finnish: 0.6%

NL
Southern + Western European: 19.0%
North Sea: 71.7%
Baltic: 2.6%
Finnish: 6.7%

NO
Southern + Western European: 1.7%
North Sea: 81.3%
Baltic: 7.1%
Finnish: 10.0%

North_Russian
Southern + Western European: 5.2%
North Sea: 2.7%
Baltic: 59.4%
Finnish: 32.7%

PL
Southern + Western European: 18.2%
North Sea: 21.9%
Baltic: 58.5%
Finnish: 1.4%

RU
Southern + Western European: 12.1%
North Sea: 8.6%
Baltic: 63.8%
Finnish: 15.4%

SE
Southern + Western European: 7.0%
North Sea: 63.9%
Baltic: 10.2%
Finnish: 18.9%

UA
Southern + Western European: 17.1%
North Sea: 14.5%
Baltic: 60.5%
Finnish: 7.9%

UK
Southern + Western European: 26.3%
North Sea: 67.9%
Baltic: 3.3%
Finnish: 2.6%

US
Southern + Western European: 31.5%
North Sea: 57.0%
Baltic: 8.2%
Finnish: 3.4%

K=5 AVERAGES

BY
Finnish: 0.5%
Southern + Western European: 9.1%
East European: 37.2%
Southern Baltic: 49.5%
North Sea: 3.6%

CA
Finnish: 3.2%
Southern + Western European: 27.7%
East European: 6.8%
Southern Baltic: 12.5%
North Sea: 49.8%

DE
Finnish: 1.7%
Southern + Western European: 24.3%
East European: 19.3%
Southern Baltic: 16.2%
North Sea: 38.4%

DK
Finnish: 7.7%
Southern + Western European: 15.2%
East European: 9.3%
Southern Baltic: 8.6%
North Sea: 59.2%

EE
Finnish: 26.3%
Southern + Western European: 2.6%
East European: 14.4%
Southern Baltic: 46.2%
North Sea: 10.5%

ES
Finnish: 2.2%
Southern + Western European: 84.2%
East European: 5.3%
Southern Baltic: 3.3%
North Sea: 4.9%

FI
Finnish: 74.4%
Southern + Western European: 2.1%
East European: 6.4%
Southern Baltic: 6.0%
North Sea: 11.2%

FR
Finnish: 2.8%
Southern + Western European: 50.8%
East European: 9.6%
Southern Baltic: 8.4%
North Sea: 28.4%

HU
Finnish: 4.7%
Southern + Western European: 36.2%
East European: 19.0%
Southern Baltic: 26.6%
North Sea: 13.4%

IE
Finnish: 1.1%
Southern + Western European: 15.6%
East European: 11.3%
Southern Baltic: 9.1%
North Sea: 63.0%

LT
Finnish: 0.7%
Southern + Western European: 0.7%
East European: 14.9%
Southern Baltic: 82.2%
North Sea: 1.5%

NL
Finnish: 6.3%
Southern + Western European: 10.3%
East European: 17.6%
Southern Baltic: 0.6%
North Sea: 65.1%

NO
Finnish: 10.1%
Southern + Western European: 0.2%
East European: 17.0%
Southern Baltic: 6.0%
North Sea: 66.8%

North_Russian
Finnish: 23.7%
Southern + Western European: 1.2%
East European: 64.5%
Southern Baltic: 9.2%
North Sea: 1.4%

PL
Finnish: 1.0%
Southern + Western European: 14.0%
East European: 33.5%
Southern Baltic: 36.6%
North Sea: 14.9%

RU
Finnish: 10.2%
Southern + Western European: 7.0%
East European: 49.2%
Southern Baltic: 28.5%
North Sea: 5.1%

SE
Finnish: 19.9%
Southern + Western European: 3.6%
East European: 9.9%
Southern Baltic: 12.8%
North Sea: 53.7%

UA
Finnish: 6.8%
Southern + Western European: 14.2%
East European: 33.2%
Southern Baltic: 38.5%
North Sea: 7.3%

UK
Finnish: 3.7%
Southern + Western European: 19.1%
East European: 7.6%
Southern Baltic: 9.7%
North Sea: 60.0%

US
Finnish: 3.8%
Southern + Western European: 24.8%
East European: 10.4%
Southern Baltic: 11.6%
North Sea: 49.3%

[Äike]

Well, the detectable Sibiroid might have been increased by isolation and genetic drift too, but it had to be introduced in any case and was not indigenous nor part of the "old European component".

"old European"/Finno-Ugric ancestry among the Siberians has raised the Finns' affinity with them.

+Saami(they have Samoyedic ancestry) ancestry in some rare cases has also raised this affinity.


Polako's new K=4 and K=5 results (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/05/genetic-substructures-across-northern_13.html), this time with Americans included as well.

My K4:

4.7% Southern + Western-European(previous researches have shown that it's just Western-European and I don't have any Southern-European)
22.6% North Sea
48% Baltic/southern-Finnic
25.6% Finnish



EE
Southern + Western European: 1.9%
North Sea: 21.7%
Baltic: 51.6%
Finnish: 24.9%

This other Estonian in the research has always scored 0% Western-European, my Western-European score has raised the Estonian average(there are only 2 participants)

[Agrippa]

"old European"/Finno-Ugric ancestry among the Siberians has raised the Finns' affinity with them.

Erm, that doesn't work out and is some sort of distorted logic if looking at the facts.

Because the "old European" is present in other Europeans too, only the specifically Sibiroid component is higher in Finns.

[Äike]

Erm, that doesn't work out and is some sort of distorted logic if looking at the facts.

Because the "old European" is present in other Europeans too, only the specifically Sibiroid component is higher in Finns.

As I said, it's rather explained by the European/Finno-Ugric component in the "Sibiroids".

[Agrippa]

As I said, it's rather explained by the European/Finno-Ugric component in the "Sibiroids".

And why doesn't that show up as much in the "converted Finno-Ugrians" (your words more or less) like the Lithuanians and being highest among those most Mongoloid influenced even among Finns?

This Sibiroid component is shown in all tests as coming from outside and the opposite is a general Proto-Europoid and Europid component in Sibiroids, which is not even as much related to Finns alone...

[Äike]

And why doesn't that show up as much in the "converted Finno-Ugrians" (your words more or less) like the Lithuanians and being highest among those most Mongoloid influenced even among Finns?

Most Mongoloid influence, lol what a term.

The ancestral population of the Finns was European, but they have acquired considerably more exotic ancestry than the rest of the Northern-Europeans. One thing being the Saami constantly being pushed north and assimilated and the 2nd thing is the Komi(strongly Siberian influenced) influence in eastern-Finland(not certain about, but recently read about), the Komis have many Veps loanwords in their language and vice-versa and traveling by the river ways wasn't hard.

The point being, the ancestral population of the Finns was European. Many factors rise their "exotic ancestry", like bottle-necks, Finno-ugric/Europid ancestry in Siberia, the Saamis and so on.

You have a point about the southern-Finnic populations lacking in this "exotic ancestry", when compared to the Finns. But we didn't have the Saami, nor contacts with people like the Komi.

By the way, you can find "North-Asian" segments even among the Lithuanians. This is caused by a common ancestry with the Siberians, I already told you about the Europid/Finno-Ugric expansion into Asia. Knowing who you are, you should be happy about the Europids dominating non-Europid ethnicities. But instead, you're critical about the genetic mark that the Finno-Ugrians left into Siberia. :p

The chauvinistic ignorance towards the Finns has had a bad result since the 19th century and it was started by the Swedes.

[Agrippa]

I know the Baltics have the component too, just on a lower level, but funnily this component is stronger everywhere Mongoliform/Mongoloid influences are typologically stronger too, like the higher the Lappid or Eastbaltid racial component is.

I'm pretty sure this Sibiroids were the original bearers of the Finno-Ugric tongue and some were just Indo-Europeanised by Northern Germanics, Balts and Slavs, resulting in this component being present in those also, like the Lappid-Eastbaltid racial element as well.

[Äike]

I know the Baltics have the component too, just on a lower level, but funnily this component is stronger everywhere Mongoliform/Mongoloid influences are typologically stronger too, like the higher the Lappid or Eastbaltid racial component is.

The Lithuanians are very heavily N1c, are they also very Lappid and East-Baltid? I know that Estonia doesn't have those SNPA East-Baltids, except the Setos, who are the most borealized, as they live in the coldest region of Estonia.


I'm pretty sure this Sibiroids were the original bearers of the Finno-Ugric tongue and some were just Indo-Europeanised by Northern Germanics, Balts and Slavs, resulting in this component being present in those also, like the Lappid-Eastbaltid racial element as well.

Do you also dress 19th century style? Or are just your posts from the 19th century?

If there would be anything Indo-European in the Scandinavians and Northern-Europeans in general, then they wouldn't be so... Northern-European

[Agrippa]

The Lithuanians are very heavily N1c, are they also very Lappid and East-Baltid?

In comparison to lets say Germans, French and Danes with a much lower percentage of Eastbaltid-Lappid: Yes.

In comparison to Northern Russians and Northern Finns, they are less influenced...


I know that Estonia doesn't have those SNPA East-Baltids, except the Setos, who are the most borealized, as they live in the coldest region of Estonia.

Estonia has it, but like in Balts, it is a smaller segment of the population. It is actually not even dominant in Finns, but just stronger there - like the Sibiroid component being weak as well in the North East of Europe.

Strong it is in the Samoyedic and other people and you know how they look like - actually it is the opposite pattern:

Finno-Ugrians and related people with Uralic influences are overwhelmingly Europid with minor Mongoloid, the Sibiroid people are the exact opposite: Overwhelmingly Mongolid with minor Europoid, with the Europoid being stronger in certain local populations and individuals anyway than Mongolid even in Lappids.


If there would be anything Indo-European in the Scandinavians and Northern-Europeans in general, then they wouldn't be so... Northern-European

That's your idea, but the Neolithic and Central-Eastern European influence is clear in them.

The last K-12 analysis if Dienekes was great to prove my point as well, just look at how close NW is to West Asian and the Southern European components:
http://dodecad.blogspot.com/2011/04/k12-admixture-results-for-selected.html

[Äike]

In comparison to lets say Germans, French and Danes with a much lower percentage of Eastbaltid-Lappid: Yes.

In comparison to Northern Russians and Northern Finns, they are less influenced...

Estonia has it, but like in Balts, it is a smaller segment of the population. It is actually not even dominant in Finns, but just stronger there - like the Sibiroid component being weak as well in the North East of Europe.

As I said, I haven't seen those SNPA east-baltids here.


Strong it is in the Samoyedic and other people and you know how they look like - actually it is the opposite pattern:

Finno-Ugrians and related people with Uralic influences are overwhelmingly Europid with minor Mongoloid, the Sibiroid people are the exact opposite: Overwhelmingly Mongolid with minor Europoid, with the Europoid being stronger in certain local populations and individuals anyway than Mongolid even in Lappids.

Do I have to make hundreds of threads about certain Finno-Ugrians, just like Pallantides did about the Saami, for you to change your biased and chauvinistic opinion?


That's your idea, but the Neolithic and Central-Eastern European influence is clear in them.

The last K-12 analysis if Dienekes was great to prove my point as well, just look at how close NW is to West Asian and the Southern European components:
http://dodecad.blogspot.com/2011/04/k12-admixture-results-for-selected.html

But they don't look like South-Eastern Europeans, the most Indo-European Europeans.

[Agrippa]

As I said, I haven't seen those SNPA east-baltids here.

If it is easy to spot them by random pictures from the internet, I can just wonder.


Do I have to make hundreds of threads about certain Finno-Ugrians, just like Pallantides did about the Saami, for you to change your biased and chauvinistic opinion?

What exactly do you mean? I consider Southern Finns to be strongly Nordid and Estonians beilng more Nordoid-Westbaltid and both being rather progressive too. The Eastbaltid is noticeable only as a minority element in most regions and the Mongoloid admixture very low - so low that without selection for Borealised traits which came with it it wouldn't even be noticeable.


But they don't look like South-Eastern Europeans, the most Indo-European Europeans.

First of all, who is most Indo-European is disputed and secondly, they are closer to them than to Osteuropids with morphological traits.

[Rochefaton]

My results:

K = 4

Southwest Euro = 21.18%
North Sea = 70.02%
Baltic = 4.4%
Finnuit = 4.4%

K = 5

Finnuit = 6.2%
Southwest Euro = 16.14%
East Euro = 7.1%
S. Baltic = 11.62%
North Sea = 57.8%

[Graham]

My score next to the UK average, North sea scores high.

K = 4

Southern + Western European: 17.3% (26.3%)
North Sea: 79.52% (67.9%)
Baltic: 0% (3.3%)
Finnish: 3.35% (2.6%)
----------------
K = 5

Finnish: 6% (3.7%)
Southern + Western European: 10.2% (19.1%)
East European: 1.77% (7.6%)
Southern Baltic: 11.28% (9.7%)
North Sea: 70.74% (60.0%)

[Efim45]

My K=4 results:
Southern+Western European: 27.72%
North Sea: 10.31%
Baltic: 52.33%
Finnish: 9.64%

K=5:
Finnish: 4.55%
Southern+Western European: 20.78%
East European: 46.12%
Southern Baltic: 19.75%
Northwest European: 8.8%

[Pallantides]

Me(NO2)

K=4

Red(Southern+Western European) 0%
Green(North Sea) 86.67%
Aqua(Baltic) 1.42%
Purple(Finnish) 11.89%

K=5

Red(Finnish) 13.59%
Yellow(Southern+Western European) 0%
Green(East European) 13.18%
Blue(Southern Baltic) 3.18%
Purple(Northwest European) 70.06%

http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/9717/ne5o.jpg

[Äike]

What exactly do you mean? I consider Southern Finns to be strongly Nordid and Estonians beilng more Nordoid-Westbaltid and both being rather progressive too. The Eastbaltid is noticeable only as a minority element in most regions and the Mongoloid admixture very low - so low that without selection for Borealised traits which came with it it wouldn't even be noticeable.

I wasn't talking about the Finns nor the Estonians. No sane person would think that there's anything mongoloid about the Estonians.

I was talking about the Udmurts for example, they look more Northern-European than most Germans and they have less foreign influence than the Saami does.


First of all, who is most Indo-European is disputed and secondly, they are closer to them than to Osteuropids with morphological traits.

Polako, the one-man leader of the Eurogenes Biogeographic Ancestry Project thinks that the Northern-Europeans are the purest Indo-Europeans, but in reality, we have the least Indo-European influence of all the Europeans.

Most probably, the Balkan region and its inhabitants are the purest Indo-Europeans in Europe.

[Äike]

I forgot to post my K=5 before, so here it is:

27.8% Finnish
5% Southern + Western European
8% East-European
47.7% Southern-Baltic/Southern-Finnic
11% North-West European

[Electronic God-Man]

K4

Southern and Western European: 29.36%
North Sea: 53.23%
Baltic: 12.11%
Finnish: 5.28%

K5

Finnish: 4.52%
Southern and Western Euro: 21.61%
East European: 17.18%
Southern Baltic: 9.40%
Northwest European: 47.27%

[Loki]

Here are the closest countries to me, K4 and K5 respectively, thanks to a guy called Day Tripper:

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9942&stc=1&d=1305476818

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=9943&stc=1&d=1305476818

[Pallantides]

Here are mine(thanks to Day Dripper from ABF):

K=4
http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/4858/pallantides1.jpg

K=5
http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/3493/pallantides2.jpg


*the shorter the bar the higher the similarity

[Loki]

Here are mine(thanks to Day Dripper from ABF):



You seem more Dutch than I am. :p

[Olavsson]

K=4:

(Roughly)

78.5% North Sea
21.5% Finnish
0% Southern + Western European
0% Baltic

K=5:

(Roughly)

63.3% North-Western European
23.3% Finnish
9.7% Southern Baltic
3.7% Eastern European
0% Southern + Western European

[Don Brick]

Oh yes, my results from the previous run.

K=4

Southern + western Europe 27 %
North sea 10.3 %
Baltic 15.5 %
Finnish 47.2 %

K=5

Finnish 44.5 %
Southern + western European 23.3 %
East European 20.9 %
Southern Baltic 1.9 %
Northwest European 9.5 %

Again thanks to Day Tripper, here are the similarity bars based on the results of this run. Not very telling of genetic affinity in reality, but fun. Once more smaller the bar, greater the similarity.

https://www.forumbiodiversity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=80985&d=1305501969

Very nice "pan-Uralic alliance" going on here with the first four bars due to the "Finnish" scores. :D

https://www.forumbiodiversity.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=80986&d=1305501969

For the most part very even in this one.

Also guys. Check it out. New results are in, this time without the Finnish cluster.

http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/05/genetic-substructures-across-northern_18.html

My results.

K=4

Southern + Western European 21.2 %
North Sea 25.7 %
Southern Baltic 13.9 %
Northeast European 39.2 %

K=5

North Atlantic 20.5 %
Southern Baltic 5.3 %
Southern + Western European 13.3 %
Northeast European 37.9 %
North Sea 22.9 %

[Olavsson]

Here's my latest results:

(Roughly)

K=4:

82.6% North Sea
17.4% North-east European
0% Southern Baltic
0% Southern + Western European

K=5:

61.7% North Sea
25.2% North Atlantic
13.1% North-east European
0% Southern Baltic
0% Southern + Western European

[Pallantides]

My results, NO2


K=4

Southern + Western European 0%
North Sea 87.58%
Southern Baltic 8.70%
Northeast European 3.70%

K=5

North Atlantic 43.67%
Southern Baltic 1.91%
Southern+Western European 0%
Northeast European 7.99%
North Sea 46.41%

[Rochefaton]

My new results, US5:

K=4

Southern + Western European 24.6%
North Sea 64.5%
Southern Baltic 3.6%
Northeast European 7.3%

K=5

North Atlantic 16.4%
Southern Baltic 2.4%
Southern+Western European 18.7%
Northeast European 1.7%
North Sea 60.8%

[Rochefaton]

These maps were posted by Day Tripper at ABF. They show the distribution of the clusters amongst select European nationalities. The first four are at K=4 and the last five are at K=5.

[Rochefaton]

Here are the average scores of project members by nationality. Thanks goes to Day Tripper @ ABF for these too.

K=4 AVERAGES

BY
Southern + Western European: 12.1%
North Sea: 2.3%
Southern Baltic: 74.5%
Northeast European: 11.1%

CA
Southern + Western European: 38.5%
North Sea: 50.3%
Southern Baltic: 9.0%
Northeast European: 2.1%

DE
Southern + Western European: 32.7%
North Sea: 38.8%
Southern Baltic: 23.7%
Northeast European: 4.8%

DK
Southern + Western European: 22.9%
North Sea: 63.0%
Southern Baltic: 7.9%
Northeast European: 6.1%

EE
Southern + Western European: 1.5%
North Sea: 21.6%
Southern Baltic: 55.9%
Northeast European: 21.0%

ES
Southern + Western European: 87.4%
North Sea: 5.6%
Southern Baltic: 3.6%
Northeast European: 3.4%

FI
Southern + Western European: 2.3%
North Sea: 38.5%
Southern Baltic: 9.7%
Northeast European: 49.4%

FR
Southern + Western European: 57.7%
North Sea: 30.0%
Southern Baltic: 7.5%
Northeast European: 4.8%

HU
Southern + Western European: 40.3%
North Sea: 14.6%
Southern Baltic: 33.6%
Northeast European: 11.5%

IE
Southern + Western European: 30.1%
North Sea: 61.1%
Southern Baltic: 6.5%
Northeast European: 2.3%

LT
Southern + Western European: 1.6%
North Sea: 0.8%
Southern Baltic: 95.3%
Northeast European: 2.4%

NL
Southern + Western European: 22.6%
North Sea: 67.1%
Southern Baltic: 4.8%
Northeast European: 5.5%

NO
Southern + Western European: 5.0%
North Sea: 77.5%
Southern Baltic: 7.6%
Northeast European: 10.0%

North_Russian
Southern + Western European: 3.7%
North Sea: 2.9%
Southern Baltic: 31.1%
Northeast European: 62.3%

PL
Southern + Western European: 20.6%
North Sea: 12.7%
Southern Baltic: 54.9%
Northeast European: 11.8%

RU
Southern + Western European: 11.9%
North Sea: 4.3%
Southern Baltic: 51.3%
Northeast European: 32.5%

SE
Southern + Western European: 7.9%
North Sea: 66.2%
Southern Baltic: 10.9%
Northeast European: 15.1%

UA
Southern + Western European: 18.2%
North Sea: 6.7%
Southern Baltic: 54.7%
Northeast European: 20.4%

UK
Southern + Western European: 30.0%
North Sea: 61.5%
Southern Baltic: 5.3%
Northeast European: 3.2%

US
Southern + Western European: 33.7%
North Sea: 52.2%
Southern Baltic: 9.5%
Northeast European: 4.5%

K=5 AVERAGES

BY
North Atlantic: 8.5%
Southern Baltic: 66.3%
Southern + Western European: 9.3%
Northeast European: 12.8%
North Sea: 3.0%

CA
North Atlantic: 49.1%
Southern Baltic: 6.0%
Southern + Western European: 19.7%
Northeast European: 1.9%
North Sea: 23.3%

DE
North Atlantic: 37.3%
Southern Baltic: 18.7%
Southern + Western European: 17.2%
Northeast European: 4.6%
North Sea: 22.1%

DK
North Atlantic: 35.1%
Southern Baltic: 5.6%
Southern + Western European: 12.1%
Northeast European: 3.9%
North Sea: 43.3%

EE
North Atlantic: 1.2%
Southern Baltic: 51.1%
Southern + Western European: 2.4%
Northeast European: 19.5%
North Sea: 25.9%

ES
North Atlantic: 20.4%
Southern Baltic: 1.5%
Southern + Western European: 72.4%
Northeast European: 0.9%
North Sea: 4.9%

FI
North Atlantic: 5.5%
Southern Baltic: 3.6%
Southern + Western European: 1.3%
Northeast European: 43.1%
North Sea: 46.5%

FR
North Atlantic: 31.7%
Southern Baltic: 5.1%
Southern + Western European: 42.7%
Northeast European: 3.0%
North Sea: 17.5%

HU
North Atlantic: 10.1%
Southern Baltic: 29.3%
Southern + Western European: 34.0%
Northeast European: 9.0%
North Sea: 17.7%

IE
North Atlantic: 53.8%
Southern Baltic: 3.1%
Southern + Western European: 11.3%
Northeast European: 2.0%
North Sea: 29.9%

LT
North Atlantic: 0%
Southern Baltic: 93.2%
Southern + Western European: 1.9%
Northeast European: 2.8%
North Sea: 2.1%

NL
North Atlantic: 50.8%
Southern Baltic: 0.2%
Southern + Western European: 4.7%
Northeast European: 5.0%
North Sea: 39.2%

NO
North Atlantic: 40.1%
Southern Baltic: 3.6%
Southern + Western European: 0%
Northeast European: 9.5%
North Sea: 46.8%

North_Russian
North Atlantic: 8.9%
Southern Baltic: 14.3%
Southern + Western European: 3.0%
Northeast European: 66.1%
North Sea: 7.7%

PL
North Atlantic: 18.1%
Southern Baltic: 47.8%
Southern + Western European: 12.7%
Northeast European: 12.2%
North Sea: 9.2%

RU
North Atlantic: 13.2%
Southern Baltic: 37.8%
Southern + Western European: 7.4%
Northeast European: 35.6%
North Sea: 5.9%

SE
North Atlantic: 22.4%
Southern Baltic: 7.4%
Southern + Western European: 4.0%
Northeast European: 11.6%
North Sea: 54.7%

UA
North Atlantic: 16.2%
Southern Baltic: 46.5%
Southern + Western European: 10.3%
Northeast European: 20.5%
North Sea: 6.5%

UK
North Atlantic: 43.3%
Southern Baltic: 2.8%
Southern + Western European: 15.1%
Northeast European: 1.6%
North Sea: 37.3%

US
North Atlantic: 37.3%
Southern Baltic: 6.7%
Southern + Western European: 20.0%
Northeast European: 2.9%
North Sea: 33.2%

My North Sea score is higher than the average of any nation at K=5 and only the Norwegians and Dutch average a higher North Sea score than me at K=4. My scores are way different than the Irish or British, yet that is who I cluster with at 23andMe. My scors are not exactly close to the US averages either. Strange.

[Efim45]

My part 3 results (RU19):
K=4
Southern+Western European: 27%
North Sea: 5.5%
Southern Baltic: 35.6%
Northeast European: 31.8%

K=5
North Atlantic: 21.8%
Southern Baltic: 26.2%
Southern+Western European: 18%
Northeast European: 33.7%
North Sea: .4%

[Barreldriver]

My results (I'm US83):

K = 4
Southern + Western European: 34.8374%
North Sea: 58.2542%
Baltic: 3.5321%
Finnish: 3.3762%

K = 5
Finnish: 4.6853%
Southern + Western European: 28.0649%
East European: 0.001%
Southern Baltic: 17.0369%
Northwest European: 50.2119%

k = 5 without Finns:

North Atlantic: 44.0187%
Southern Baltic: 7.444%
Southern + Western European: 21.1778%
Northeast European: 0.001%
Scandinavian: 27.3585%

[Electronic God-Man]

Southern and Western Euro - 31.73%
North Sea - 48.23%
Southern Baltic - 15.49%
Northeast Euro - 4.54%

----------------------------------------
North Atlantic - 41.96%
Southern Baltic - 12.1%
Southern and Western Euro - 16.56%
Northeast Euro -3.6%
Scandinavian - 25.75%

[Polako]

My North Sea score is higher than the average of any nation at K=5 and only the Norwegians and Dutch average a higher North Sea score than me at K=4. My scores are way different than the Irish or British, yet that is who I cluster with at 23andMe. My scors are not exactly close to the US averages either. Strange.

Aren't you part Fenno-Scandic?

In any case, on one map I cluster with the French at 23andMe, which, quite frankly, I found very offensive. But this was one of the main things that spurred me on to create this project. It's interesting how a negative can become a positive. :D

[Don Brick]

Aren't you part Fenno-Scandic?

In any case, on one map I cluster with the French at 23andMe, which, quite frankly, I found very offensive. But this was one of the main things that spurred me on to create this project. It's interesting how a negative can become a positive. :D

haha oh yes the 23andme clusters! Had forgotten about that completely. Btw, if you don´t mind explaining, how do you tell who you cluster with the most? I am found in the English, French, German and Norwegian clusters. The box closest to my location appears to be English. Should I go by that? Trivial, and hardly very accurate I´m sure, but I´m curious. :)

[Polako]

haha oh yes the 23andme clusters! Had forgotten about that completely. Btw, if you don´t mind explaining, how do you tell who you cluster with the most? I am found in the English, French, German and Norwegian clusters. The box closest to my location appears to be English. Should I go by that? Trivial, and hardly very accurate I´m sure, but I´m curious. :)

There are actually four clusters on that North European map; Irish, Orcadian, generic North Euro, and Austrian.

Most people fall into the generic North Euro. It's not possible to split that up, since there are no seperate clusters created by the samples in that area, like the Germans, English, French, etc. They all overlap, sometimes completely. Also, the box concept makes no sense, since genetic clusters are rarely, if ever, boxes.

[poiuytrewq0987]

I'm RS1 but it doesn't seem my results are up yet.

[Polako]

^ I had some problems running the test you're in. There were some cryptic relatives in the dataset, who screwed things up.

[Loki]

My NEU5c:

North Atlantic - 15.92%
Southern Baltic - 0.00%
Southern and Western Euro - 40.91%
Northeast Euro -11.68%
Scandinavian - 31.49%

[Loki]

It's interesting that DKUS1 has the highest "Scandinavian" by far, at basically 100%.

[Polako]

^ It's not quite Scandinavian yet. I need more Swedish samples to get a proper Scandinaian cluster.

[Graham]

North Atlantic -56.88% (UK average 43.2%, IE average 53.8%)
Southern Baltic - 0% (UK average 2.8%, IE average 3.05%)
South and West Euro - 0.18% (UK average 15%, IE average 11.2%)
Northeast Euro -0% (UK average 1.5%, IE average 1.9%)
Scandinavian - 42.94% (UK average 37.2%, IE average 29.8%)

A good mix of scandinavian and North Atlantic :D. I quite like these results. The UK and Ireland look a wee bit more mixed.

[Rochefaton]

Aren't you part Fenno-Scandic?

Yes, sir. ;)

[Ibericus]

Brits and Irish are near 40% scandinavian, so much for being the pures Celts :D

[Pallantides]

"North Atlantic" and "Scandinavian" in Scandinavians

Danes

DK2 - North Atlantic : 8.19% Scandinavian : 66.02%
DK3 - North Atlantic : 42.40% Scandinavian : 39.12%
DK4 - North Atlantic : 54.82% Scandinavian : 24.75%

Norwegians

NO2 - North Atlantic : 43.67% Scandinavian : 46.41%
NO3 - North Atlantic : 24.05% Scandinavian : 67.09%
NO4 - North Atlantic : 34.89% Scandinavian : 54.4%
NO5 - North Atlantic : 44.82% Scandinavian : 42.24%
NO6 - North Atlantic : 40.81% Scandinavian : 42.22%
NO7 - North Atlantic : 56.46% Scandinavian : 18.24%
NO8 - North Atlantic : 25.22% Scandinavian : 61.64%
NO9 - North Atlantic : 51.15% Scandinavian : 41.81%

Swedish/Norwegian

SENO1 - North Atlantic : 19.67% Scandinavian : 74.47%
SENO2 - North Atlantic : 0% Scandinavian : 78.59%

Swedes

SE1 - North Atlantic : 24.82% Scandinavian : 48.39%
SE2 - North Atlantic : 56.25% Scandinavian : 25.96%
SE4 - North Atlantic : 0% Scandinavian : 62.09%
SE5 - North Atlantic : 0% Scandinavian : 83.21%
SE6 - North Atlantic : 27.15% Scandinavian : 50.61%
SE7 - North Atlantic : 22.84% Scandinavian : 39.85%
SE8 - North Atlantic : 35.56% Scandinavian : 59.57%
SE9 - North Atlantic : 27.66% Scandinavian : 31.97%
SE10 - North Atlantic : 6.85% Scandinavian : 90.31%

[Graham]

Brits and Irish are near 40% scandinavian, so much for being the pures Celts :D

Up here we had gaels of Norse heritage, we had Clan Donald, Clan MacLeod, Clan MacQueen, Clan MacAulay, Clan Gunn etc. Then Caithness Sutherland, Shetland, Orkney to the north. East lowlands will have scandinavian heritage also. Then you've got the Norman familys. So we're not pure :P

[Loki]

Well yes and eastern England also has considerable Danish input. And it is debatable as to whether the Danish is much different from the earlier Anglo-Saxon anyway.

[Don Brick]

My numbers from the latest K=5

North Atlantic - 20.5 %
Southern Baltic - 5.3 %
South + West European - 13.3 %
Northeast European - 37.9 %
Scandinavian 22.9 %

My "Scandinavian" is the lowest of all the Finns. ;) But look at my rather high South + West European and North Atlantic percentages. I am a Celt in the making! :D :eek: mwahaha

[poiuytrewq0987]

Just got an email from the guy


You're coming out 59% North/Central/East European, 1% Amerindian, 38% Southern European/Anatolian, and 0.6% East Eurasian. The error margin is 1%.

I'm not sure if that qualifies you for my North Euro analysis, but I might have a South Euro analysis soon.

[Pallantides]

My closest countries, from Day Tripper on ABF.

K=4
http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/6825/pallantidesk4.jpg

K=5
http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/853/pallantidesk5.jpg

*the shorter the bar the higher the similarity

[poiuytrewq0987]

I've attached your RHH analysis.

By the way, you're quite similar to some of the reference Hungarians, so I've put you in the next North Euro run. If you get coherent results, I'll leave you in.

:cry2

[Pallantides]

MDS plots based on the last K4 and K5 admixture runs by Day Tipper

K=4
http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/3980/k4overview.jpg

Myself(NO2) along with NO3, SE8 and SE10 make up our own little northern cluster (http://img850.imageshack.us/img850/6738/northj.jpg)

K=5
http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/7358/k5overview.jpg

[Pallantides]

Genetic substructures across Northern Europe, part 4 - ADMIXTURE and STRUCTURE runs back to back (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/05/genetic-substructures-across-northern_28.html)


My numbers:

NEU5d

Red(North Sea) - 44.24%
Yellow(Irish or North Atlantic) - 38.75%
Green(Baltic) - 8.17%
Blue(Southern+Western European - 0%
Purple North Russian 8.83%


NEU5d_str

Red - 6.8%
Yellow - 39%
Green(Northeast European) - 18.1%
Blue(Northwest European) 28%
Purple 8.1%

[Efim45]

My Part 4 ADMIXTURE results:
5.6 % North Sea
0.0% Irish or North Atlantic
29.3% Baltic
28.8% Southern+Western European
36.3% North Russian

[Barreldriver]

This is what I got on the last run:

Admixture -
North Sea: 22.0494%
North Atlantic: 45.7217%
Baltic: 8.5908%
South + West European: 23.2494%
North Russian: 0.3887%


Structure (anyone got a clue for the rest of the labels?) –
Red: 46.3%
Yellow: 11.3%
Green (Northeast Euro): 0.7%
Blue (Northwest Euro): 37.4%
Purple: 4.3%

[poiuytrewq0987]

I was included in the latest run as RS1 but I'm not sure how to read the spreadsheet?

[poiuytrewq0987]

After reading it over I think I get the gist of it.

Southern + Western European: 59%
Baltic: 32%
North Russian: 0.84%
North Sea: 0%
North Atlantic: 0%

Blue (Northwest): 31%
Green (Northeast): 22%
Purple: 23%
Yellow: 19%
Red: 0.35%

[Olavsson]

- NO8 -


NEU5d (roughly):

46.3% North Sea
35.1% Irish or North Atlantic
18.6% North Russian
0% Baltic
0% Southern + Western European

[Efim45]

So I take it he's finetuning the results and making them more accurate with each run, especially now the K=5 results much more tidier?

[Pallantides]

averages:

AU (N=2)
North Sea: 32.1%
Irish or North Atlantic: 57.6%
Baltic: 2.3%
Southern + Western European: 6.4%
North Russian: 1.7%

BY (N=9)
North Sea: 1.5%
Irish or North Atlantic: 5.1%
Baltic: 69.4%
Southern + Western European: 9.9%
North Russian: 14.1%

CA (N=11)
North Sea: 36.6%
Irish or North Atlantic: 33.0%
Baltic: 6.2%
Southern + Western European: 22.9%
North Russian: 1.2%

DE (N=10)
North Sea: 39.6%
Irish or North Atlantic: 14.9%
Baltic: 18.3%
Southern + Western European: 22.8%
North Russian: 4.4%

DK (N=3)
North Sea: 53.2%
Irish or North Atlantic: 23.5%
Baltic: 8.9%
Southern + Western European: 11.6%
North Russian: 2.8%

EE (N=2)
North Sea: 21.8%
Irish or North Atlantic: 2.9%
Baltic: 60.7%
Southern + Western European: 0%
North Russian: 14.6%

ES (N=26)
North Sea: 4.4%
Irish or North Atlantic: 11.4%
Baltic: 2.0%
Southern + Western European: 81.1%
North Russian: 1.1%

FI (N=4)
North Sea: 26.5%
Irish or North Atlantic: 11.5%
Baltic: 9.5%
Southern + Western European: 1.9%
North Russian: 42.5%

FR (N=31)
North Sea: 20.9%
Irish or North Atlantic: 23.8%
Baltic: 5.2%
Southern + Western European: 46.4%
North Russian: 3.6%

HU (N=17)
North Sea: 17.9%
Irish or North Atlantic: 6.8%
Baltic: 31.4%
Southern + Western European: 33.7%
North Russian: 10.3%

IE (N=13)
North Sea: 26.8%
Irish or North Atlantic: 60.1%
Baltic: 1.5%
Southern + Western European: 9.3%
North Russian: 2.3%

LT (N=10)
North Sea: 1.7%
Irish or North Atlantic: 1.5%
Baltic: 93.9%
Southern + Western European: 0.5%
North Russian: 2.4%

NL (N=4)
North Sea: 47.6%
Irish or North Atlantic: 23.9%
Baltic: 4.3%
Southern + Western European: 21.9%
North Russian: 2.2%

NO (N=8)
North Sea: 53.6%
Irish or North Atlantic: 30.8%
Baltic: 7.0%
Southern + Western European: 0%
North Russian: 8.5%

North_Russian (N=25)
North Sea: 4.0%
Irish or North Atlantic: 4.9%
Baltic: 10.0%
Southern + Western European: 1.6%
North Russian: 79.5%

PL (N=13)
North Sea: 12.1%
Irish or North Atlantic: 7.3%
Baltic: 50.7%
Southern + Western European: 14.4%
North Russian: 15.6%

RU (N=26)
North Sea: 3.7%
Irish or North Atlantic: 10.5%
Baltic: 36.8%
Southern + Western European: 7.8%
North Russian: 41.2%

SE (N=11)
North Sea: 63.5%
Irish or North Atlantic: 12.9%
Baltic: 11.1%
Southern + Western European: 1.2%
North Russian: 11.3%

UA (N=3)
North Sea: 5.7%
Irish or North Atlantic: 13.3%
Baltic: 47.6%
Southern + Western European: 10.8%
North Russian: 22.7%

UK (N=25)
North Sea: 45.5%
Irish or North Atlantic: 37.3%
Baltic: 3.2%
Southern + Western European: 12.3%
North Russian: 1.7%

US (N=131)
North Sea: 40.7%
Irish or North Atlantic: 29.8%
Baltic: 6.5%
Southern + Western European: 19.1%
North Russian: 3.9%

[Pallantides]

Another mds plot by Day Tipper from ABF:
http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/2743/sansmutts.png

[Barreldriver]

EDIT

Day Tripper plotted me on the new plot:

http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k438/ragnarok1227/US83Spot.jpg

[poiuytrewq0987]

Another mds plot by Day Tipper from ABF:
http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/2743/sansmutts.png

At least I'm appropriately Southern on that map. :lol:

[Loki]

Mine:

46.4% Southern + Western European
38.3% North Sea
15.3% North Russian
00.0% Irish or North Atlantic
00.0% Baltic

An odd mix, different from all other European mixes it seems. :confused:

[Pallantides]

Danes:

DK2

North Sea - 65.38%
Irish or North Atlantic - 16.58%
Baltic - 6.08%
Southern+Western European - 10.43%
North Russian - 1.51%

DK3

North Sea - 51.41%
Irish or North Atlantic - 24.94%
Baltic - 4.29%
Southern+Western European 12.55%
North Russian - 6.79%

DK4

North Sea - 42.76%
Irish or North Atlantic - 28.92%
Baltic - 16.46%
Southern+Western European 11.85%
North Russian 0%

Norwegians:

NO2

North Sea - 44.24%
Irish or North Atlantic - 38.75%
Baltic - 8.17%
Southern+Western European 0%
North Russian 8.83%

NO3

North Sea - 91.48%
Irish or North Atlantic - 0%
Baltic - 2.79%
Southern+Western European 0%
North Russian 5.72%

NO4

North Sea - 59.80%
Irish or North Atlantic - 29.61%
Baltic - 0%
Southern+Western European 0%
North Russian - 10.57%

NO5

North Sea - 52.62%
Irish or North Atlantic - 30.64%
Baltic - 3.98%
Southern+Western European 0%
North Russian 12.73%

NO6

North Sea - 44.26%
Irish or North Atlantic - 36.14%
Baltic - 15.92%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 3.67%

NO7

North Sea 37.70%
Irish or North Atlantic - 36.33%
Baltic - 17.82%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 8.13%

NO8

North Sea - 46.35%
Irish or North Atlantic - 35.08%
Baltic - 0%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 18.55%

NO9

North Sea - 52.59%
Irish or North Atlantic - 39.86%
Baltic - 7.54%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 0%

Swedes:

SE1

North Sea - 76.59%
Irish or North Atlantic - 0%
Baltic - 15.35%
Southern+Western European - 4.14%
North Russian 3.90%

SE2

North Sea - 47.80%
Irish or North Atlantic - 31.51%
Baltic - 7.79%
Southern+Western European 0%
North Russian - 12.88%

SE4

North Sea - 78.75%
Irish or North Atlantic - 0%
Baltic - 21.24%
Southern+Western European 0%
North Russian 0%

SE5

North Sea - 62.39
Irish or North Atlantic - 13.26%
Baltic - 7.19%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 17.13%

SE6

North Sea - 80.13%
Irish or North Atlantic - 0%
Baltic - 16.58%
Southern+Western European - 3.27%
North Russian - 0%

SE7

North Sea - 49.68%
Irish or North Atlantic - 19.93%
Baltic - 8.15%
Southern+Western European - 3.25%
North Russian - 18.96%

SE8

North Sea - 97.42%
Irish or North Atlantic - 0%
Baltic - 2.56%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 0%

SE9

North Sea - 47.89%
Irish or North Atlantic - 6.93%
Baltic - 8.28%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 36.88%

SE10

North Sea - 59.83%
Irish or North Atlantic - 26.46%
Baltic - 7.58%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 6.11%

SE11

North Sea - 62.85%
Irish or North Atlantic - 10.96%
Baltic - 18.47%
Southern+Western European - 3.02%
North Russian - 4.68%

SE12

North Sea - 34.61%
Irish or North Atlantic - 32.96%
Baltic - 9.02%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 23.39%

Mixed Individuals:

SENO1

North Sea - 75.23%
Irish or North Atlantic - 16.96%
Baltic - 1.64%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 6.14%

SENO2

North Sea - 93.17%
Irish or North Atlantic - 0%
Baltic - 0%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 6.82%

IENO1

North Sea - 44.34%
Irish or North Atlantic - 43.40%
Baltic - 8.46%
Southern+Western European - 3.78%
North Russian - 0%

DKUK1

North Sea - 67.29%
Irish or North Atlantic - 22.20%
Baltic - 0%
Southern+Western European - 3.57%
North Russian - 6.93%

DKUK2

North Sea - 50.25%
Irish or North Atlantic - 23.21%
Baltic - 10.77%
Southern+Western European - 15.75%
North Russian - 0%

DENO1

North Sea - 48.65%
Irish or North Atlantic - 29.17%
Baltic - 28.92
Southern+Western European - 18.43%
North Russian - 0.8%

NOUK1

North Sea - 72.62%
Irish or North Atlantic - 0%
Baltic - 4.30%
Southern+Western European - 14.98%
North Russian - 8.08%

EESE1

North Sea - 38.71%
Irish or North Atlantic - 8.48%
Baltic - 23.76%
Southern+Western European - 0%
North Russian - 29.04%

[Olavsson]

I see that most of the Swedes have got higher 'North Sea' than the Norwegians... I hope this doesn't mean they are more Nordic than us. :tongue

[Pallantides]

Average scores from highest to lowest.

North Sea

SE - 63.5%
NO - 53.6%
DK - 53.2%
NL - 47.6%
UK - 45.5%
US - 40.7%
DE - 39.6%
CA - 36.6%
AU - 32.1%
IE - 26.8%
FI - 26.5%
EE - 21.8%
FR - 20.9%
HU - 17.9%
PL - 12.1%
UA - 5.7%
ES - 4.4%
North_Russian - 4.0%
RU - 3.7%
LT - 1.7%
BY - 1.5%

Irish or North Atlantic

IE - 60.1%
AU - 57.6%
UK - 37.3%
CA - 33.0%
NO - 30.8%
US - 29.8%
NL - 23.9%
FR - 23.8%
DK - 23.5%
DE - 14.9%
UA - 13.3%
SE - 12.9%
FI - 11.5%
ES - 11.4%
RU - 10.5%
PL - 7.3%
HU - 6.8%
BY - 5.1%
North_Russian - 4.9%
EE - 2.9%
LT - 1.5%

Baltic


LT - 93.9%
BY - 69.4%
EE - 60.7%
PL - 50.7%
UA - 47.6%
RU - 36.8%
HU - 31.4%
DE - 18.3%
SE - 11.1%
North_Russoian - 10.0%
FI - 9.5%
DK - 8.9%
NO - 7.0%
US - 6.5%
CA - 6.2%
FR - 5.2%
NL - 4.3%
UK - 3.2%
AU - 2.3%
ES - 2.0%
IE - 1.5%

Southern+Western European

ES - 81.1%
FR - 46.4%
HU - 33.7%
CA - 22.9%
DE - 22.8%
NL - 21.9%
US 19.1%
PL - 14.4%
UK - 12.3%
DK - 11.6%
UA - 10.8%
BY - 9.9%
IE - 9.3%
RU - 7.8%
AU - 6.4%
FI - 1.9%
North_Russian - 1.6%
SE - 1.2%
LT - 0.5%
EE - 0%
NO - 0%

North Russian

North_Russian - 79.5%
FI - 42.5%
RU - 41.2%
UA - 22.7%
PL - 15.6%
EE - 14.6%
BY - 14.1%
SE - 11.3%
HU - 10.3%
NO - 8.5%
DE - 4.4%
US - 3.9%
FR - 3.6%
DK - 2.8%
LT - 2.4%
IE - 2.3%
NL - 2.2%
UK - 1.7%
AU - 1.7%
CA - 1.2%
ES - 1.1%

[Loki]

Average scores from highest to lowest.

North Sea

SE - 63.5%
NO - 53.6%
DK - 53.2%
NL - 47.6%
UK - 45.5%
US - 40.7%
DE - 39.6%
Loki - 38.3%
CA - 36.6%
AU - 32.1%
IE - 26.8%
FI - 26.5%
EE - 21.8%
FR - 20.9%
HU - 17.9%
PL - 12.1%
UA - 5.7%
ES - 4.4%
North_Russian - 4.0%
RU - 3.7%
LT - 1.7%
BY - 1.5%

Irish or North Atlantic

IE - 60.1%
AU - 57.6%
UK - 37.3%
CA - 33.0%
NO - 30.8%
US - 29.8%
NL - 23.9%
FR - 23.8%
DK - 23.5%
DE - 14.9%
UA - 13.3%
SE - 12.9%
FI - 11.5%
ES - 11.4%
RU - 10.5%
PL - 7.3%
HU - 6.8%
BY - 5.1%
North_Russian - 4.9%
EE - 2.9%
LT - 1.5%
Loki - 0.0%

Baltic


LT - 93.9%
BY - 69.4%
EE - 60.7%
PL - 50.7%
UA - 47.6%
RU - 36.8%
HU - 31.4%
DE - 18.3%
SE - 11.1%
North_Russoian - 10.0%
FI - 9.5%
DK - 8.9%
NO - 7.0%
US - 6.5%
CA - 6.2%
FR - 5.2%
NL - 4.3%
UK - 3.2%
AU - 2.3%
ES - 2.0%
IE - 1.5%
Loki - 0.0%

Southern+Western European

ES - 81.1%
FR - 46.4%
Loki - 46.4%
HU - 33.7%
CA - 22.9%
DE - 22.8%
NL - 21.9%
US 19.1%
PL - 14.4%
UK - 12.3%
DK - 11.6%
UA - 10.8%
BY - 9.9%
IE - 9.3%
RU - 7.8%
AU - 6.4%
FI - 1.9%
North_Russian - 1.6%
SE - 1.2%
LT - 0.5%
EE - 0%
NO - 0%

North Russian

North_Russian - 79.5%
FI - 42.5%
RU - 41.2%
UA - 22.7%
PL - 15.6%
Loki - 15.3%
EE - 14.6%
BY - 14.1%
SE - 11.3%
HU - 10.3%
NO - 8.5%
DE - 4.4%
US - 3.9%
FR - 3.6%
DK - 2.8%
LT - 2.4%
IE - 2.3%
NL - 2.2%
UK - 1.7%
AU - 1.7%
CA - 1.2%
ES - 1.1%

^^ Fixed it for ya. :D

[poiuytrewq0987]

^^ Fixed it for ya. :D

Pssh, if I added myself to that averages list, I'd be 2nd highest S+W Euro... :P

[Pallantides]

Good idea


Average scores from highest to lowest.

North Sea

SE - 63.5%
NO - 53.6%
DK - 53.2%
NL - 47.6%
UK - 45.5%
Pallantides - 44.2%
US - 40.7%
DE - 39.6%
CA - 36.6%
AU - 32.1%
IE - 26.8%
FI - 26.5%
EE - 21.8%
FR - 20.9%
HU - 17.9%
PL - 12.1%
UA - 5.7%
ES - 4.4%
North_Russian - 4.0%
RU - 3.7%
LT - 1.7%
BY - 1.5%

Irish or North Atlantic

IE - 60.1%
AU - 57.6%
Pallantides - 38.7%
UK - 37.3%
CA - 33.0%
NO - 30.8%
US - 29.8%
NL - 23.9%
FR - 23.8%
DK - 23.5%
DE - 14.9%
UA - 13.3%
SE - 12.9%
FI - 11.5%
ES - 11.4%
RU - 10.5%
PL - 7.3%
HU - 6.8%
BY - 5.1%
North_Russian - 4.9%
EE - 2.9%
LT - 1.5%

Baltic


LT - 93.9%
BY - 69.4%
EE - 60.7%
PL - 50.7%
UA - 47.6%
RU - 36.8%
HU - 31.4%
DE - 18.3%
SE - 11.1%
North_Russian - 10.0%
FI - 9.5%
DK - 8.9%
Pallantides - 8.2%
NO - 7.0%
US - 6.5%
CA - 6.2%
FR - 5.2%
NL - 4.3%
UK - 3.2%
AU - 2.3%
ES - 2.0%
IE - 1.5%

Southern+Western European

ES - 81.1%
FR - 46.4%
HU - 33.7%
CA - 22.9%
DE - 22.8%
NL - 21.9%
US 19.1%
PL - 14.4%
UK - 12.3%
DK - 11.6%
UA - 10.8%
BY - 9.9%
IE - 9.3%
RU - 7.8%
AU - 6.4%
FI - 1.9%
North_Russian - 1.6%
SE - 1.2%
LT - 0.5%
EE - 0%
NO - 0%
Pallantides - 0%

North Russian

North_Russian - 79.5%
FI - 42.5%
RU - 41.2%
UA - 22.7%
PL - 15.6%
EE - 14.6%
BY - 14.1%
SE - 11.3%
HU - 10.3%
Pallantides - 8.8%
NO - 8.5%
DE - 4.4%
US - 3.9%
FR - 3.6%
DK - 2.8%
LT - 2.4%
IE - 2.3%
NL - 2.2%
UK - 1.7%
AU - 1.7%
CA - 1.2%
ES - 1.1%

[Efim45]

Average scores from highest to lowest.

North Sea

SE - 63.5%
NO - 53.6%
DK - 53.2%
NL - 47.6%
UK - 45.5%
US - 40.7%
DE - 39.6%
CA - 36.6%
AU - 32.1%
IE - 26.8%
FI - 26.5%
EE - 21.8%
FR - 20.9%
HU - 17.9%
PL - 12.1%
UA - 5.7%
Efim45 - 5.6%
ES - 4.4%
North_Russian - 4.0%
RU - 3.7%
LT - 1.7%
BY - 1.5%

Irish or North Atlantic

IE - 60.1%
AU - 57.6%
UK - 37.3%
CA - 33.0%
NO - 30.8%
US - 29.8%
NL - 23.9%
FR - 23.8%
DK - 23.5%
DE - 14.9%
UA - 13.3%
SE - 12.9%
FI - 11.5%
ES - 11.4%
RU - 10.5%
PL - 7.3%
HU - 6.8%
BY - 5.1%
North_Russian - 4.9%
EE - 2.9%
LT - 1.5%
Efim45 - 0.0%

Baltic


LT - 93.9%
BY - 69.4%
EE - 60.7%
PL - 50.7%
UA - 47.6%
RU - 36.8%
HU - 31.4%
Efim45 - 29.3%
DE - 18.3%
SE - 11.1%
North_Russoian - 10.0%
FI - 9.5%
DK - 8.9%
NO - 7.0%
US - 6.5%
CA - 6.2%
FR - 5.2%
NL - 4.3%
UK - 3.2%
AU - 2.3%
ES - 2.0%
IE - 1.5%

Southern+Western European

ES - 81.1%
FR - 46.4%
HU - 33.7%
Efim45 - 28.8%
CA - 22.9%
DE - 22.8%
NL - 21.9%
US 19.1%
PL - 14.4%
UK - 12.3%
DK - 11.6%
UA - 10.8%
BY - 9.9%
IE - 9.3%
RU - 7.8%
AU - 6.4%
FI - 1.9%
North_Russian - 1.6%
SE - 1.2%
LT - 0.5%
EE - 0%
NO - 0%

North Russian

North_Russian - 79.5%
FI - 42.5%
RU - 41.2%
Efim45 - 36.3%
UA - 22.7%
PL - 15.6%
EE - 14.6%
BY - 14.1%
SE - 11.3%
HU - 10.3%
NO - 8.5%
DE - 4.4%
US - 3.9%
FR - 3.6%
DK - 2.8%
LT - 2.4%
IE - 2.3%
NL - 2.2%
UK - 1.7%
AU - 1.7%
CA - 1.2%
ES - 1.1%

[Olavsson]

Well, I guess I'll do the same:


Average scores from highest to lowest.

North Sea

SE - 63.5%
NO - 53.6%
DK - 53.2%
NL - 47.6%
Olavsson - 46.3%
UK - 45.5%
US - 40.7%
DE - 39.6%
CA - 36.6%
AU - 32.1%
IE - 26.8%
FI - 26.5%
EE - 21.8%
FR - 20.9%
HU - 17.9%
PL - 12.1%
UA - 5.7%
ES - 4.4%
North_Russian - 4.0%
RU - 3.7%
LT - 1.7%
BY - 1.5%

Irish or North Atlantic

IE - 60.1%
AU - 57.6%
UK - 37.3%
Olavsson - 35.1%
CA - 33.0%
NO - 30.8%
US - 29.8%
NL - 23.9%
FR - 23.8%
DK - 23.5%
DE - 14.9%
UA - 13.3%
SE - 12.9%
FI - 11.5%
ES - 11.4%
RU - 10.5%
PL - 7.3%
HU - 6.8%
BY - 5.1%
North_Russian - 4.9%
EE - 2.9%
LT - 1.5%

Baltic


LT - 93.9%
BY - 69.4%
EE - 60.7%
PL - 50.7%
UA - 47.6%
RU - 36.8%
HU - 31.4%
DE - 18.3%
SE - 11.1%
North_Russian - 10.0%
FI - 9.5%
DK - 8.9%
NO - 7.0%
US - 6.5%
CA - 6.2%
FR - 5.2%
NL - 4.3%
UK - 3.2%
AU - 2.3%
ES - 2.0%
IE - 1.5%
Olavsson - 0%

Southern+Western European

ES - 81.1%
FR - 46.4%
HU - 33.7%
CA - 22.9%
DE - 22.8%
NL - 21.9%
US 19.1%
PL - 14.4%
UK - 12.3%
DK - 11.6%
UA - 10.8%
BY - 9.9%
IE - 9.3%
RU - 7.8%
AU - 6.4%
FI - 1.9%
North_Russian - 1.6%
SE - 1.2%
LT - 0.5%
EE - 0%
NO - 0%
Olavsson - 0%

North Russian

North_Russian - 79.5%
FI - 42.5%
RU - 41.2%
UA - 22.7%
Olavsson - 18.6%
PL - 15.6%
EE - 14.6%
BY - 14.1%
SE - 11.3%
HU - 10.3%
NO - 8.5%
DE - 4.4%
US - 3.9%
FR - 3.6%
DK - 2.8%
LT - 2.4%
IE - 2.3%
NL - 2.2%
UK - 1.7%
AU - 1.7%
CA - 1.2%
ES - 1.1%


My 'North Russian' score is quite high, just like my 'Finnish' score was in some of the previous runs. I wonder where I got this from?
Maybe I've got some actual Finnish ancestry some generations ago.

[Pallantides]

My 'North Russian' score is quite high, just like my 'Finnish' score was in some of the previous runs. I wonder where I got this from?
Maybe I've got some actual Finnish ancestry some generations ago.

Maybe it's from the Forest Finns?




My paternal family supposedly have some Forest Finn ancestry, but seeing as my 'North Russian' is pretty simillar to the Norwegian average, I'm not so sure.

[Olavsson]

Maybe it's from the Forest Finns?

Yeah, why not. I don't know about any ancestry like that, but then I'm not a genealogical expert either.



My paternal family supposedly have some Forest Finn ancestry, but seeing as my 'North Russian' is pretty simillar to the Norwegian average, I'm not so sure.

Most of it might perhaps have been outbred in you?

[Rochefaton]

Here are my new scores:

North Sea: 58.5%
North Atlantic: 22.3%
Baltic: 4.0%
South/Western Euro: 15.2%
North Russian 0%

It looks like I am more Nordic than some of the Nordics. :lol:

[Agrippa]

One could even tend, if this would point to an ancestral component, to say that North Sea is closest to Nordeuropid (= Nordid, Dalofaelid) phenotypically.

Also interesting if looking at the genetic distances of the components:

http://img861.imageshack.us/img861/4028/k5d.png

North Sea is about as close to all the other components, including Southern-Western European, but "Irish"/North Western.

North Sea is, like the North Western component in Dienekes analysis, closer to all others.

I would say that this could point to the fact the Northern Europeans are to a large extend the result of different immigration waves, with an older, ancestral component being present too, which can be associated with the fringes of the North West (here) and North East (Dienekes-Dodecad).

I'm pretty sure one could split up the North in one component which is closer to the rest of Europe and very close to West Asia and another one which is the "fringe party", which preserved the pre-Neolithic variation better.

Also interesting how close West Asian is to North European in Dienekes new "Zombie analysis":
http://dodecad.blogspot.com/2011/05/how-to-create-zombies-from-admixture.html

In his K-12 analysis he "North Western" was equidistant from most other European components too, like "North Sea" here, with the biggest gap to "North Eastern", which was more like a representative of the "Northern Mesolithic" in his run I guess.

I think both are here on something, but in the end the Northern component should split up, if really finding an ancestral component, into a Mesolithic-old and a Migration-new component before anything else and that would make perfect sense.

Now the component in which the "old European" (in Dienekes run North Eastern, here "Irish") falls seems to be be drawn away from the rest, while the "mixed bag"/new Northern is very close/equi-distant to the rest - and the used populations might just distort that in a way, still.

But probably I'm just over-interpreting things, will be interesting to see further results...

[poiuytrewq0987]

Genetic substructures across Southern Europe - preliminary ADMIXTURE runs (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/05/genetic-substructures-across-southern.html)

SEU2a

North/Central/East European: 72%
Mediterranean: 27%

SEU3a

Southeast/Anatolian: 24%
North/Central/East European: 57%
Mediterranean: 18%

[Loki]

I was also included in this run.

SEU2a

North/Central/East European: 90.5%
Mediterranean: 9.5%

SEU3a

Southeast/Anatolian: 4.0%
North/Central/East European: 47.7%
Mediterranean: 48.3%

I seem most close to the French in these runs, unsurprisingly.

http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/9285/se1j.jpg

[Electronic God-Man]

North Sea - 29.54%
Irish or North Atlantic - 40.6%
Baltic - 11.76%
S + W Euro - 14.37%
North Russian - 3.71%

:)

[Olavsson]

Ok, folks. It's time for new Northern European runs, and I'm posting my results as always...
Let's begin with:

Genetic substructures across Northern Europe, part 5 - new samples + synthetic Northern Europeans (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/06/genetic-substructures-across-northern.html) from yesterday.

- NO8 -

46.4586% North Sea
36.4228% North Atlantic
17.1165% Northeast European
0.00001% Baltic
0.00001% Southern + Western European


Genetic substructures across Northern Europe, part 6 - supervised test (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/06/genetic-substructures-across-northern_04.html)
from today:

- NO8 -

53.0564% North Sea
34.311 % North Atlantic
12.6306% Northeast European
0.00001% Baltic
0.00001% Southern + Western European

[Efim45]

Part 5 results:
4.74% North Sea
0.00% North Atlantic
29.54% Baltic
36.52% Northeast European
29.20% Southern+Western European

part 6-supervised test results:
20.86% North Sea
6.23% North Atlantic
22.72% Baltic
27.54% Northeast European
22.66% Southern+Western European
-----------------
Personally, I think the last few runs are more in line with my actual ancestry than this last run.

[poiuytrewq0987]

Genetic substructures across Northern Europe, part 5 - new samples + synthetic Northern European (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/06/genetic-substructures-across-northern.html)

Southern + Western European: 59%
Northeast European: 7%
Baltic: 32%

Genetic substructures across Northern Europe, part 6 - supervised test (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/06/genetic-substructures-across-northern_04.html)

North Sea: 18%
North Atlantic: 6%
Baltic: 24%
Northeast European: 4%
Southern + Western European: 46%

[Barreldriver]

My results:

From the run done on June 3 -
North Sea: 18.9278%
North Atlantic: 49.3703%
Baltic: 8.4765%
Northeast European: 0.001%
Southern+Western European: 23.2244%

From the run done on June 4 (supervised run) -
North Sea: 31.2317%
North Atlantic: 44.1342%
Baltic: 5.4629%
Northeast European: 0.001%
Southern+Western European: 19.1701%

My North Sea score almost doubled in the supervised run.

[Oreka Bailoak]

I stuck my data into here. I'm about 1/4 German DE and 3/4 UK.
(well to be more exact that's 1/8 southern German, 1/8 northern German, 5% French, and about 10% Irish, Scottish & Welsh. Rest should be English)

This is the test...

Genetic substructures across Northern Europe, part 4 - ADMIXTURE and STRUCTURE runs back to back


I highlighted my two largest ancestries and myself.


Average scores from highest to lowest.

North Sea

SE - 63.5%
NO - 53.6%
DK - 53.2%
NL - 47.6%
UK - 45.5%
US - 40.7%
DE - 39.6%
CA - 36.6%
AU - 32.1%
Oreka- 32.0376%
IE - 26.8%
FI - 26.5%
EE - 21.8%
FR - 20.9%
HU - 17.9%
PL - 12.1%
UA - 5.7%
ES - 4.4%
North_Russian - 4.0%
RU - 3.7%
LT - 1.7%
BY - 1.5%

Irish or North Atlantic

IE - 60.1%
AU - 57.6%
UK - 37.3%
CA - 33.0%
NO - 30.8%
US - 29.8%
Oreka- 26.9288%
NL - 23.9%
FR - 23.8%
DK - 23.5%
DE - 14.9%
UA - 13.3%
SE - 12.9%
FI - 11.5%
ES - 11.4%
RU - 10.5%
PL - 7.3%
HU - 6.8%
BY - 5.1%
North_Russian - 4.9%
EE - 2.9%
LT - 1.5%

Baltic


LT - 93.9%
BY - 69.4%
EE - 60.7%
PL - 50.7%
UA - 47.6%
RU - 36.8%
HU - 31.4%
DE - 18.3%
Oreka- 16.1397%
SE - 11.1%
North_Russoian - 10.0%
FI - 9.5%
DK - 8.9%
NO - 7.0%
US - 6.5%
CA - 6.2%
FR - 5.2%
NL - 4.3%
UK - 3.2%
AU - 2.3%
ES - 2.0%
IE - 1.5%

Southern+Western European

ES - 81.1%
FR - 46.4%
HU - 33.7%
Oreka- 24.893%
CA - 22.9%
DE - 22.8%
NL - 21.9%
US 19.1%
PL - 14.4%
UK - 12.3%
DK - 11.6%
UA - 10.8%
BY - 9.9%
IE - 9.3%
RU - 7.8%
AU - 6.4%
FI - 1.9%
North_Russian - 1.6%
SE - 1.2%
LT - 0.5%
EE - 0%
NO - 0%

North Russian

North_Russian - 79.5%
FI - 42.5%
RU - 41.2%
UA - 22.7%
PL - 15.6%
EE - 14.6%
BY - 14.1%
SE - 11.3%
HU - 10.3%
NO - 8.5%
DE - 4.4%
US - 3.9%
FR - 3.6%
DK - 2.8%
LT - 2.4%
IE - 2.3%
NL - 2.2%
UK - 1.7%
AU - 1.7%
CA - 1.2%
ES - 1.1%
Oreka- .000001%



Test 4
North Sea 0.320376
Irish/North Atlantic 0.269288
Baltic 0.161397
Southern Western Europe 0.24893
North Russian 0.00001


Test 5
North Sea 0.312288
North Atlantic 0.277219
Baltic 0.159039
North East European 0.00001
Southern Western Europe 0.251444


Test 6
North Sea 0.41264
North Atlantic 0.274561
Baltic 0.095036
North East European 0.00001
Southern Western Europe 0.217753


On test 6 the supervised run, my North Sea shot up 10%, Baltic went down 6%, and south western Euro went down 4%. This is closest to my actual ancestry of all the tests so far.
I wonder what the national averages are for test 6?

[Imperivm]

Test 5-

North Sea = 32%
North Atlantic = 34%
Baltic = 7%
Northeast European = 0%
Southern + Western European = 27%

Test 6-

North Sea = 41%
North Atlantic = 33%
Baltic = 3%
Northeast European = 0%
Southern + Western European = 23%

BALTIC!

*slits wrists*

[Rochefaton]

Here are my results through the supervised run:

North Sea: 61.7%
North Atlantic: 22.0%
Baltic: 1.1%
NorthEast Euro: 0%
South/West Euro 15.3%

[Loki]

Supervised run:

42.4% North Sea
37.9% Southern & Western European
10.0% North Atlantic
09.6% Northeast European
00.0% Baltic

[Pallantides]

NEU5e:

North Sea - 42.17%
North Atlantic 40.62%
Baltic - 9.37%
Northeast European - 7.82%
Southern+Western European - 0%

NEU5f:

North Sea - 49.87%
North Atlantic - 37.71%
Baltic - 7.09%
Northeast European - 5.31%
Southern+Western European - 0%

[Don Brick]

NEU5e

North Sea - 18%
North Atlantic - 28.8%
Baltic - 4%
Northeast - 43.6%
South and West Euro - 5.6%

NEU5f

North Sea - 30.7%
North Atlantic - 28.6%
Baltic - 2.5%
Northeast Europe - 33.3%
South+West Europe - 4.9%

[Loki]

Large MDS plot (http://img405.imageshack.us/img405/7592/loadedmds.png) with everyone included (from DayTripper ABF).

My particular position (SAEU1):

http://img809.imageshack.us/img809/3529/plotlp.jpg

Pretty Frenchie eh??

[Pallantides]

My position:
http://img546.imageshack.us/img546/2276/myposition.png

[Olavsson]

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/1508/11111111122222222223333.jpg

[poiuytrewq0987]

http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/5125/plotmap.png

[poiuytrewq0987]

NEU5e:

North Sea - 42.17%
North Atlantic 40.62%
Baltic - 9.37%
Northeast European - 7.82%
Southern+Western European - 0%

NEU5f:

North Sea - 49.87%
North Atlantic - 37.71%
Baltic - 7.09%
Northeast European - 5.31%
Southern+Western European - 0%

Which test do you think is more accurate?

[Electronic God-Man]

Run 6

North Sea: 39.25%
North Atlantic: 40.61
Baltic: 6.52%
NE Euro: .43%
S + W Euro: 13.16%

:)

[Polako]

There's a huge update coming later today (or early tomorrow, depending when this thing stops running).

New clusters. Ultra-fine resolution. African + Asian admix figures included...yeeha.

[Polako]

Here's the first part of the update...

Genetic substructures across Northern Europe - with Asian and African references (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/06/genetic-substructures-across-northern_09.html)

[poiuytrewq0987]

Genetic substructures across Northern Europe - with Asian and African references (http://bga101.blogspot.com/2011/06/genetic-substructures-across-northern_09.html)

North + Central European = 0%
North + East Eurasian = 0.1%
South + West European = 64.5%
North Atlantic = 0%
Sub-Saharan = 0%
Baltic = 34.2%

It looks like E3b Balkanoid carriers aren't niggers/chinks after all! :wohoo:

[Olavsson]

Here's my results from the latest run by Polako:

- NO8 -

(Roughly)

63% North + Central European
25% North Atlantic
11% Baltic
1% North + East Eurasian
0% South + West European
0% Sub-Saharan

[Polako]

Those scores look pretty solid.

Keep in mind, the names are given by me, and need not correspond to the previous clusters with the same names. Basically, the program draws the borders between these closely related components wherever it feels the need in a given run, and that might differ between runs.

[Pallantides]

North+Central European - 50.74%
North Atlantic - 37.59%
Baltic - 11.10%
North+East Eurasian - 0.55%
South+West European - 0%
Sub-Saharan - 0%

[Barreldriver]

These are the scores for my ID:

North+Central Euro: 25.6423%
North+East Eurasian: 0.001%
South+West Euro: 22.9867%
North Atlantic: 47.183%
Sub-Saharan African: 0.001%
Baltic: 4.1861%

[Electronic God-Man]

N + C European: 40.86%
N + E Eurasian: 0%
S + W European: 19.92%
North Atlantic: 28.19%
SS African: 0%
Baltic: 11.01%

[BeerBaron]

What is an average stat for Norwegians?

[Efim45]

9.8% North+Central European
3.4% North+East Eurasian(2.0% on McDonald's)
30.2% South+West European(Probably Ashkenazi)
4.8% North Atlantic
0.0% Sub-Saharan(FUCK YEAH! I ain't no porchmonkey)
51.9% Baltic(My daddy looks Baltic)

[Pallantides]

What is an average stat for Norwegians?

The average based on the results from the 9 Norwegian participants:

North+Central European - 59.0%
North Atlantic - 31.7%
Baltic - 8.9%
North+East Eurasian - 0.4%
South+West European - 0%
Sub-Saharan - 0%

[Pallantides]

NEU6g averages by Day Tipper on ABF:

AU (N=2)
North + Central European: 24.3%
North + East Eurasian: 0%
South + West European: 4.4%
North Atlantic: 69.6%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 1.7%

BY (N=9)
North + Central European: 3.4%
North + East Eurasian: 0.2%
South + West European: 13.8%
North Atlantic: 13.6%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 69.1%

CA (N=11)
North + Central European: 30.6%
North + East Eurasian: 0.1%
South + West European: 21.2%
North Atlantic: 44.5%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 3.6%

DE (N=11)
North + Central European: 28.5%
North + East Eurasian: 0.1%
South + West European: 20.0%
North Atlantic: 34.9%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 16.5%

DK (N=3)
North + Central European: 50.4%
North + East Eurasian: 0%
South + West European: 11.6%
North Atlantic: 31.2%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 6.9%

EE (N=2)
North + Central European: 9.9%
North + East Eurasian: 0.4%
South + West European: 0%
North Atlantic: 27.0%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 62.7%

ES (N=26)
North + Central European: 3.5%
North + East Eurasian: 0.1%
South + West European: 75.4%
North Atlantic: 20.2%
Sub-Saharan: 0.3%
Baltic: 0.5%

FI (N=4)
North + Central European: 38.8%
North + East Eurasian: 4.0%
South + West European: 0.5%
North Atlantic: 11.0%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 45.6%

FR (N=32)
North + Central European: 23.1%
North + East Eurasian: 0.1%
South + West European: 45.9%
North Atlantic: 26.9%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 4.0%

HU (N=17)
North + Central European: 13.4%
North + East Eurasian: 0.8%
South + West European: 32.1%
North Atlantic: 20.9%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 32.7%

IE (N=14)
North + Central European: 36.8%
North + East Eurasian: 0%
South + West European: 11.0%
North Atlantic: 50.8%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 1.4%

LT (N=10)
North + Central European: 8.3%
North + East Eurasian: 0%
South + West European: 2.7%
North Atlantic: 10.3%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 78.6%

NL (N=5)
North + Central European: 44.2%
North + East Eurasian: 0.1%
South + West European: 19.1%
North Atlantic: 34.0%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 2.6%

NO (N=9)
North + Central European: 59.0%
North + East Eurasian: 0.4%
South + West European: 0%
North Atlantic: 31.7%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 8.9%

North_Russian
North + Central European: 14.9%
North + East Eurasian: 6.6%
South + West European: 1.8%
North Atlantic: 9.5%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 67.3%

PL (N=13)
North + Central European: 12.8%
North + East Eurasian: 0%
South + West European: 15.6%
North Atlantic: 16.5%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 55.0%

RS (N=2)
North + Central European: 12.6%
North + East Eurasian: 0.6%
South + West European: 57.1%
North Atlantic: 0%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 29.6%

RU (N=24)
North + Central European: 11.0%
North + East Eurasian: 3.4%
South + West European: 7.5%
North Atlantic: 15.2%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 62.9%

SE (N=14)
North + Central European: 58.2%
North + East Eurasian: 0.4%
South + West European: 1.7%
North Atlantic: 25.9%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 13.8%

UA (N=2)
North + Central European: 11.2%
North + East Eurasian: 0.2%
South + West European: 13.2%
North Atlantic: 16.1%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 59.3%

UK (N=29)
North + Central European: 42.7%
North + East Eurasian: 0%
South + West European: 14.4%
North Atlantic: 41.0%
Sub-Saharan: 0%
Baltic: 1.9%

US (N=131)
North + Central European: 38.4%
North + East Eurasian: 0.2%
South + West European: 18.7%
North Atlantic: 37.3%
Sub-Saharan: 0.1%
Baltic: 5.5%

[Rochefaton]

Here are my new results:

North+Central European - 44.3%
North Atlantic - 42.0%
Baltic - 0.5%
North+East Eurasian - 0%
South+West European - 13.2%
Sub-Saharan - 0%

[Loki]

0.0% Sub-Saharan(FUCK YEAH! I ain't no porchmonkey)


http://picture.funnycorner.net/funny-pictures/5679/Porch-monkey.jpg

Me:


40.75% South + West European
38.70% North + Central European
09.60% North Atlantic
07.68% Baltic

96.73% Total European

02.18% Sub-Saharan
01.09% North + East Eurasian

[Rochefaton]

I have attached a chart of my most similar ethnicities from this run. Day Tripper from ABF made this for me because he is a nice guy. :)

I'm more similar to the Brits and the Dutch than I am to my fellow Amurkins. Interesting. BTW, can anyone tell me if "DK" stands for Denmark?

[Polako]

DK is indeed Denmark.

But what I'm wondering is, what the hell is a porchmonkey?

[Rochefaton]

DK is indeed Denmark.

But what I'm wondering is, what the hell is a porchmonkey?

Thank you, Soul Pole. :) BTW, "porch monkey" is a derogatory term for black folks. You know, monkeys that sit on the porch all day...it's an old school racist term.

[Loki]

Polako, I am looking forward to seeing the "southern + western" grouping split. :)

[poiuytrewq0987]

Polako, I am looking forward to seeing the "southern + western" grouping split. :)

What does he consider to be Western? I assume it's France and Germany?

[Polako]

^ South + West Euro is a composite of everything that dominates west, south and even southeast of the Alps.

This analysis isn't designed for breaking that up. I'll do it in the South Euro runs.

[Frederick]

Day Tipper from 23andMe blog has also done maps for the components, wich I re-post now here, that people get an idea of where all these components spread around:

North-Central-Euro:
http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/5718/northcentraleuromap.jpg

North-East-Eurasian:
http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/1488/northeasteurasianmap.jpg

South+West Euro:
http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/3538/southwesteuromap.jpg

North-Atlantic:
http://img851.imageshack.us/img851/1123/northatlanticmap.jpg

Sub-Saharan:
http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/7632/subsaharanmap.jpg

Baltic:
http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/7821/balticmap.jpg

........

My personal results:

North-Central: 39.30% (28.52% is German average)
Sout+West Euro: 22.76% (20.03% is German average)
Baltic 22.61% (16.48% is German average)
North-Atlantik: 15.33% (34.86% is German average)
North-East-Eurasian: 0%
Sub Saharan: 0%

Cheers :coffee:

[Sikeliot]

Sub-Saharan:
http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/7632/subsaharanmap.jpg


I agree that Sub-Saharan is highest in Iberia (for Europe) but the map makes it look like Iberians are just as SSA as North Africans. :eek:

[Frederick]

I agree that Sub-Saharan is highest in Iberia (for Europe) but the map makes it look like Iberians are just as SSA as North Africans. :eek:

Well, the software that Day Tripper used is interpolating things between the points.

Imagine everything between points as "fantasy" of the software. :lightbul:

The Subsaharan blopp is cold stopped by the low value at the French spot.
But towards Africa, there is nothing to stop it while the Spanish spot has the highest Subsaharan from all spots in the map. :wink

[Oreka Bailoak]

I averaged my ancestry (about 3/4UK and 1/4DE) in the parentheses.

North + Central European 0.18581 (.395)
North + East Eurasian 0.010554 (.001)
South + West European 0.197168 (.158)
North Atlantic 0.497785 (.395)
Sub-Saharan 0.00001 (.00001)
Baltic 0.108674 (.0655)

Wonder why my North + Central is so low compared to the avg.

[Polako]

^ A sign of strong Celtic (West British or Irish) ancestry IMO.

[Ibericus]

I agree that Sub-Saharan is highest in Iberia (for Europe) but the map makes it look like Iberians are just as SSA as North Africans. :eek:
The average is alsmot 0% I believe

[Loki]

^ A sign of strong Celtic (West British or Irish) ancestry IMO.

Yeah, and I seem to be the opposite. I have strong North/Central (Germanic?) and South/West (who knows what that is??), but relatively little North Atlantic (Irish). Actually surprisingly low, much lower than the ancestral populations where I am sourced from. :confused: So I'm pretty much a North-South mix with not much inbetween ...

[Loki]

The average is alsmot 0% I believe

I have the second-highest SSA admixture in this group, beaten only by a Spaniard. :p ;)

[Agrippa]

Doesn't the fact, that a primarily South Western sample being used distort things too much?

As for a clear demarcation one needs to use South Eastern European samples too I'd say, otherwise these specifically SEE components might be just split up between the others in a rather unrepresentative manner?

[Polako]

I'm getting lots of e-mails about this issue (also from disgruntled Southern Europeans who aren't being run regulalry).

I might try and combine the two Euro tests into one tonight, and see what happens.

[Barreldriver]

Day Tripper at ABF was kind enough to do a similarity chart for my results, my top match is Canada, second the United States. My top European match is Ireland, given that I'm mostly English by ancestry I'm surprised by the closeness to Ireland, either my Irish ancestors had a stronger genetic legacy than they typically should or my English ancestors are mostly pre-Germanic invasion. The German score seems a bit too high as well since I'm not even a full quarter German. The UK is close but I would have thought it to have been first between UK, Ireland and Germany since I'm about half English derived. I'm wondering if the Canadians I'm similar to are mostly English and given that I do have recent English-Canadian relatives/ancestors (great grandmother immigrant) and such that my score is biased towards that showing that I'm genetically more similar to those English-Canadians than to UK English.

http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k438/ragnarok1227/US83Chartbasedonjune9data.jpg

[Rochefaton]

Interesting chart, Barrel. You are still more similar to the Brits than most Americans that Day Tripper has made a chart for. The others' values do not go below 10.

The two of us seem to be more similar to certain European groups than the others, for whatever reason. My similarity to the British is around 2 on my chart. :lol:

[Barreldriver]

Interesting chart, Barrel. You are still more similar to the Brits than most Americans that Day Tripper has made a chart for. Most of the others' values do not go below 10.

Badge of honor eh? :D


The two of us seem to be more similar to certain European groups than the others, for whatever reason. My similarity to the British is around 2 on my chart. :lol:

Me thinks recent immigrant ancestors are to thank.

[Imperivm]

North + Central European 35%
North East Eurasian = 0%
South + West European (Basque/Sardinian) = 27%
North Atlantic 35%
Sub-Saharan = 0%
Baltic = 3%

I think this is more realistic, although I' still quite surprised by the Baltic score. Karl said that it's probably linked to the Scandinavians having Baltic admixture. It seems very feasible, really.

[poiuytrewq0987]

North + Central European 35%
North East Eurasian = 0%
South + West European (Basque/Sardinian) = 27%
North Atlantic 35%
Sub-Saharan = 0%
Baltic = 3%

I think this is more realistic, although I' still quite surprised by the Baltic score. Karl said that it's probably linked to the Scandinavians having Baltic admixture. It seems very feasible, really.

Nice, I'm 34% Scandinavian then.

[Imperivm]

I think I need something explained to me. That is, why when current geneticists say three-quarters of the population of the British Isles directly descends from the Basques and has little admixture from the migrations/invasions of different stock why do I, and other Britons score 20-50% North Central European?

I for instance score 35% North + Central European.

:confused:

[Imperivm]

Nice, I'm 34% Scandinavian then.

How so?

[poiuytrewq0987]

I think I need something explained to me. That is, why when current geneticists say three-quarters of the population of the British Isles directly descends from the Basques and has little admixture from the migrations/invasions of different stock why do I, and other Britons score 20-50% North Central European?

I for instance score 35% North + Central European.

:confused:

Because of Anglo-Saxon invaders? :lightbul:

[poiuytrewq0987]

How so?

That thing you said about Karl suggesting that Baltic admixture might have come from the Scandinavians. If so then I am 34% Scandinavian (Baltic). :D

[Rochefaton]

I think I need something explained to me. That is, why when current geneticists say three-quarters of the population of the British Isles directly descends from the Basques and has little admixture from the migrations/invasions of different stock why do I, and other Britons score 20-50% North Central European?

I for instance score 35% North + Central European.

:confused:

Because they are/were of the old belief that Y-DNA R1b = paleolithic Basque-like Europeans. I haven't heard someone claim what you stated in years. That used to be the accepted theory around 2006. A lot of studies have came out since then and the popular opinion has changed.

If looking at autosomal results, it is easy to see that the notion of the Brits being 75% paleolithic and similar to the Basques is absurd.

[Imperivm]

Because they are/were of the old belief that Y-DNA R1b = paleolithic Basque-like Europeans. I haven't heard someone claim what you stated in years. That used to be the accepted theory around 2006. A lot of studies have came out since then and the popular opinion has changed.

If looking at autosomal results, it is easy to see that the notion of the Brits being 75% paleolithic and similar to the Basques is absurd.

It seems I'm about five years too late then! :embarrassed

[Polako]

Whoops, last night's analysis was a flop. I ran the whole thing on the wrong markers by mistake. I'll re-run everything tonight. Apologies.